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Four Star 120 New build

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Old 10-07-2012, 05:47 PM
  #1
acdii
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Default Four Star 120 New build

After my debacle with the ARF, Sig sent me a new kit to replace it with, so Istarted working on it tonight. First impressions on the kit, wood is pretty nice, though Ido notice that there is a great variance betweensome of the wood, for example a could 1/4 x 1/4 sticks are very light, around .003 kg to heavy around .014 kg. Same with the wood the ribs were stamped from, some dense, some really light, which makes me beleive its all cut and stocked before putting into the kits, and not cut and kitted like I have seen with some other kits. The die cutting on W1/W3 parts was half and half, some cutting was good, and some not all the way through, especially the W3 ribs. The W2/W3 ribs though came right apart after some light sanding, the other ones had to be cut with a knofe, it would have taken too much wood off sanding them. All the wood is straight and clean, and demensionally perfect.

Ihave all the ribs out, all the wing parts separated and then I weighed each piece, and then grouped them into left and right wings, marking the wieght on each piece.

Isetup my work table, grabbed a sheet of drywall and screwed it to my workbench, laid the plans out, and then covered them with the leftover plastic from the Monokote I used for my other plane. What I did with the plans to help them lay flat, and I must say SIG rolls the plans the right way, printed side out. I laid them out for a day with weight on them, then rolled them backwards, and left them for a day, then I unrolled and rolled them one more time, this way from the bottom up instead of from the side. When I was ready to lay them out, they lay perfectly flat now.

I started the left wing tonight, and each and every piece fit perfectly. Spars laid up nice, all the ribs fit snug, tacked all the joints with thin CA, then put the shear webs in, and for some odd reason Ithought the rear webs went on the 1/4 rear spar, DOH, so I had to cut them out and redo them, thankfuy Ijust tacked them with CA, they go on the face of the trailing edge sheeting. Once I got that corrected I then ran a filet of Elmers wood glue using a syringe to apply it. The next step was to install the wing bolt block, then I sanded the trailing edge to line up with the ribs, and then glued on the top trailing edge sheeting with Elmer. Then the top spar and 1/4" spars were installed, all but one can be installed at this time. Ithen ran elmers around all the joints I could reach. The wing is now drying, it is at the stage where a few more small items are attached, and then removed. Once I can remove it I can then reach the rest of the joints and run more glue around them.

The ribs are installed heaviest towards the center, so rolls should be nice. Ialso left the last rib out, which will let me transport the wing in the back of my truck without it sticking out. Overall length hits around 73", normally its 81". Iplan to put rounded tips on, so add about 3 inches, and it will be just under the length of my trucks bed.

A few things I am changing from the kit are with the fuse. Iam moving the elevator servo to the tail, and running a pull pull system for the ruddder. The radio tray that was in the ARF separated cleanly, so I may use that instead of the one in the kit. Going to make a hatch in the nose so I can install the batteries and ignition module, the fuel tank will go over the CG, so I may not need the tank floor. Going to use a Dubro Iso mount instead of the kit mount.

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Old 10-08-2012, 06:27 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

I brought one of the plywood rib caps with me today and will get some balsa blocks to make the tips with.  The trick will be to make them of equal weight so I wont need a lot to balance it.
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Old 10-10-2012, 08:24 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

You will love this kit. I built one with a Saito 1.20 with enlarged rudder, and it flies beautifully. You are likely going to need alot of weight up front if you move any servos to the tail. I would not recommend it. Mine balanced without any lead, and was I think 10 pounds (very low end of their weight).
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Old 10-10-2012, 08:41 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

The ARF I had had the servo in the tail and balanced out OK, as long as I build it right, it should balance out fine.    I checked the wing last night and the glue looks really good and strong where I used it, so need to flip it over and hit the parts I couldnt get to with some more, and then move on to the other wing.  The wing is nice and straight and clean, starting to get really good at the gluing, only have a few spot to clean up where the glue ran and puddled.  It's too bad it turns brown though, the woodworking is nice and clean. 

I was at my friends barn last night working on my expensive project, a TopFlite P-51 C.  That one is coming along nicely, but the 4* will be finished long before the Stang will be. I started it last year about this time, and only have the wing built and the fuse partially assembled. I installed the FW last night along with the top formers and stringers, and its ready for the sheeting.  Originally I was going to use the DLE20 in it, but the sound of the motor just doesn't suit the plane, so looking for alternates in the 1.20 size. 

