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WACO YMF

Old 02-15-2007, 08:50 PM
  #1326
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: RC Outlaw

SB
Thanks turkey My YMF3 is over 20 years old , never been in the air and you have me re doing it. We think we have done a good job building when we were young then thing change and we need more detail

spelling That never changes with age
Never been in the air????? And you call me a Turkey????? That's okay Pigeon, I probably wouldn't have taken the time to make all the changes 20 years ago either. Let's see some pictures.

I finished building the H-stab tonight, and did a dummy set-up on the controllable incidence. Looks like it will work extremely well. I just have to watch my end points, and may even utilize a servo slow box. It should enable me to nail every landing, and be able to fly the plane without any wierd pitch during flight. This also means no thrust adjustment will be needed (down anyway) and if you will check, the full scale plane does not use any down thrust, or right thrust in the engine setup either. [8D]

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

ps...Have you ever given any thought to becoming a Brother?
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Old 02-15-2007, 08:54 PM
  #1327
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Gaines,

2 160 twins??? Wonder if WACO ever thought of building a twin? Once you get the market cornered on the 160's, you will be Da Man!!

I don't know what prop you are planning to run, but with a Zinger 18 X 6, you should see somewhere in the 8500 plus range once it's broken in. That, Buddy is a ton of thrust. Not too much speed, but when you hit the gas, things happen.

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Old 02-15-2007, 09:21 PM
  #1328
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Brothers,

It dawned on me a few days ago, that we are resurrecting an old dead kit. I think that it would be fitting if we were to call this project the WACO Phoenix Project. Like the fabled bird of myth, this one is truly rising from it's own ashes to gracefully fly again. I honestly hope that in the years to come, when someone decides to build one of these, the plans and parts templates are available to them through the AMA plans service. I can think of nothing that would honor this group of Brothers more than to have been involved in making this a possibility. I am humbled by this prospect. Thank you all for all your efforts, and support.

Bill, AMA 4720
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Old 02-16-2007, 03:06 PM
  #1329
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Hey guys,

I didn't want to take the time to read all the way thruough this lengthy and informative thread to see if someone else had done this or not, but I have the Pico YMF-3 1/5th scale plans scanned as a PDF file and will gladly email it to interested parties.

If interested, please email me at clayrace24@earthlink.net.

Thanks,

Clay
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Old 02-16-2007, 09:32 PM
  #1330
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Thanks Clay...(I sent you a pm)

What is going on guys????? I haven't seen this thread so dead in forever..... don't tell me that you're tired of it so soon....?

Bill, AMa 4720
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Old 02-16-2007, 10:12 PM
  #1331
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Stick
When I get every thing loaded back on this PC after the last crash I will post Pics.
And I have been called every thing but a brother in my 70 yrs. Build for myself and others but not with some one. Live and learn always have a BACK UP[:@]
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Old 02-16-2007, 11:30 PM
  #1332
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Bill,
EVERYONE MUST BE BURNING THE MIDNIGHT OIL ON THEIR BUILDS




GEORGE
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Old 02-16-2007, 11:37 PM
  #1333
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Been a little busy. Finally, I'm gonna get a 17000 btu heat/pump window unit for my shop. HEAT!!! Gotta have HEAT! When it gets down to 55deg in the shop the glue dont flow and the fingers dont work. My son and his family just moved back to town so I'm getting in some quality grand kid time. And on top of that, clearing a fence line with the chain saw to put in some field fence. The hogs are starting to get destructive and wife person wants it stopped. When the templates get here I'll start cutting them out so they'll be ready when I finish dos cubs.
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Old 02-17-2007, 09:55 AM
  #1334
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Bill,

Has any thought been given to making more of the plastic parts like the tank cover for the top wing or the aileron covers? I know you don't care for the aileron covers and are thinking about how to simulate the metal corrugations another way, but how about the tank cover?
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:36 AM
  #1335
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I've also been giving it some thought. Thiis is what I've considered:

I have some thin (thinner than 1/64in) styrene sheet. It is very flexible and would work, but I am afraid it might warp or bubble when out in the sun a while. Otherwise, it is very lightweight and smooth, and would look like aluminum sheeting when painted. The other downside is that the underlying surface has to be perfect or any lumps, bumps and other irregularities will show.

