DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
08-20-2012, 12:47 PM
#1
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (17)
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Oviedo,
FL
Posts: 349
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
Last night I upgraded from 2.04 to 2.05 firmware on my DX8. This morning, when I set up my plane, powered up the transmitter, and then switched on the plane I noticed that the ailerons shifted to a very significant right roll position. Repeated power downs and power ups did not change anything. The right aileron kept returning to a significantly up position and the left down (they are on a "Y").
It is a relatively new set up and Ihad not yet adjusted all the mechanical linkages to trim with zero sub-trim and trim. I went into the sub-trim menu and adjusted the aileron center position to mechanical level the ailerons. Due to the mechanical trim not yet being correct I needed to make a large reduction of the sub-trim.
The same thing was true with the rudder.
After a few power ups and downs (including turning off the transmitter reproducing a data link loss) and a range check, and having all control surfaces work fine with the elevator appearing to be level Itook off only to discover that I was trimmed way nose down so Idid the "get it high and hold the trim" adjustment to get it close and then to fine tune all of the control surfaces.
Has anyone else had this experience?
It is a relatively new set up and Ihad not yet adjusted all the mechanical linkages to trim with zero sub-trim and trim. I went into the sub-trim menu and adjusted the aileron center position to mechanical level the ailerons. Due to the mechanical trim not yet being correct I needed to make a large reduction of the sub-trim.
The same thing was true with the rudder.
After a few power ups and downs (including turning off the transmitter reproducing a data link loss) and a range check, and having all control surfaces work fine with the elevator appearing to be level Itook off only to discover that I was trimmed way nose down so Idid the "get it high and hold the trim" adjustment to get it close and then to fine tune all of the control surfaces.
Has anyone else had this experience?
08-20-2012, 01:45 PM
#2
My Feedback: (2)
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
ORIGINAL: SkidMan
Last night I upgraded from 2.04 to 2.05 firmware on my DX8. This morning, when I set up my plane, powered up the transmitter, and then switched on the plane I noticed that the ailerons shifted to a very significant right roll position. Repeated power downs and power ups did not change anything. The right aileron kept returning to a significantly up position and the left down (they are on a ''Y'').
It is a relatively new set up and I had not yet adjusted all the mechanical linkages to trim with zero sub-trim and trim. I went into the sub-trim menu and adjusted the aileron center position to mechanical level the ailerons. Due to the mechanical trim not yet being correct I needed to make a large reduction of the sub-trim.
The same thing was true with the rudder.
After a few power ups and downs (including turning off the transmitter reproducing a data link loss) and a range check, and having all control surfaces work fine with the elevator appearing to be level I took off only to discover that I was trimmed way nose down so I did the ''get it high and hold the trim'' adjustment to get it close and then to fine tune all of the control surfaces.
Has anyone else had this experience?
Last night I upgraded from 2.04 to 2.05 firmware on my DX8. This morning, when I set up my plane, powered up the transmitter, and then switched on the plane I noticed that the ailerons shifted to a very significant right roll position. Repeated power downs and power ups did not change anything. The right aileron kept returning to a significantly up position and the left down (they are on a ''Y'').
It is a relatively new set up and I had not yet adjusted all the mechanical linkages to trim with zero sub-trim and trim. I went into the sub-trim menu and adjusted the aileron center position to mechanical level the ailerons. Due to the mechanical trim not yet being correct I needed to make a large reduction of the sub-trim.
The same thing was true with the rudder.
After a few power ups and downs (including turning off the transmitter reproducing a data link loss) and a range check, and having all control surfaces work fine with the elevator appearing to be level I took off only to discover that I was trimmed way nose down so I did the ''get it high and hold the trim'' adjustment to get it close and then to fine tune all of the control surfaces.
Has anyone else had this experience?
08-20-2012, 06:08 PM
#3
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (17)
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Oviedo,
FL
Posts: 349
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
I'm not finding a lot of information on this issue. I did find a heli site that mentions something that sounds like what I experienced and that the issue was referred to in the "notes."
I just reviewed the Spektrum website itself that says, "Known Issues: None."
However, there is a note under the correction listed for "Corrected trainer normal Master mode" in the release notes PDFthat describes pretty much what I've seen.
If it affects all operations, not just in trainer mode, I would suggest that Spektrum takes the following simple steps:
I just reviewed the Spektrum website itself that says, "Known Issues: None."
However, there is a note under the correction listed for "Corrected trainer normal Master mode" in the release notes PDFthat describes pretty much what I've seen.
