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Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Old 07-25-2003, 12:47 AM
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David Cutler
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Default Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Well, I flew the Vector Flight Edge 540 at last!

Very impressive:-

The YS 110 was awesome! Started first time , didn't need any adjustment of the slow speed needle and after putting a couple of tanks through it, flew straight away with no problems. Amazing thrust . . at least twice the weight of the plane!!

The plane flies straight and true, although I have put 1 degree of down thrust on the engine, which, after trimming for level flight at half throttle (all thats needed with that engine!) it floats and balloons a lot on landing. I reckon I'm going to take the downthrust off completely.

Lands very easily, with absolutely no trace of tip stalling. It feels like that wing is extremely efficient, and handles slow flight very predictably.

Didn't do any aerobatics this time, as I just wanted to get the trims right and the engine settled.

Very pitch sensitivity indeed. I had only 40% dual rates with 60% exponential on the elevator and it was a bit of a handful! Roll sensitivity (with the same rates) was a lot less sensitive, so I will have to, adjust for that.

Overall impression was extremely good. In spite of the pitch sensitivity, it was a very relaxing plane to fly, as it did exactly what it was asked to do with no surprises. The combination of awesome power with sensitive elevator is, um, exciting!

Aerobatics next flight! I'll come back to this thread for that report!

-David C.
Old 07-25-2003, 04:59 PM
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Calflyer
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Default Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Congratulations David. Excellent to see you have yours flying. It is a great airplane, and the wing is truly exceptional in its flying. The airplane does seem pitch sensitive at first but when you get used to it, everything else will feel sluggish. Airframe design and rigidity contributes a lot to how it handles. Its like after you drive a BMW, most other cars feel damped and mushy! Have a great time as I am having with this bird!
Old 07-25-2003, 06:24 PM
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Default Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Hey Calfler,
I am glad to know I am not the only bimmerphile.
Old 07-25-2003, 10:59 PM
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Default Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Hey Zope, absolutely! Id say push up to the window!
Old 07-31-2003, 03:17 AM
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David Cutler
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Default Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Flew the Edge again today, opening the throttle out this time!

WOW! Even at half throttle this is FAST! It seems so 'long legged' on a fly past.

. . and flies about as straight as is possible.

I have reduced the elevator rates (as it was very pitch sensitive on the first flight) and, even at low rates indeed, the loop diameter is very small, with no tendency to snap.

Still doesn't want to come down when landing, so I have taken to landing it like a trainer, at much slower speed!

The vertical power-on snaps are awesome, with the large rudder having a lot of effect on the shape of the maneuver. It snaps fast but very flat; just like a full size plane.

Rolls are very axial.

Knife edges are ridiculously easy as there doesn't seem to be any tendency to tuck in.

Cuban 8s are deliciously rooouuuund and graceful.

Hammerheads and tailslides are very controllable when the plane stops at the top of the climb.

I did a fairly low fly-past and chopped the throttle in front of me. On idle I pulled vertical and opened the throttle and it shot straight up with absolutely no fuss!

I couldn't get it to tip stall during a high slow fly-past, heading into the 5 mph wind and pulling more and more up elevator. When the stall arrives it simply sinks!

The most noticeable thing is the take off, which can only be described as graceful! It takes off so smoothly you hardly notice its in the air.

As for the YS110, I reckon I have available twice the weight of the plane in the thrust, and an idle that is rock solid.

More to come soon....

-David C.
Old 07-31-2003, 10:49 PM
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Default Vector Edge 540 - First flight

David, all I can say is that I agree with all you have mentioned. What an incredible machine the Vectorflight Edge is !! Almost seems what a perfect aerobatic airplane should be. Easy to fly, amazing slow speed controlability, yet awesome high speed, precision aerobatic capability, and the thing just doest want to stall unless told to. I have been doing precison 8 point rolls on this airplane, something which I could never do well on any airplane before. People keep asking me who makes it and get a kick when they find out it is actually made in North America, not China!
Old 09-25-2003, 08:35 PM
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Hi everybody,

David, I can't imagine how I missed your flight report after reading what I thought was everything else on the VF540. Must have missed it in the switch to the new format. Any, update time: My Edge arrived last week and WOW. The workmanship is exceptional. Took the fuselage, the cowl and one wing panel to the field Sat. Two of the Carden owners were impressed. Nice.