1/64 ply would also work, and I think be a better choice from the warpage standpoint. I doesn't follow compound curves very well, though, such as the rounded edge of the fuse at the cowl. If cut into panels and applied, it looks very good; the edges of the panels can be sanded to decrease the appearance of the edges where they overlap (on the WACO they aren't flush), and with a couple coats of primer and fine sanding, what little grain there is disappears and it also looks like metal sheeting. You can also paint a coat of finishing resin to help smooth the surface.

Then there's this adhesive-backed metal (aluminum) tape that sheet metal HVAC ducts are sealed with. It is very thin, and can be burnished to take all the wrinkles out and make it conform to curves. The adhesive is pretty aggressive, it doesn't come off very well once applied, and can be painted over or clearcoated, which would help prevent the edges from ever lifting from fuel seepage under the edges, etc. It is pretty soft, though, and you can indent the burnished surface with your fingernail, aven when applied on a hardwood subsurface; this would eventually collect a lot of small dings from routine handling, I'm afraid. It otherwise has a beautiful finish when burnished down, but would also show blemishes from the subsurface.

Very similar to the tape is Flite Metal. I have no personal experience with it, but from what I have read and seen, looks to be a harder material than the tape, maybe a slight bit thicker, so maybe the dings would be less.

I am planning a combination of the 1/64 ply and the aluminum tape for my project. I'll prime and sand the ply, then overcoat and sand with finishing resin. For the ring at the front of the fuse, I will either use the tape, or make a ring of fiberglass and try to get it as smooth as possible.

As for the aileron ribbing, I have some tiny (0.80in) styrene angle stock from Evergreen Hobbies, and will mock up a surface of one aileron and see how it looks. Even at that small size, it may be too large. I have heard Stickbuilder say something about gluing string down and sanding it after a resin coat, or something like that. I may give it a try, too. If I can't get anything to look suitable, I may just can the idea of ribbed ailerons.

Here's what the aluminum tape can look like when applied and burnished, used it for the metal leading edge on a display prop for the WACO:
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:50 AM
  #1336
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Default RE: WACO YMF

H-stab is glued up. Doing the pivot tubes (ala STICKBUILDER) for adjustable incidence this weekend. All elevator parts are cut as well.
Remember, if doing the adjustable incidence thing, that you must have functional flying wires on the tail. They will have to be attached as on the prototype, at the hinge lines of the elevator and rudder.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:51 AM
  #1337
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Hey, I am alive and well I read this forum every day. I just do not want to add alot of excess threads that clutter (no offence to you all who are off topic reply maniacs) so do not expect to hear from me much. But I am here nevertheless.
If my replies do not add to a forums topic directly I use private emails.
\
Anyway, I am waiting to get those tracings from Stickbuilder to see if I can do cad layouts from them. I also want CHisMH to add additional info about the mismatch between the tracings and the print he was talking about 2 pages back. I never measured my Pica parts against the print when I was building. For all I know Pica's own die cuts do not line up with their prints.
It is a builders kit in the truest sense. Filled with lots of inaccuracies and mistakes that you get to figure out for yourself. Even on a well layed out kit, I never build exactly to print anyway. I have to change something to prove to myself that I am wiser than the kit designer.

I just got my Wendell Hostetler 1/5 (105 inch span) span plans on the Lockheed Sirius. My first set of scratch builder plans. Holy cow, will I have to figure a ton of stuff out for myself. Nice plans but brief on detail descriptions and no iso views of framing. If this is a typical scratch builders plan my respect for scratch builders just went way up. I will be using his plans to make my own custom plans. I am going to bash these plans into a 1931 Lockheed Orion anyway.
Plan bashing....... I have done kit bashing, this is going to be my first plan bashing.

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder

Thanks Clay...(I sent you a pm)

What is going on guys????? I haven't seen this thread so dead in forever..... don't tell me that you're tired of it so soon....?