I will probably do some more work on the 4* tonight, so if I do, more pics will be posted. 
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:59 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Left wing is assembled, glued, and sanded, working on the right wing now. Nothing special yet on this one other than leaving off the last bay. After I finish the right wing and get them joined, then I will work on the end caps, I like rounded tips so I got some 1/2 inch balsa and will need to glue a few pieces together to make it thick enough to make it look nice. Iconsidered messing with the Dihedral, but its 2* out of the box, which isnt much at all, and considering Iwas OK with how the ARF flew, Idecided not to fudge with it.


So now that Ihave one wing built, I grabbed my mostly intact right wing and weighed it against the new wing. They weigh almost the same, the broken wing with Aileron still attached minus some inner ribs, vs the new wing minus the aileron and one bay. Iguess the spruce and glue make up the difference in weight.

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Old 10-18-2012, 07:54 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

I may as well follow along, I will be starting mine in about a month.
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Old 10-18-2012, 10:07 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

The Four Star is a great plane and lends itself to modification/customization. You can have a lot of fun with this build let alone the flying aspect of it.

I too clipped the wing by one bay each.
I did not use the kit's strip ailerons. I bought 1/4 in planks of balsa and cut out larger ailerons.
I did the same for the elevators and rudder to get larger surfaces.
I included counter ballance in the rudder construction.
I utilized 2 elevator servos placed in the rear and a Pull/Pull cable system on the rudder for more positive control.
Finally, I outfitted it with a 26cc gasoline engine.

Of all modification it is the gassoline engine I most highly recomend.
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Old 10-19-2012, 01:56 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

acdii,
Sorry to hear about your 4 Star 120 ARF...glad that you decided to build one. I've been following your posts. I will be watching your progress with anticipation for when I can get started. Got about two months to go and I will be home on vacation for a month. Are you going to use the DLE 20 again or are you going to put something bigger in?
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Old 10-19-2012, 10:34 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build


Quote:
ORIGINAL: R/C Addiction

acdii,
Sorry to hear about your 4 Star 120 ARF...glad that you decided to build one. I've been following your posts. I will be watching your progress with anticipation for when I can get started. Got about two months to go and I will be home on vacation for a month. Are you going to use the DLE 20 again or are you going to put something bigger in?
Going to put the DLE back on it. It made a good combination. I originally bought it for the P-51, but after hearing it, just doesnt seem P-51ish enough, so going to get a 4 stroke for it instead.

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Mr67Stang

The Four Star is a great plane and lends itself to modification/customization. You can have a lot of fun with this build let alone the flying aspect of it.

I too clipped the wing by one bay each.
I did not use the kit's strip ailerons. I bought 1/4 in planks of balsa and cut out larger ailerons.
I did the same for the elevators and rudder to get larger surfaces.
I included counter ballance in the rudder construction.
I utilized 2 elevator servos placed in the rear and a Pull/Pull cable system on the rudder for more positive control.
Finally, I outfitted it with a 26cc gasoline engine.

Of all modification it is the gassoline engine I most highly recomend.
Looks like that one can do 3D with all that control surface. Do you have the ailerons setup separate, or single channel?

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Old 10-19-2012, 11:05 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

OK Got some pics to share.

The wing is assembled, ready to join together after I trim and sand the trailing edge and touchup sand the right panel. Theres a pic of the glue joint for the web. The wing will NOT fail due to poor gluing! I started shaping the wingtips too this morning, Since I couldnt find solid blocks of the right size I glued up some 1/2" stock and cut the two ends out. They are ready for carving and sanding now. I think it will look good with rounded tips.

I got started on the Fuse, mounted the DLE to a Dubro vib mount, and fitted it to the FW. Then at the rear opened up the spot where the Elevator servo goes, made the servo mount, and got it glued in. I then made some hoops from scrap to support the extension wires for the servo and got that mounted.

This one will also be getting the pull pull rudder setup, so no pushrods will be installed. The next step will be fitting the guides for the cables, and putting some pull strings in so I can pull the cables through. I remembered what a pain getting them through the ARF was. Not doing that again. I may reuse the servo tray from the ARF, or make a matching one from scrap. The Kit uses a three in a row setup, I prefer the staggered setup instead, and moves the throttle servo forward, more towards CG. The Fuel tank will be mounted right on CG too, worked well on the ARF. The last modification left on the Fuse will be a forward hatch for gettting to the batteries and ignition module.

