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  1. #1

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    2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Normal0falsefalsefalseoNotPromoteQF />EN-USX-NONEontGrowAutofit />ontVertAlignCellWithSp />ontBreakConstrainedForcedTables />ontVertAlignInTxbx />MicrosoftInternetExplorer4

    Many thanks to the ones in the various threads that have given of their experience and time the latter often in short supply, so that Hog builders can ' Get what they want, cause others got what they didn't want' , to loosly parphrase Seamus. Also thanks to the folks at Fubar Hill for their support to the cause of keeping one of R/C's longest running design types going strong .

    Recieved the kit a 6 weeks or so ago and have about 70 percent of the build done. Beginning to smell like bacon down here in S AlabamaJ

    This is the first build i have done since way back, and my first biplane. I did several Sig and other off the shelf 40 and 60 size kits in the mid 80's and i would like to believe i have average building skills (which means i am getting better at hiding my mistakes). Started getting back in the hobby with arfs about five years ago and kinda dove in harder about a year ago.

    Clocked a WM Super Sports 90 into a tree this past summer. I guess i made 3 mistakes with two mistakes worth of altitude It rained balsa and the airplane came down in pieces. The crash aftermath missed the garbage bag mainly because i wanted to revive my fabrication skills. The building bug set in again while paying penance for my control error, and the SS is flying again with a 125 Saito installed. My nearly new Saito 100 twin was the major casulity of the crash which happened on the third flight of a new airplane and engine. Broke the carb mount pins(Yikes...new crankcase in order). Will ship engine off for repairs when closer to being ready for it. Got that Italian desease’, ‘Funzalow’.and hope too fit new radios into the budget before the maiden flight also

    Since the step by step thing has been covered in the above mentioned many resourses, the approach i plan to take is the major points and tricks i have found useful. That and to yell for help from those that can and will. Will add pics and coments on them over the next few weeks now the major push of the build is over.

    I took about 150 pictures while building and will go through them and post the noteworthy ones over the next few weeks. My main objective of this thread is an updated 'Clearing House' of mod and build tips and to help keep interest going in this R/Cveteran in this era of ARFs and instant gratification. If you are building, flying, or just have general comments on what you see. Please free free to post you mind. Like to hear friom any pig plane afectionados out there!

    Current State of the project.


  2. #2

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again


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  3. #3

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    looks great!! awesome job covering your mistakes . I started building a hog 5 years ago and almost got all my mistakes covered and trust me there were alot since it was my 2nd build. This season will be the season to see if my mistakes are flyable or not.
    Ultra Sport Brotherhood #114
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  4. #4
    SeamusG's Avatar
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Nice covering job - what's the material?

  5. #5

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Nice covering job - what's the material?
    I agree with above, what did you use for covering? I like the retro look!

    FB

  6. #6

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Thanks guys! So you are getting close on yours, Squirrel? Know what you mean on the mistakes. I got out of the trap once by the grace of Titebond that hadn't quit set up when i put one of the leading edge blocks in the wrong bay. on the bottom wing. Can't believe i did that. Got to quit building when tired. Blame it on that.

    Covered with Worldtex antique and black. The antique is kinda best described as a translucent yellow. Sure can see through it pretty easy. Had me scrambling to get rid of build marks as best i could when i received the covering.. Most of the ugly spots were on the bottom of the build, Couple of white spackled areas.. I trained from the bottom up Poor bottom of the bottom right wing served as the proving ground so to speak.

    Retro was the right way to describe where i wanted the looks to go, Free Bird.. Finished the trim yesterday. 2 1/2 roles of antique and a full roll of black down to scraps. I haven't checked the numbers, but i think some one said the worldtex rolls were bigger than standard film rolls. I am no patient 'layitouttotheinch' sort of guy, and was kinda surprised that it didn't take more of the base covering..One thing is for sure, the covering went on like butter and the material's heat and adhesion reactions were really predictable. can't blame any errors on the covering.


    Started back in on the cowling this morning. The flat style from Fiberglass Specialties.By the way, kudos to them for a good product and service Wanted to get it fitted and ready for the final round of painting before the engine is shipped off for repairs from last summers tree strike.

