Fortyeight

jaka

Hi!
As we don't know what plane you intend to have the OS 20cc engine in we have difficultiy giving advise.
The only advise I can give you is that is unvise for a newbie to start with a big 20cc fourstroke.!!!
Get a smaller .40-.60 high winged trainer and power it with a .40 or -.60 two stroke.

CGRetired

My Feedback: (1)

Fortyeight:

My advice for a "newbie" would be to shelve that plane for a while, get a trainer, and learn to fly it before tangling with that P-40E. That combination would be a nice one for an experienced pilot.

Warbirds are not for beginners. That engine is definitely not for a beginner regardless of if it is pumped or not.

You can build it, but, again, shelve it until you learn to fly RC.

CGr.

Sherv

My Feedback: (1)

Yea don't fly that plane... I learned the hard way because War birds fly different and are not as easy to land as a tri-cycle gear plane or even a top/high wing tail dragger.

Go to your local club and get some ideas there for a starter plane from the members.

Something like a nitro NeXstar is very popular for learning to fly on.

Fortyeight

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

This discussion is WAY over the level of what is discussed in the Beginner's Forum here on RCU. I'm moving this thread to the Kit Builder's Forum. You should be able to get answers to your questions there.

LesUyeda

"What would I need the pumped version for? Does it make it more dependable? More performance? Easier to tune?"

My experience says NONE of the above. I've never needed a pumped engine. I am given to understand that it was to accomodate the flyer that insisted on having his fuel tank directly over cg; usually too far to draw fuel properly.

Monokote is lighter, less messy, and easier to fix mistakes on.

Les

Hemikiller

My Feedback: (125)

If this is the Top Flite P-40E, then you most likely won't need to concern yourself with a pump. The tank on that model appears to be close enough to the needle valve level that it won't cause issues, check you plans to be sure. Pumped engines are less sensitive to tank location and provide a more consistent and reliable fuel flow.

Monokote vs Glass is a personal preference. I prefer glass as it's much easier to do detail work on. If this is your first covering job, then Monokote will do the job nicely and takes less time and effort than glass.

Ed Smith

If you want it to look like this then glass it and paint it. This was painted with Latex and fuel proofed with automotive clearcoat flattened with an automotive flatting agent.

Ed S

Fortyeight

– Thanks for the info.

The tank is located right behind the firewall; I’d say 6 to 10 inches of line (depending how it’s routed).  I don’t think the pump will help in my situation, so I’ve decided to go without it. 

Ed - Your plane looks great. I think glassing is the way to go.  Monkote seems easier but I’m hoping to get that look.  If you have more pics please post them.  Close ups of joints & spacing’s of ailerons, cowlings & the canopy help me get a better idea of how they are supposed to fit.   Pics inside the housing and wheel wells would also be appreciated. 

Scott

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

Choice question, I like pumped engines but over time there are a few problems with the OS pumpers. War Birds call for glass and paint but using Solartex can also work on some of them. Choices! The reason I like pumpers is because in flight they don't go rich and lean, they don't care what attitude the plane is in.
They don't care how or where you mount them or the fuel tank. I like mounting my tanks over the CG of the plane so there is no in flight changes, sometimes the CG is a bit back too far for non pumped engines. At this time your tank is close to the engine but what about the next plane you use it in. Pumpers are just easier.
UNTIL!! OS service will not sell you just a new diaphragm if you need a replacement and you will in time! They have you send in the complete carb so they can replace it for you. Now that $2.00 diaphragm is going to cost you close to $50.00!! Then down the road if you require a new pump OS will dive into your pockets again! It is a one piece unit and it can't be repaired with a new diaphragm, it requires a complete new pump! Just about $100.00.
On top of it all the price of a new OS engine has gone beyond stupid! I gave up buying any new OS engines, mater of fact I gave up buying any brand of glow engines. I use YS and OS and have a lot of them but if a new engine is needed from 1.20 on I would be going gas. Take a look at the DLE 20cc. Gassers are pumped already, cheap to buy and operate. Once tuned they require no more needle dinking, set and forget.
In this day and age glow engines make very little sense except that we are used to using them. In my case I have so many high dollar YS and OS engines and they aren't worth spit on the used engine market I would loose too much money if I sold them.
Just something to think about. I would rather have two DLE 20s then one OS 1.20.