If it affects all operations, not just in trainer mode, I would suggest that Spektrum takes the following simple steps:
- [*]Prominently list that sub-trims and travel on all control surfaces will be altered and must be readjusted and verified[*]List the need to check and adjust sub-trims and travel as a "Known Issue"[*]Include verifying sub-trims and travel as a required step of the firmware upgrade process[/list]I am very grateful to Spektrum for this update! Recording telemetry to SD was a DX18 feature that I was hoping would be implemented on the DX8. It will be a bit of a pain to setup the radio again for each of my models. This is not a trivial task. It would be nice to know exactly what was changed so that I could just calculate the new settings to establish a good starting point. They also included a number of frequently requested changes including options for the alarm if the radio been left on but not used. This is a great sign that they are responsive to their customers!
It will be interesting to see how this affects my planes that I have competed setting up mechanically - where zero sub-trim and trim is in trim in the air. My guess is that unless Spektrum changes something I'll have to adjust a lot of clevises.
Paul
08-20-2012, 06:29 PM
#4
My Feedback: (2)
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
ORIGINAL: SkidMan
I'm not finding a lot of information on this issue. I did find a heli site that mentions something that sounds like what I experienced and that the issue was referred to in the ''notes.''
I just reviewed the Spektrum website itself that says, ''Known Issues: None.''
However, there is a note under the correction listed for ''Corrected trainer normal Master mode'' in the release notes PDF that describes pretty much what I've seen.
If it affects all operations, not just in trainer mode, I would suggest that Spektrum takes the following simple steps:
I'm not finding a lot of information on this issue. I did find a heli site that mentions something that sounds like what I experienced and that the issue was referred to in the ''notes.''
I just reviewed the Spektrum website itself that says, ''Known Issues: None.''
However, there is a note under the correction listed for ''Corrected trainer normal Master mode'' in the release notes PDF that describes pretty much what I've seen.
If it affects all operations, not just in trainer mode, I would suggest that Spektrum takes the following simple steps:
- [*]Prominently list that sub-trims and travel on all control surfaces will be altered and must be readjusted and verified[*]List the need to check and adjust sub-trims and travel as a ''Known Issue''[*]Include verifying sub-trims and travel as a required step of the firmware upgrade process[/list] I am very grateful to Spektrum for this update! Recording telemetry to SD was a DX18 feature that I was hoping would be implemented on the DX8. It will be a bit of a pain to setup the radio again for each of my models. This is not a trivial task. It would be nice to know exactly what was changed so that I could just calculate the new settings to establish a good starting point. They also included a number of frequently requested changes including options for the alarm if the radio been left on but not used. This is a great sign that they are responsive to their customers!
It will be interesting to see how this affects my planes that I have competed setting up mechanically - where zero sub-trim and trim is in trim in the air. My guess is that unless Spektrum changes something I'll have to adjust a lot of clevises.
Paul
I have 4 or 5 model memories set up on my DX8. After upgrading to 2.05, only one model required me to adjust the Rudder Subtrim from + to -, or vice versa. Not a large price to pay for the benefits offered by the Update. Look at Andy Kunz (Spektrum Developer) replies regarding the side effects of the Update.
08-20-2012, 07:28 PM
#5
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (17)
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Oviedo,
FL
Posts: 349
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
OK, I found some threads on RCG. I usually keep an eye on Spektrum stuff on this forum because there is a dedicated sub-forum that Andy frequents here. Also, wading through 1000+ page threads isn't a very productive way to deal with specific issues. Unfortunately, there wasn't much specific information about this behavior on this forum.
I am a little confused because Andy posted the following on the other forum and it sounds like it was a change to "the trainer and heli" setups - not regular airplane operations.
In any case, it does appear to be affecting non-trainer and non-heli systems. In my case I checked all my control surfaces before I flew and it worked out OK - although I need to check my throws again.
I'm sure that Andy will see this post so I still think it would be a good idea for Spektrum to:
I am a little confused because Andy posted the following on the other forum and it sounds like it was a change to "the trainer and heli" setups - not regular airplane operations.
AndyKunz;22471287 Please read the PDF that came with the 2.05 download. In particular read the NOTE at the bottom of the page. As explained several times over the last few days, the trainer and heli systems were updated to match the DX10t/DX18 and correct problems with the sequence of operations.
That is what the NOTE explains. Andy
That is what the NOTE explains. Andy
I'm sure that Andy will see this post so I still think it would be a good idea for Spektrum to:
- [*]Prominently list that sub-trims and travel on all control surfaces may be altered and must be readjusted and verified[*]List that the sub-trims and travel may be changed as a ''Known Issue'' on the download page[/list]
Perhaps it should be worded some like:
A correction to the trainer and heli modes, and adjusting the programming to match the DX10 and DX18, required changing the way that the sub-trims and trim values were handled. This will require checking the control surfaces of each model and making any needed adjustments. Further firmware upgrades should not require any additional adjustments to these settings. (or someting like that).