    I ran into a bit of 'EEK' moment this morning. Had cut the skirt and done a lateral split on the cowl in a previous session, One razor saw blade in width and minimal sanding to flatten the halves for a good fit. .Took out minimal material. .But enough to cause trouble. After getting the halfs fitted with landing gear straps i got the holes for the jugs roughed in and could see where i was going with the engine in place. Am using 3/4 common aluminum. square tubing for mount spacing for the 100T it put me at 120 mm back plate to firewall. and the plans called for 121 mm best i could measure. The amount i took out of the cowl for the lateral split has moved the cowl forward about 3 to 4 mm from where i anticipated it was going to land. The hog's snout had has gotten longer by about that amount.. Nothing to do i can see but to stack washers on the mount, three on each corner as it sits right now, to bring the engine forward enough to clear the back plate. Guess this will be acceptable. Been flying airplanes around for years with washers on the firewall for various reasons. (But not 12 of them)

    See photos. Comments and suggestions welcome for sure........steve

    RCU has problems with their uploader .....will post pics regarding above later





  7. #7

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again


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  8. #8

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Normal0falsefalsefalseoNotPromoteQF />EN-USX-NONEontGrowAutofit />ontVertAlignCellWithSp />ontBreakConstrainedForcedTables />ontVertAlignInTxbx />MicrosoftInternetExplorer4

    Some general thoughts and observations on the project and materials used so far...... All in all it looks like Sig kits haven’t changed much over the years. Most of the hardware is junk but serviceable if you want to use it. The hinges were strange....they were either defective or different from any ca hinge i have ever seen. The outer layers would peel right off. Never saw that before that i can remember.. Installing great planes hinges.. The occasional piece of substandard major piece of planking.was there. Seems almost to be Sig's trademark..Got bit by that one. Piece of soft planking that wanted to sand thin and punch through eventually had to tear half of it out. Should have took it all out. My fault, but it had been so long since i built, i made misjudgments (and there were a lot things i didn't learn in the first place). But all in all it appears to me one most ingenious and versatile airframe lay outs i have ever seen in a model. User friendly and that makes up for any minor weaknesses.

    One glaring error in the instruction sequence is installing the forward fuselage bottom before drilling the bottom wing dowel holes in lower wing leading edge mount blocks. This needs to be done soon as you have a framed fuselage and a sheeted bottom wing. If you follow the sequence in the instructions and the used the method described therein to locate the dowel hole centers, you will unnecessarily ‘Lock’ yourself out of the forward fuselage area by installing the FFB prematurely and have to accomplish the process of locating the holes for the leading edge dowels by Braille and pointed sticks as described on page 28 of the instructions. Thank you, Lord, for the threads. FBFwas one of the last things i did before covering. I would still trying to fix the missed drilled leading edge dowel holes. Too bad Sig won't issue an 'Airworthiness Directive', but i guess they feel that to admit the error would call for an entire rewrite of the instructions.

    One thing i mentioned to Sig Master in a pm is one i missed about reversing the top wing cabane bolt direction and place the blinds in the top wing and run the mount bolts up from the bottom.. Eliminate the ugly bolt holes in the skin of the top wing. It would have make it a bit cumbersome to put the bolts in.at the field. (Requires a stubby driver), but i can transport mine assembled so it would have been worth it to me. Should have read the threads more.

    In no particular order, some things added to my build:

    Forward magnetic hatch. Plan to install magnetic switch cover in the cockpit when i get switches and charge plugs installed.

    'Bird Cage' construction of cockpit walls using 1/8" dowels. Read too many horror stories of fingers stuck through weak walls.

    Horizon Hobby has a Hellcat panel decal that looks decent, for a little over 3 bucks. Fit my build nearly perfectly. (will come up with part number if anyone is interested).

    Shaped balsa headrest. Lower and longer. Just say no to plastic

    Lower wing leading edge and trailing edge fairings.

    Dubro composite gear and enlarged the landing gear plate. Stock position. Plan to run nylon bolts (forget what size....the ones up from 8-32). Hopefully on a bad day the bolts will go and the plate will stay.

    Sullivan split elevator. Hope i got the geometry right...My first there, and maybe my last. and a subject unto itself. Hope it wasn't a bad idea, but i couldn't find much info on the subject.

    Dubro rudder pull system and Hitec 645 servos

    Homebuilt cam/microswitch dual glow system

    Airtronics for guidance

    Wheel pants, maybe, once through the shakedown period.