Bill, AMa 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:39 AM
  #1338
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Khodges,

Nice detail on the prop. Doesn't the Hartzell wood prop have rounded tips? Whoops, I see you have a Sensenich prop there. I may go with the Hamilton prop and make it nice and shinny (polished). On the tank I was thinking of the 1/64 ply and HVAC tape also. From a picture I saw somewhere, it looks like there were some raised shapes formed in the tank for stiffening (to reduce oil canning?) and around the filler caps. Maybe chart tape laid out on the plywood and then covered with the HVAC tape would give the correct illusion (thats what we are, aren't we, illusionists). I think there were exposed straps that held the tank in place also. And then you need to add the exposed fuel lines, inspection covers, etc.
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Old 02-17-2007, 12:47 PM
  #1339
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Default RE: WACO YMF

The aluminum tape works. A friend did a TF giant P-51 that he modified into a B model and covered some of it in aluminum tape. Looked fine to me.
Edwin
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Old 02-17-2007, 02:07 PM
  #1340
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I still have some old Gestetner/Roneo? skins from the earlier days making multiple copies of handouts. They are nice thin aluminium, never used them, saved for "just in case".

I sometimes fantasise about making a machine to corrugate them to make a scale finish on a JU 52.




old git - - - - - - - -aka John L.

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Old 02-17-2007, 04:23 PM
  #1341
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Well not going as far as you people are but here is what I have.
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Old 02-17-2007, 04:37 PM
  #1342
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And What I am doing!
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Old 02-17-2007, 05:48 PM
  #1343
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Lookin' real good, Outlaw. The thin ply where the sheetmetal goes is nice, it looks like I had hoped. The other thing I like is how you faired the underside of the lower wing. I need to write that on my list of things so I don't forget it.

I got the plans from Clay for the YMF-3, they are great! I'm thinking of having them enlarged 125% when I get them printed, and building the plane at 1/4 scale some day. There's just too damn many planes, and too little time. I just bought the BUSA 1/4 scale SPAD XIII this week, adding it to the list of thing to build next ( Fokker D-VII, Sopwith Pup, Nieuport 11, and SE-5a) all sitting in boxes in the shop.
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Old 02-17-2007, 09:39 PM
  #1344
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Default RE: WACO YMF

The 1/64th ply for the fuel tanks is probably the better idea. It is actually a little thin, but should work okay. Personally, the next one will have them made from sheet aluminum (roofing flashing 12" wide rolls cheap) you can cut this stuff with your hobby shears, and once adhered will take tons of abuse. I may even polish mine.

Bill, AMA 4720
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:30 PM
  #1345
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Bill,

Hadn't thought about the roof flashing, thanks for that idea. Do you happen to have a photo of the kit tank piece? I have a picture of the bottom of the fuel tank on a enclosed rear cockpit WACO (not sure of the model) that shows ribs on the bottom of the tank. I got the photo from Aircraft Photo Database Search http://www.russellw.com/photoalbum/photo_query_form.asp . It has many close up photos of different WACOs, but just a few of the YMF.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:44 PM
  #1346
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Default RE: WACO YMF

For a fairly good shot of the top of the wing showing the tank go to page 36 of this thread (post #879).

Bill Hogue
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:13 PM
  #1347
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Bill (WacoOne),

Thanks, I knew I had seen a photo of the top but just couldn't find it. Thanks again.
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:30 PM
  #1348
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You guys want detail shots of the YMF Classic, I got lots. I thought about the aluminum flashing material, but didn't include it above; what is your take, Stickbuilder, on the weight of that stuff as compared to 1/64 ply? I have a whole roll of it, and it doesn't come off if you use contact cement to apply it. I also have several sheets of lithoplate.

Skylark, this is the prop I modelled. Most of the new Classics have this Sensenich.
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:58 PM
  #1349
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Khodges,

Like I said, good job on the prop. I'll send a PM.
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Old 02-18-2007, 12:21 AM
  #1350
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Gentleman,
for those who may be interested, EBAY has a 60" YMF up for bid
item #180084576402




George
WACO Brotherhood # 5
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