Paul
08-25-2012, 06:37 AM
#6
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
The changes for subtrim, travel, etc. were due to making trainer and heli compatible with DX10t/DX18 code.
The NOTE would have been more clear if I had outdented it one instead of leaving it in the wrong column. Sorry about that. Please shoot me.
Andy
The NOTE would have been more clear if I had outdented it one instead of leaving it in the wrong column. Sorry about that. Please shoot me.
Andy
08-25-2012, 11:42 AM
#7
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (17)
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Oviedo,
FL
Posts: 349
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
ORIGINAL: AndyKunz
The changes for subtrim, travel, etc. were due to making trainer and heli compatible with DX10t/DX18 code.
The NOTE would have been more clear if I had outdented it one instead of leaving it in the wrong column. Sorry about that. Please shoot me.
Andy
The changes for subtrim, travel, etc. were due to making trainer and heli compatible with DX10t/DX18 code.
The NOTE would have been more clear if I had outdented it one instead of leaving it in the wrong column. Sorry about that. Please shoot me.
Andy
"Outdent" - Haven't ran into that word before but makes total sense.I like it!
09-16-2012, 05:12 AM
#9
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
It was this thread that was the inspiration for the way the update was modified.
Thanks for bringing up the matter so we could clarify it.
Andy
Thanks for bringing up the matter so we could clarify it.
Andy
09-21-2012, 05:41 PM
#10
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (17)
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Oviedo,
FL
Posts: 349
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
My wife with a journalism background taught me a quote from Cicero that continues to make me think. It goes something like this:
"The art of good writing is not in making it possible to be understood, but in making it impossible to be misunderstood."
"The art of good writing is not in making it possible to be understood, but in making it impossible to be misunderstood."
10-01-2012, 03:03 PM
#11
Senior Member
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
After installing 2.05 on one DX8- - -
I started setting it up for an electric 40 size p-51 with retracts.
Generally, I have a habit of setting things up using a servo simulator and a digital
readout.
A question arose concerning the throttle channel and a 75A ESC
In the past, I've used the limits of 1.00ms and 2.00ms, with 1.50 center(servos, etc.)
The default behavior for the DX-8 seems to be ~1.20 and 2.00 high.
Evidently, the low end is shifted up as provision for engine cut, etc.
Is this normal behavior? Or did I miss something?
I started setting it up for an electric 40 size p-51 with retracts.
Generally, I have a habit of setting things up using a servo simulator and a digital
readout.
A question arose concerning the throttle channel and a 75A ESC
In the past, I've used the limits of 1.00ms and 2.00ms, with 1.50 center(servos, etc.)
The default behavior for the DX-8 seems to be ~1.20 and 2.00 high.
Evidently, the low end is shifted up as provision for engine cut, etc.
Is this normal behavior? Or did I miss something?
10-01-2012, 03:47 PM
#12
My Feedback: (2)
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
ORIGINAL: chuckk2
After installing 2.05 on one DX8- - -
I started setting it up for an electric 40 size p-51 with retracts.
Generally, I have a habit of setting things up using a servo simulator and a digital
readout.
A question arose concerning the throttle channel and a 75A ESC
In the past, I've used the limits of 1.00ms and 2.00ms, with 1.50 center(servos, etc.)
The default behavior for the DX-8 seems to be ~1.20 and 2.00 high.
Evidently, the low end is shifted up as provision for engine cut, etc.
Is this normal behavior? Or did I miss something?
After installing 2.05 on one DX8- - -
I started setting it up for an electric 40 size p-51 with retracts.
Generally, I have a habit of setting things up using a servo simulator and a digital
readout.
A question arose concerning the throttle channel and a 75A ESC
In the past, I've used the limits of 1.00ms and 2.00ms, with 1.50 center(servos, etc.)
The default behavior for the DX-8 seems to be ~1.20 and 2.00 high.
Evidently, the low end is shifted up as provision for engine cut, etc.
Is this normal behavior? Or did I miss something?
10-02-2012, 02:18 PM
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Sanger,
CA
Posts: 427
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: DX8 2.05 firware upgrade results in need to change subtrim?
Chuck
Just remember that if you created models with 2.05 and you get the prompt to update a model you will click Cancel. If you have a model that was created with 2.04 or lower and you did not manually check/adjust any potential subtrim/travel difference then you would Update and let the radio adjust it for you.
Just remember that if you created models with 2.05 and you get the prompt to update a model you will click Cancel. If you have a model that was created with 2.04 or lower and you did not manually check/adjust any potential subtrim/travel difference then you would Update and let the radio adjust it for you.