  9. #9

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again


    ORIGINAL: Steveibrc


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  10. #10
    tacx's Avatar
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Steve, I too found the Sig hinges to be strange. While test fitting my hinge slots I noticed they were splitting apart. There is a piece of plastic or nylon sandwiched between two pieces of fiber type cloth. I also will be using GP hinges.

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Hey Tacx, I got a set of the gp hinges with a slot machine i got in the first round of ordering parts. lol there is 24 in a set. i have 25 slots. (wish i had added more, and still might.)going to get a new set in the final parts round order.....(Yea! that's tomorrow). the fuzz on the gp hinges surfaces really started fuzzing up afer the abuse of the build. Keep them on the bench and put in some fresh ones. What are you building?.

  12. #12
    tacx's Avatar
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Hi Steve,
    I also am building the Hog Bipe. I do the same with my CA hinges. After test fitting them several times they become very fuzzy, to the point they get harder to push in. I always install fresh ones when it's time to glue them in. They are cheap enough, so no big deal. I also make my own from bulk hinge material. The slotting machine is one of my favorite tools.

    I took notice of your comment about aligning the wing dowels on page 28. Would have been easier if the lower fuse sheeting was not there.

    What do you mean when you say you installed "leading and trailing edge fairings" Fairings?

    When I sheeted the top fuse I doubled the thickness of the sheeting at the cockpit. Without it I'm sure I would have put a finger through it. I already did that on the vertical stab while sanding !

    Did you mod the top wing bolt system, reversing the bolt direction, to eliminate the holes in the top wing?

    I have my fuse 90%, tail feathers done, top wing done, and just finishing the lower wings.


  13. #13
    Daddyo57's Avatar
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Been awhile since I posted but was happy to see a thread on the Hog Bipe! i am about 90% done with my Hog and I wish i would have done the top wing mod... I did build a filler for the area behind the landing gear as I couldnt see leaving a gap as per plans. I also went with dual aileron servos (HiTec 645 MG) a Sullivan tail wheel assy and I will be making my head rest from balsa too as I cant find paint to match the Monokote Dark Red and the Monokote Cream colors I used. I really like the Fabric and paint covering job you did! It looks nice! I am building this Bipe as a "Sister" to my Astro Hog done in similar colors except I used Metallic Red on the Astro. I am going to run an OS 95 AX engine and I am sure it will be over powered a bit but should be no problem. My radio gear is all HiTec using an Aurora A-9 TX and a NiMH 6 volt 2000 mah pack with a heavy duty switch. Servos are all 645 MG except throttle. Here are some pics of where I am at on it now.
    Daddyo57
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    I plan to live forever, so far, so good...
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  14. #14
    SeamusG's Avatar
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Nice tail art!

  15. #15

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Here is mine that should fly this year after 6 years since I first started it. I need to balance and set the control throws and I think thats it. I cut the front off to fit a cowl but the cowl I had for it didnt work out for my Irvine 61 so I am going cowless for awhile til I do the maiden. The quality of the build could have been better but it was my second build. The pic is before I had everthing done.
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    Ultra Sport Brotherhood #114
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  16. #16
    Daddyo57's Avatar
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    You can add a cowl no problem when you get the time and find one you like. Fiberglass Specialties and a few other places have them and even some well stocked Hobby Shops. It will be a blast to fly and it doesnt look that bad! I love the graphics, I have no imagination when it comes to that stuff, I have to get my son to help me on that.
    I plan to live forever, so far, so good...
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Thanks Daddyo. Coming up with graphics is the best part of building. As for the cowl a Sig Smith Miniplane cowl fits great but it makes the nose longer than it should be. I didnt feel like building the engine mount out far enough for it to work.
    Ultra Sport Brotherhood #114
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  18. #18

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Great to see there are as many pork lovers in the r//c worlk as there are in Washington! Looks like we got 3 hogs at roughly the same leve of completion at this roast so far. Sig Master is also out there and just getting one kicked off and Semus with much wisdom in the ways of the hog

    Don't know what to say about that hinge thing.tacx, could be a bad thing if they packed a lot of kits with them. Maybe there is some kind of physics trick where the ca just wicks on the outer layer and actually bonds to the plastic and they are ok. If not, they look to me like a death sentence to any bird built with them. The fairing blocks were as Daddyo described on the leading edge on the lower wing. were the pins fit into the fuselage. and at the rear of the trailing is a built up area on the fuselage. (will post pics of how i went about it.). Wish i did do the bolt mod, i didn;t find that thread till it was too late. . When i bolted together the complete airframe together the other day for the first time, it fit in the back of my jeep perfectly. Oh well.