Now some questions:

1. I know I am exceeding the power envelope with a Saito 120, but it is all I have at the moment. Have you noticed anything of concern in the firewall area with your 100? I do not intend to do 3D, but rather fly the basic IMACC sequences and concentrate on becoming a better pilot with this plane. BTW I have also been talking with Cootertwo.

2. You mentioned taking the down thrust out. Did you do that? If so, are you now flying with everything a 0 degrees or is there still the recommended right thrust in?

3. Belly pan trimming. The instruction photo's seem to be a little unclear. Are the end pieces (bulkheads) supposed to be cut off? In looking at the supplemental trimming info on the site, it shows cutting them off for the Extra and the sukhoi, but I am a little unclear on the Edge. It looks to me like they could stay and but up against the bulkheads on the airframe.

4. Plastic tail fairing. If there were one recommendation I could make (and I did) this needs to be improved. I have had a couple of conversations with Sam at VF and they are looking into a couple of things. BTW, they are the best customer service outfit I have ever delt with on any type of product....period! What did you do here? I was thinking about cutting a bulkhead to match the one at the rear of the turtle deck and then sanding down 1/32" to allow the plastic to rest flush. Once all trimmed and glued in, it could be dressed up with one small piece of red covering. Thoughts? Also, did you reinforce with tri-stock on the top and bottom of the stab as suggested?

I am using the brass inserts you suggested for the cowl and the belly pan. I have made a dash with raised panel guages. The underside of the wing will be checked with 2 or 3 inch black squares for a black and white scheme. Once the ailerons have been installed, I will carry the black checks onto the red ailerons. That should look cool. I also checked (black/white trim sheet) the white areas on the tail surfaces. Plan to mount the engine inverted since I cannot bring myself to cut that pretty cowl. Any pics from you or Calflyer? Anything will help. Thanks guys.
Old 09-25-2003, 11:14 PM
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Hi John,

1. I know I am exceeding the power envelope with a Saito 120, but it is all I have at the moment. Have you noticed anything of concern in the firewall area with your 100? I do not intend to do 3D, but rather fly the basic IMACC sequences and concentrate on becoming a better pilot with this plane. BTW I have also been talking with Cootertwo.
The Saito 120 should be OK. I ended up fitting a YS110 in mine, which will pull a truck up Everest with ease, so your Saito 120, which is probably about the same power (ish!) would be great, especially if you are going to lean towards pattern, as opposed to 3D flying. The firewall is pretty strong so should be adequate. It sounds like a perfect match! I would suggest a 16x6 or 16x4 with it.

2. You mentioned taking the down thrust out. Did you do that? If so, are you now flying with everything a 0 degrees or is there still the recommended right thrust in?
I tried adjusting both right- and down- thrust, and ended up with just a little (around 1 degree) right thrust with no down thrust. It seems to be about right at all throttle settings.

3. Belly pan trimming. The instruction photo's seem to be a little unclear. Are the end pieces (bulkheads) supposed to be cut off? In looking at the supplemental trimming info on the site, it shows cutting them off for the Extra and the sukhoi, but I am a little unclear on the Edge. It looks to me like they could stay and but up against the bulkheads on the airframe.
I agree, the instructions are a bit vague. I actually modified my belly pan quite a lot. I glued a piece of 1/4 inch hard balsa inside the rear of the pan (so that it curved round the balsa, and acted as a solid former) and glued two pegs into it, which locate into two holes drilled in the former. Then, when you mount the pan, you slide the two pegs into the rear and bolt it down at the front, just behind the rear of the cowl. The pan length is then between the front face of the former and the back of the cowl when fitted. I also glued two pieces of balsa to the middle former to take two brass inserts to support the pan in the middle. It seems a pretty solid installation now. Incidentally, you can use the gap in this former to support the aileron leads to stop them fouling the servo arms inside. I’m amazed other planes don’t do this.

I agree about the plastic tail fairing, although I fitted it exactly as suggested, and providing you take your time cutting it to fit, it doesn't look too bad. I filled the gaps around the base of the fin (in the gap in the stab) with lots of epoxy and blocks of balsa, and fitted 2-56 wires from the bottom of the fuselage to the middle of the stabs for strength.

You are definitely going to enjoy this model! The pitch sensitivity is awesome, so don't give it too much elevator throw. It simply isn't needed and can induce a snap if too much. They fly as straight as an arrow, and have a cute way of taking off! They seem so majestic as they leave the ground!