Fortyeight

I like the idea of the DLE 20s.  I never thought I could fit a gas on this model.  This model calls for the .90 to 1.20 4 - cycle.  Will I have to make any major modifications to the plane? Will the fuel tank accomidate gas?

jaka

Hi!
Use oracover, much better than Monokote and forget about glassing such a small plane if you want good performance! And use a .90 two or four stroke instead of that 1.20 four stroke! It will be too heavy!
Keeping a light wing loading is what you should aim for not choosing as big engines as possible. 1.20 four and gas engines weigh too much for that plane!
If you want to go the gas engine route choose a bigger plane (2m)!

Nergall

I really depends on whether you're making a model that looks awesome or flies awesome. If you want both, it probably needs to be bigger.

A glassed model that size really looks a ton better than a shiny monokote version. (Yes, even with the "flat" colors)

But, it will add weight. Same basic problem with the retracts though, right?

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

You can achieve a happy medium on the finish by covering with an iron on product and then painting the model. I think Top Flite even covers this technique in the instructions. While it is not as durable and resistant to hangar rash as a traditonal glass finish, and may still develop some wrinkles over time, it does look light years better than unpainted plastic coverings. All the same detailing and weathering techniques are applicable as well. My P-40 was done this way, although not by me.

smithcreek

My Feedback: (25)

Glassing adds weight when done poorly. There were pictures of a guy assembling an RTC mustang on here a couple years ago and he was pouring the epoxy on heavy glass. The close ups showed puddles of resin which he leveled using 80 grit on a random orbital sander. If done correctly, 80 grit sandpaper on an electric sander would eat through the resin, glass and balsa in under 5 seconds. It was a larger plane, so the weight might not have been a big deal, but put that much glass on TF 60 size kit and you are toast.

Learn how to do it lightly and you will add little to no weight with glass compared to mono. Use 1/2 or 3/4 oz cloth, thin your epoxy 50-50 with alcohol and brush it on using as little as possible, fill the weave with a 50-50 mix of red bondo spot putty and acetone, sand that back to the cloth leaving just enough to fill the weave and any spots where two layers of glass meet. Spray your primer and sand that back taking almost all of it off, then paint your colors. It is easy and tempting to use too much paint which will add weight, but if you do it right it won't. Be especially careful behind the cg.

This is an Acroduster Too biplane I am building. It's ready for primer. It will get one coat, most of it will be removed, then color coats. At this point the glass and spot putty weigh almost nothing, by the time I'm done painting it will weigh about the same as monokote.

LesUyeda

"You can achieve a happy medium on the finish by covering with an iron on product and then painting the model. I think Top Flite even covers this technique in the instructions."

I have the Top Flite ARF of that bird, and they use two different colors of Monokote, to achieve that.

Les

Fortyeight

smithcreek

My Feedback: (25)

If you used the method I described the glass won't add any appreciable weight, but the paint is where you need to be careful.

A four stroke glow will fit completely inside the P-40 cowl, will a gas engine? Lots of planes just look like crap with their cowl hacked to pieces and a big gas engine ruining the scale shape. The Acroduster above is going to have a big ugly gas engine sticking out the bottom. Don't write off glow just because the trend is towards gas. For a 60 size plane like a P-40 that will not be your everyday flier glow still makes lots of sense. Smaller, fits in cowls better, and sounds much better than gas. If it's a plane that might get 10-20 flights a year does the cost of gas really matter?

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

The process is covered in the instructions for the kit version which can be downloaded in PDF format here: http://manuals.hobbico.com/top/topa0120-manual-v2.pdf

jaka

Hi!
I been doing this for decades and glssing sure ads more weight than a plastic film covering. With more weight I mean 100-200g or more and for a pylon racer pilot like me that is much!

You will not regret using Oracover if you try it!
I could be painted if you wet sand it first like I did on my Marutaka DC-3

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

a alternative to using epoxy is water based polyurethane and light weight glass cloth its outlined in this SBD Dauntless, and his FW190 thread by Tom Pierce at http://tompierce.net/rcplanes/index.htm allot of great detailing tips as well for the future its the only way I glass planes my latest glass job with WB Varathane diamond and .56oz cloth my Royal FW190 project here I detail the build http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_56...tm.htm#5620546

Fortyeight

I've got some more research to do but I want to glass my P-40.Here'sa couple of pics.

iron eagel

If your interested in learning to glass a plane, and keep it lightweight, visit Paul's Air Field Models site lots of good information.

http://www.airfieldmodels.com/inform...nish/index.htm

Fortyeight

That was a good read, got lots of help from it.