    Daddo you got it going on! Speaking of painting, that is all Worldtex andique with a full roll of black for trim. The only paint is black Rustoleum on various small parts. FYI and whatever it is worth, i was talking to one of the local guys the other day, and he was telling me the PPG auto paint dealer in Pecola, Fl had paint codes on Monocote (or was that Ultracote, i don't remember he might have said both) and would be glad to mix it down to about a thimble full as far as amount. Bad news was that the minimum amount they sold in the catylist was for close to 40 bucks. Would assume any PPG dealer would do the same. I am running a 6 volts 2000 mil pack also for the first time. Single cell C's for glow power. Have throttle micro switch setup completed. and still have the wiring harness to build.

    Squirrel, how you kept interest and inerta in a project that long is beyond me. My personality in somthing like this is such that if i lay it down long, i get stuck. The guy i was talking about above about the paint thing keeps two or three major projects going on for years. Blows my mind just thinking about keeping up with all those parts and pieces, Not to mention constantly going from one to the other.


    Set the tail feathers, finished the rudder pull system, covered the headrest, and did some odds and ends parts painting over the last couple days. Hopefully will have my final parts order redy and submitted tomorrow. (getting a shiney hew radio sys Running out of materials for completion . Will post pics i refered to above later......



  19. #19

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    I am so sorry to read about the bottom wing mounting since I just finished my fuse. Yes glued the forward floor in place already.

    I built a mag hatch as well.
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  20. #20
    tacx's Avatar
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Steve,

    I have already thrown the kit hinges in the trash. Don't want to get them mixed with my standard hinges and use one by mistake. They may be fine to use and don't intend to scare anyone who has used them, but I have used GP hinges for so long that I feel more confident with them.

    Would like to see pics of your fairing mod. Still not sure of what you did.

    After reading some of these post regarding the Hog, I think I'm going to redo the top wing cabane bolt system. Should be easy. Just drill out the blind nuts on the cabane support and install new ones in the top wing mounting blocks. I can do this thru the access holes I made in the top wing and then just cover the holes when covering the wing. If I can get the plane in my SUV I will not be taking it apart for transporting.

    I am also thinking of cutting out the top fuse tank area and making a tank access hatch as some have done. I don't care for the original method of shoving the tank in from inside the fuse. Really haven't convinced myself yet if I want to do the mod.

    I also am installing the Sullivan tail gear. I love it, and have it installed on three of my planes now.

    One thing I found disappointing in the kit was installing the lower wing dowel blocks. Once you have the leading edge glued to the ribs it is a pain to try and get a snug fit, because the W-1 rib is at the dihedral angle and the space between the ribs is smaller at the top then it is at the bottom. It would probably be easier to remove the wing from the building board to install it, but then you would have to re-pin the wing back down again before installing the sheeting.

    Well off to the hobby shop to spend more money !!!!

  21. #21
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    I agree on the hinges... I had to toss about 1/3 of them but I think once you get them in all glued they are fine. I notice I was the only guy who went with dual aileron servos... I am pretty sure a good metal gear servo will pull all 4 of them but I had an extra 645 MG and said what the heck, plus I suck at making torque rods. I am jazzed about my Hog Bipe and I love SIG kits!!! They didnt have the aluminum cabane struts in my kit so I called SIG and they mailed them real quick, talk about great customer service! i am wondering if my kit is a newer or different design from some of you as my cockpit floor was 1/8 light ply... plenty tough to put a screw through for my pilot and also mount my Charge/Switch into. I have a set of those DuBro HD composit landing gear and I seriously considered using them instead of the aluminum one but then I would have to find matching paint. Here in California paint is very expensive due to all the EPA rules. I will throw in a pic of my Astro Hog to show my Hog Bipes sister, similar colors but the Astro Hog has Metallic Red rather than opaque Dark Red. I have Bender from Futurama in it now and I found a "Calculon" action figure for the Hog Bipe, wanted "Zoidberg" but he is 300 bucks!
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    I plan to live forever, so far, so good...
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  22. #22
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Nice Daddyo - what's the covering? Ya really need another wing to keep your pale pilot in the shade.

