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Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

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Old 05-01-2006, 08:58 PM
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Tommygun
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Default Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

I found something the other day I'd totally forgotten about in my parent's basement while I was over visiting- my fathers old 5 channel Kraft Series Seventy-Seven radio, complete with all the servos and reciever (One is a Heath kit servo!) Anyway, I took it home, dusted it off, went through it and noticed it has a plug identical to the ones used on newer Futabas. My 8UAPS buddy cord will plug right into it. Is there any way to use it as a buddy box, or with a flight simulator? As I remember, we would charge it through that port; does it have other functions as well? The battery seems to be completely dead; I doubt it would recharge since it was made like 30 years ago. What does the series number mean, is that that year it was made? How can you replace the battery; it's a special made unit kinda deal. Up until the basement got major water a couple of year ago, we had the original box and everything for it. What do you guys normally do with these old radios, display them next to a vintage plane at fun flys or something?
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Old 05-02-2006, 06:36 AM
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Mike Denest
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

The Series 77 is an AM modulation radio marketed in 1977. Kraft radios were identified from 1973 on by the last two digits of the year they were produced. You will not be able to use it as a buddy box with your Super 8. The plug at the bottom of the transmitter has two functions; charging and a buddy box connection with another Kraft transmitter, but only if you have the momentary on switch mounted on the transmitter. I don't know about converting it for sim use, probably not worth it. The transmitter should have a plug in RF module, which can be narrow banded. The module will either be mounted on the top of the transmitter or mounted inside the case. The receiver should be replaced, any narrow band AM reciever will work. SR Batteries sells a replacement pack for the transmitter but it's very expensive. I get a generic 700ma cell with solder tabs from Batteries America for about $3.95 each. You will have to open the transmitter to get access to the battery box. Open the box and you will see the eight cells wired in a series/parallel circuit. Make a diagram of the wiring before you de-solder the wires. The airborne battery uses the same cells. It's really not hard to do. Radio South can narrow band the transmitter and match a narrow band AM receiver to it for around $50 or so. The servos will be a bit "sticky" and falter when you first apply power but as you exercise them, they should work just fine. If you decide not to mess with the radio, Ebay is a good place to sell it as there's always a good Kraft market there. You didn't mention if it is a two stick or single stick radio. Single stick Kraft radios get a higher price vs. the two stick. There are no programming functions, you will have to set up your airplane the old fashioned way: position your servos for the direction you want and adjust throws by pushrod length and connection on the output arm.

Bottom line: The Kraft radios are still very good and very functional, especially if you decide to use it in a vintage airplane. Have fun, I hope this information helps you.
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Old 05-02-2006, 08:52 AM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Cool, I didn't know you could still use one for flight. I don't think I'd get rid of it; its the very thing that started me with the addiction years ago and it's kind of an heirloom. Is there a way use the original reciever, or does that option go away when converting to narrowband?
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Old 05-02-2006, 10:06 AM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

If the radio is on the no longer used frequencies (72.08, 72.96, etc.) the original receiver cannot be used as your radio must conform to 1991 standards using any one of the channels 11 through 60. If the transmitter is on any of these channels currently in use, you "could" use the existing receiver but you will have to grab the adjacent channel pins off the board in order to fly (highly not recommended, FWIW. Your club mates will think highly of you [:@]). Find a narrow band AM receiver and be done with it. In short, if you decide to fly the radio, upgrade the transmitter to narrow band standards and match a narrow band receiver to it. KMI, Futaba, Hitec, FMA, Ace narrow band receivers will work. I'm not sure about Airtronics though. Maybe someone here can answer that.
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Old 05-02-2006, 06:28 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

any am reciever will work with the kraft am module if you look hard enough you can find a fm module and then you can use current jr or airtronics shift recievers as well as servos.there are kraft narrow band rx out there as well.I have had 3 radios serviced the past year by radio south since aquiring them used and while the cost is more than a new radio I prefer the kraft 7z tx and the mark lll 7cs never had any interference problems with kraft since i started flying in 1971,only crashes i had were either pilot error or batteriers going dead in the flight pack and once in the tx,this was before cycklers were available.
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Old 05-02-2006, 10:19 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Gang,
Have here on the desk:
KRAFT 7 channel AM RX " KPR7KB" 72.830MHz
Be of any help to anyone ? Am sure the price would be right !
Don-Basehor, Ks
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Old 05-03-2006, 04:40 AM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Don, I would like to purchase your Kraft 7 channel RX (have a gold stickered TX on the same frequency). Please PM me. Thanks.
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Old 05-03-2006, 06:15 AM
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Mike Denest
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

This is good to know. I've managed to gather several Kraft FM modules and receivers which are somewhat scarce. Can you provide some model numbers for the JR and Airtronics stuff?