David C.
Old 09-26-2003, 08:57 AM
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

David,

Thanks for the info. I would be interested in hearing what size washer or exactly what you used to achieve the 1 degree of right thrust mentioned. The belly pan mods sound very interesting. Any pics? That would really be helpful. I think this is going to be a great plane too. From all of the reports, I am really anxious to complete it, but will take my time.

I forgot to ask you about hinging the ailerons. Sam at VF sent me the supplemental instructions about how this should be done. Since this is the first time I have hinged in this manner, I was wondering if this gave you any difficulty. Was also thinking about using Robart Pins.......

Thanks,
John
Old 09-26-2003, 09:18 AM
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

John,

To get the thrust angle, I used thrust plates like these:-

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXE953&P=7

... from a local hobby store.

I used Robart hinge pins on every control surface. If you take reasonable care over drilling the holes accurately, and work Vaseline into the hinge before inserting them, they go in pretty easily. There's a lot of 'meat' to drill into, the only slight problem being that the ailerons are the top-hinging layout, which means the pins create a little bump on the top edge. You angle the pins down into the aileron but the hinge pin still fits on the sharp edge of the aileron and therefore leaves a little bump.

I will try to take some pics of my belly pan layout and post them later today.

The only other thing I would mention is that it's worthwhile taking your time over fitting the wing joiner. You must take into account the fact that the fuselage tapers slightly, (downwards) so there's a 1/8 inch gap between the underside of the wing and the fuselage side, while it's flush against the top of the wing halves so measure the spacer that aligns the position of the ply joiners against the top of the wing.

David C.
Old 09-26-2003, 03:14 PM
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

O.K.,

I was feeling pretty confident until I read this last post. If you are able to include pics of the hinge points too, that would be great. Did you drill at 1/16" below the top of both the trailing edge of the wing and the leading edge of the aileron?

The last paragraph about the wing joiner has me a little anxious. Mind you, I have read the instructions and played with it, but have not yet trimmed anything or glued any of the joiner assembly. I am totally confused on the point of measuring the "spacer that aligns the position of the ply joiners against the top of the wing". Are you referring to the spacer that is epoxied in with dowels? Need more clairification on that one. ????????????
Old 09-26-2003, 03:29 PM
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

Hi John,

Don't worry! There are more problems with the language trying to explain it than the actual work involved!

The hinge points are easy, even on the ailerons. Drill a small pilot hole (1/16 will do) in the right position, (very slightly below the edge, so that the covering is still undisturbed)then enlarge it with the 1/8 drill necessary for the hinge. The hinges don't have to be straight when the aileron is straight, so you can angle them down to be in the meatiest part of the wood.

The wing joiner...

It says in the instructions to make a balsa or ply spacer to bolt to the wing joiner so that when you slide them into each wing half, the wings are the right distance apart so that the fuselage fits between them. Make sure, that the length of this spacer is the width of the fuselage at it's widest point (the top of the hole the joiner goes through) and not the bottom of the hole, as the fuselage tapers down a bit. You can see this if you look at the square hole each side of the fuselage.

You discard the spacer after gluing.

Erm, I'm not sure if that was obvious either!

Come back if you are still confused. I will try to show it with pics.

-David C.
Old 09-26-2003, 05:01 PM
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

A ha! Now I know what you are talking about!!! However, I was pretty sure that the spacer was irrelevant in the description of theprocess earlier. I will make sure I read all of this again when I get ready to do the wings.

After your other message, I went to the robart site and ptinted their hinge how-to's. If you have not seen this give it a look. It made a lot of sense. Did you make the little grooves with a file or exacto for the actual hinge point? I think the recommend it be done on the surface that moves.

David, I appreciate all of your help. The belly pan and hinge point pics would still be great at some point over the weekend if you get hte time.

Regards,
John
Old 09-26-2003, 05:21 PM
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David Cutler
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Default RE: Vector Edge 540 - First flight

After your other message, I went to the robart site and ptinted their hinge how-to's. If you have not seen this give it a look. It made a lot of sense. Did you make the little grooves with a file or exacto for the actual hinge point? I think the recommend it be done on the surface that moves.
Yes, the Robart website is excellent for lots of useful information.

The edges of the aileron are so thin that a very sharp knife is about the best way to make the grooves. It's a good idea to very carefully 'paint' the bare wood with very thinned out epoxy, before fitting the hinges (thinned with denatured alcohol, and making sure you don't fill the groove again!) and leave it for at least a day to set hard.

I will take some pics this evening and post them soon.

-DC

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