  23. #23
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    Thank Seamus, I used Monokote for both birds. Metallic Red and Cream on the Astro and Dark Red and Cream on the Bipe. I am really looking forward to flying this airplane, it has been a long time since i built or flew a Bipe and everytime I build one I tell myself 2 wings is too much work LOL! i end up selling my Bipes too because other guys dont like building them too much either. i have more spare time now so i am enjoying it this time around. I have a Smith Mini Plane and an EAA Bipe too in kit form.
    I plan to live forever, so far, so good...
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  24. #24
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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    But they are such little wings. I'm thinking about a certain WWI tri-plane. Just might turn into a closet queen though - if the RC version is as twitchy as they say the full scale one was - enough rudder to flat turn nearly within its own length? Where's my high wing trainer???

    I've only used Ultracote but looking at the color options with Monokote is making me think ...

  25. #25

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    RE: 2012 Hog Bipe rides again

    My long suffering lady and i went to Pensacola for dinner tonight. I have been 'shacked up' in the back yard for two months with 'Betty Bumblebee' as she calls the Hog project and l needed to make amends to my main squeeze. .

    Shepard, Since you have a forward hatch, it shouldn't be much different, it looks to me, than not having the FBF in place. Maybe not quite as good of a view I drilled pilot holes and inserted toothpicks for alignment aids. then just kept using larger bits and larger dowels to make sure the holes were under control till i got to the size of the main event. I would think it will work the same way for you. Small makeup mirror might get you a straight on view.

    T,acx, I agree with Deep 6ing the hinges. Good luck to all that choose to use them. On the lower leading edge blocks, I had thought i was being slick as all get outs I just went ahead and sheeted the top of the wing .and waited to put mine in from the bottom just as you suggested. I unpinned the wing so i could get the blocks in without fighting the reverse dihedral taper as you described. Had everything set, and went in a high speed mode. Put the first one in, and it fit perfect. Then set the taper on the second one and installed it in the outboard bay like i had good sense. Had to whack off about 1/4 inch of the block to work it in the bay on the wrong end of the wing to accomplish that nice piece of stupidity . But the trick you considered about going in from the bottom side worked.(once i freed the block from the wrong bay and re glued the 1/4 in i cut off back on and went into the correct bay) I found myself really fatigued at times and working beyond my sensible limit is my excuse for letting that happen. I received the kit less than two months ago and have been pushing. One thing that lead me into that trap was i had gotten one rib crooked, the tip rib, (i later straightened it) and it was off just enough, and in the right direction of slant to delude me into just hammering down on the wrong end of the wing[img]../../punymce/plugins/emoticons/img/trans.gif[/img] It is really not that bad to build a hatch. You probably won't regret it. I plan to utilize mine for fueling also. Will help keep the fuel plumbing simple. There will be pictures posted clarifying the fairing thing tomorrow, and i will try also to upload them tonight. Uploading pictures at night has not been working for me. All i get is time out and server errors. No problems in the mornings, they will upload as fast as i can stack them in.

    Daddyo that is a cool single winger and i suspect i would have passed on Ziodberg too!. i really agree with you on the overall view on Sig kits in spite of the above moaning and groaning. Nobody in the business has accomplished their overall level of success. LOL I was fussing at the top of this thread about the quality of sig kit hardware, and i went looking for some nice aftermarket aileron interconnect horns on the net.......and unless i missed something somewhere, and i think i looked pretty good in the hardware main houses, Dubro ect.., Sig is the only ones i can find that packages aileron interconnects. That was hard to believe. Anyone else know a source? Speaking of ailerons, i am running the dual aileron mod with 645 MGs. Neglected to mention it in the mod list. And speaking of single aileron servo builds, one of the new generation 6v super fast high torque servos might be just the ticked for saving a few ounces for some folks by running one. On the paint, you residents of CA have to deal with Big Brother that's for sure. If you ever want to go that route, you might could get an out of state paint shop to mail it to you. If they won't get into trouble Just a thought. Far as the cockpit floor, mine is light ply. Plans are dated 1995.

    Hey Seamus We can't be too hard on Daddyo about his single wing step child! He is hammer down on a 2 winger. (A little further up the thread, you might have missed it.).



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