EDIT: Now that I think about it, I may install the throttle servo in the nose with teh ignition and batteries, and may not need much in the way of lead to balance it out.
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Old 10-19-2012, 11:17 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Does anyone know what the inside width is between the cowl cheeks? I am wondering if the DLE35 RE will fit in there without cutting the cheeks.
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Old 10-19-2012, 12:21 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Quote:
ORIGINAL: acdii
Looks like that one can do 3D with all that control surface. Do you have the ailerons setup separate, or single channel?

It will just hover for a bit and thats about as 3D as it gets. The airframe is just too stable for nice spins and tumbles. I even reduced the diheadral and it is still very stable.

The Ailerons are on seperate channels.
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Old 10-19-2012, 12:23 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Dont know if it will fit. The DLE20 with a Pitts still required cutting the cheek on one side. It was flush with the outside of the cheek when mounted. All depends on how wide the motor is on the mount.
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Old 10-19-2012, 12:41 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

I did some searching and it will fit without cutting anything. Just need to move the firewall back and reinforce it. The widest point is the base of the standoffs and that is 3.75". With the rear exhaust the muffler is only slightly wider than the cylinder and narrower than the mount.
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Old 10-19-2012, 07:24 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Your going to need tail weight though if you do use it, its at least 10 ounces heavier than the DLE20.
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Old 10-19-2012, 07:35 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Yes it is, but some were adding nose weight with the 20 and other glow engines in the 30 ounce range. Some added 10 or so ounces. I will move the battery into the rear fuselage if needed and then add weight as required. It shouldn't take much if it does. Years ago the guys were using Robyi 31's that weighed over 4 lbs.

I have to sit back now and lurk some before I mess up your build thread any more.
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Old 10-20-2012, 06:30 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

You did get me thinking though. I need another engine for my Mustang build.  The DLE was intended for the Stang, but since it has taken so long to build it, the engine went into other planes for break in, the last being the 4*. Since the two made such a good match, I decided to get a different engine for the Stang, but haven't decided on one yet.  Would be interesting to see the 35 mounted on the 4*.  The ARF needed more power, I felt it was a bit under powered with the 20 on it.  

If I like how it looks, I may go that route too, and put the 20 where I originally got it for.
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Old 10-20-2012, 06:33 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

If you want I can go grab my 35 and take some pics for you showing the width etc.
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Old 10-20-2012, 06:38 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

If I dont need to cut into the cheeks to make it fit, that is the biggest thing. On the 20 I still have to cut the cheek to make the PITTS fit.  I have a pic of it somewhere.
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Old 10-20-2012, 06:42 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Yep, found some. Idont have a full on side shot though, but you can see enough of what I had to cut out to make it fit. Since that par of the fuse is completely and utterly destroyed, Iwillget a picture of the engine with a ruler on it and we can compare.


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Old 10-20-2012, 07:02 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Here are a couple of pics. The muffler is just a tad over 3.5" wide and the standoffs are 3.75" at the widest point. From the centerline of the crankshaft to the bottom of the muffler is about 4" so the bottom of the muffler should be close to flush with the bottom of the fuselage with just the pipes and the top of the head sticking down. My kit won't arrive until next week so I have no plans to use but found a post with the firewall measurements. The engine will have to sit with the one standoff tight to the left cheek cowl to allow for some right thrust.
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Old 10-20-2012, 07:16 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Here are a couple more. The length is 160mm or 6 3/8" the same as a DLE30. The other set of standoffs are narrower than shown above and are the same as a DLE30, 70mm between centers, the standoffs closest to the cylinder shown above are 80mm between centers. If I don't get this to fit I have a DLE30 on a Giant Stick I can swap it out with. The DLE30 will fit easy but will need to cut a square area out of the left side cheek cowl for the muffler.
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:03 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

I have been following the 4-star build and the DLE 30 or 35 is perfect for this airplane. I re powered mine with a DLE 30 from a YS 120 best improvement I did to this airplane, you will like yours when you get it done
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Old 10-20-2012, 11:17 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

I have a Four Star 120 with a Dario-Quadra 35. Well over 300 flights. It was my first gasser, I always start the flying season out with it to knock the rust off.

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Old 10-20-2012, 02:17 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 120 New build

Just did a measurement, the inside cheek to cheek is 3.75" with the inside stiffeners installed.  Depending on the thrustline, might be a little tight.   If the stiffeners are left off, you can gain an additional 3/16 to 1/4 ".
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