ORIGINAL: oscar2005

any am reciever will work with the kraft am module if you look hard enough you can find a fm module and then you can use current jr or airtronics shift recievers as well as servos.there are kraft narrow band rx out there as well.I have had 3 radios serviced the past year by radio south since aquiring them used and while the cost is more than a new radio I prefer the kraft 7z tx and the mark lll 7cs never had any interference problems with kraft since i started flying in 1971,only crashes i had were either pilot error or batteriers going dead in the flight pack and once in the tx,this was before cycklers were available.
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Old 05-03-2006, 03:16 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

I’ve been flying my Kraft Series 77 KPS7C seven channel for decades. The Series 77 was upgraded to the new channels in the late 80s and narrow band certified. I still use the Kraft 77 transmitter and a modern flight pack for the control system for my Howard Engineering Kwik Fli III.

For the flight packs I use Hitec RCD dual conversion AM receivers, the Kraft switch harness and the Kraft battery packs. The Futaba servos work the best because the output arms can be turned to compensate for the difference between the Kraft center pulse width and the Futaba centering. I do not know of any other servo that has output arms that change the center position when rotated.

The 7C has a wonderful quality feel and balance that cannot found in modern radios.
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Old 05-03-2006, 05:31 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

as far as the jr recievers any fm or even rcd will work if they have the jr shift.model numbers that i know are r-600 6 ch and the r-700 7 channel the older rx also if they say abc&w system like the ner-327x are narrow band fm rx.since i have jr transmitters i have not gotten into the airtronics.just remember that am rx should be tuned to the module or transmitter.I do the same with the fm rx and modules also but some say it is not needed but for $40 versus the total cost of a plane and equipment i call it a small price to pay.i enen do it with my current futaba units if i buy a used reciever but that is just me.
here are some of my current working kraft tx and rx and servos waiting to be installed in a j&j eyeball.also the kraft retract amplifier with one retract the other three are in the vertigo ll
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Old 05-03-2006, 07:30 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

HIr/cer !
You do have a PM
Don-Basehor, Ks
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Old 05-05-2006, 09:14 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Hello everyone. I just dusted off my Kraft 4 ch Sport Series radio on frequency 72.96. I see from the post that this radio is no longer legal (FCC-wise) to fly with anymore... I bought this radio new in 1979 and was used very little. The battery packs are shot and I only have 3 servos.

1) Is it worth upgrading it to be legal to fly on a club field?
2) Where can I get replacement Ni-Cd batteries?
3) Is it worth putting this money into it or buy a new radio? It sounds like a new radio would be the easiest route but I wanted to make sure before I Ebay'd it away...

Thanks in advance.
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Old 05-06-2006, 12:11 AM
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Mike Denest
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Auflyer86,
See my post #2 above. It has all the information.


ORIGINAL: auflyer86

Hello everyone. I just dusted off my Kraft 4 ch Sport Series radio on frequency 72.96. I see from the post that this radio is no longer legal (FCC-wise) to fly with anymore... I bought this radio new in 1979 and was used very little. The battery packs are shot and I only have 3 servos.

1) Is it worth upgrading it to be legal to fly on a club field?
2) Where can I get replacement Ni-Cd batteries?
3) Is it worth putting this money into it or buy a new radio? It sounds like a new radio would be the easiest route but I wanted to make sure before I Ebay'd it away...

Thanks in advance.
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Old 05-06-2006, 10:41 AM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Mike,

Thanks for the info. I assumed it did not apply to me since my radio is a sport series. The battery pack shapes are different than what you describe. However, since I now know what they are 700mah and are 2/3 sub c, I can assemble new cells into the same configuration.

Also, I found a website that has them for $1.12 each with discounts for orders of 20 or more. The website is:

http://www.batterieswholesale.com/pr...3-sc-700-p.htm

Thanks again and I can't wait to get back into this.
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Old 05-06-2006, 10:56 AM
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Mike Denest
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Hey thanks for the link. That's a lower price over Batteries America. I'm not sure what the Sport Series looks like inside as all my radios are the Series XX models. So I assumed that you opened up the transmitter and see what you have. I say that as there are several 2/3 C cells available that will not fit in the battery box.

For years I thought that the Sport Series could not be narrow banded but recently I purchased a three channel Sport Series brick radio that had been gold stickered. Call Radio South before you get into it to make sure.
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Old 05-19-2006, 01:14 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Guru's,
I still have my Kraft KP7C (Series 1979) radio including the original receiver with plug-in RF module. I also have the !QUOT!miniature!QUOT! 7 channel receiver as well as various Kraft servos and switch harness'. I have always liked the 'feel' of the transmitter; mine has the dual rate options and a roll button that was popular in Pattern flying back then. What was really neat about this radio was that it also came with a small cord that you could plug between your aircraft charging jack and transmitter, then read the receiver battery voltage on the ESV mounted alongside the RF output meter on the transmitter.

My question is, does anyone know what the wiring diagram is for the buddy box/charging connector? My transmitter has the momentary switch for trainer purposes and I would like to utilize this transmitter in conjunction with a 4 channel Hi Tec FM radio installed in my son's trainer. I found a website (http://www.welwyn.demon.co.uk/buddy.htm) detailing various trainer cord connections, but of course the Kraft is too old for general interest. Any thoughts on this?

Thank you for any information you can offer,

Paul
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Old 05-20-2006, 06:57 AM
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oscar2005
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

you may want to contact Tony Stillman at radio south,he may be able to help you out
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Old 05-20-2006, 09:08 AM
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Mike Denest
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

You didn't mention if your module and receiver are AM or FM. An AM transmitter may not work with a FM trainer transmitter. My suggestion is to get on ebay and purchase a Series XX transmitter that would work with yours, you will not need a module for it. Kraft sold a buddy box cable that is occasionally available on ebay also. Failing that, you could open up your transmitter and identify the wires and position in the plug and make your own. Let us know what you find out.
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Old 05-20-2006, 12:15 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

I have the attached drawing of a trainer cord for Kraft. I mde a cord about 14 years ago connecting a bicentennial to a series 79. I think I used this drawing and regular din conectors. I hope this helps, oh though you may not be able to connect different transmitters if they transmit the control channels in diffrent order. If anything you could use it to attach kraft to a flight simulator.
One other thin not all din plugs label their pins in the same order, so use the diagram for location.
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Old 05-21-2006, 06:19 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

What you can also do with your Kraft radio (or any of the other older radios EK logictrol, ProLine, etc) is convert it to MicroStar 2000 and have yourself a computer radio with LCD display and all the latest functions. Check it out http://www.mstar2k.com/
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Old 05-23-2006, 05:00 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

WHY,nothing nostalgic about that.If i want to use a computer radio i have several to choose from jr 652,futapa 9vap,8uap,7aups.the old transmiters can easily meet the 1991 specs it was the single conversion am recievers that could not.some of the later kraft sets as well as pro line had servo reversing,dual rates and snap roll buttons.if you needed mixing kraft had a elevan/flaperon mechanical mixer for kps-12 servos.using it in a twin since 1973 works fine.sometime there are too many switches and things not really needed.if you set up a plane correctly mechanically there is no need for 10 model memmory etc.i have several recievers tuned to each of my kraft transmitters and never have to worry about what model i am flying as they are all trimed withthe servos centered and the throws are all correctly set by either the servo wheel or control horn length.no offense meant but why ruin a vintage radio,unless it was just a parts radio when you have cheap used computer transmitters available.
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Old 06-09-2006, 04:54 PM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?


Great information. I still have my radios from the early 60's thorugh the late 70's (mostly Kraft) and may want to have one of them modified. I would offer, however, that the best modification to an EK Logictrol would be performed by an auto crusher.

bob



ORIGINAL: apteryx

What you can also do with your Kraft radio (or any of the other older radios EK logictrol, ProLine, etc) is convert it to MicroStar 2000 and have yourself a computer radio with LCD display and all the latest functions. Check it out http://www.mstar2k.com/
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Old 06-10-2006, 06:34 AM
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Mike Denest
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?


ORIGINAL: oscar2005

WHY,nothing nostalgic about that.If i want to use a computer radio i have several to choose from jr 652,futapa 9vap,8uap,7aups.the old transmiters can easily meet the 1991 specs it was the single conversion am recievers that could not.some of the later kraft sets as well as pro line had servo reversing,dual rates and snap roll buttons.if you needed mixing kraft had a elevan/flaperon mechanical mixer for kps-12 servos.using it in a twin since 1973 works fine.sometime there are too many switches and things not really needed.if you set up a plane correctly mechanically there is no need for 10 model memmory etc.i have several recievers tuned to each of my kraft transmitters and never have to worry about what model i am flying as they are all trimed withthe servos centered and the throws are all correctly set by either the servo wheel or control horn length.no offense meant but why ruin a vintage radio,unless it was just a parts radio when you have cheap used computer transmitters available.

Oacar is absolutley right. Regardless of radio type whether Kraft or microprocessor, you first have to set up servo neutrals and throws mechanically. For microprocessor radios, servo direction, end points and other adjustments should be kept at a minimum to make it easy. Mechanically trim the aircraft then go to the bells and whistles to fine tune. For everyday flying, nothing special is needed. Heli's, unlimited class sailplanes and scale models certainly benefit from computer radios but for your Ugly Stik, KISS is best. IMO, gutting a Kraft to install a M*2K is not worth it. Marv Jensen of Jensen Jet Models will set you up with everything you need for the Microstar.

Hey BobtheNuke, that EK would be better off in someone's collection! Turn it loose on ebay.
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Old 08-17-2007, 01:34 AM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

Well that was a real interesting read. I have just decided to get back into some modeling after being away from it for over 20 years and found my old Kraft Sport 5 ..AM 27.045 that I bought new in 1970. The both battery packs are dead and will need replacing and then I should be able to get it up and running again. from memory, the unit had a great feel to it and the sticks were so positive and centered nicely. This unit was purchased from the Kraft agent in Australia as at that time there were no Agents for Kraft here in New Zealand. I flew this unit in a Moonglow with an OS 60 Goldhead up the front. Also had a King Cobra and a Das Ugly Stik using the same gear...Oh them were the dayze.

Cheers, Bill
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Old 08-17-2007, 01:47 AM
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Default RE: Okay, who's the Kraft radio guru?

KP7C, Bicentennial, good stuff.
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