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Old 12-05-2014, 03:16 PM
  #2126  
soarrich
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Box Car

It looks like the Sr could be kit bashed into a CH701 without too much effort, except for that center-section, you wouldn't want to try to fly it without the wing-struts.

Skylark-flier

That looks like a control line wing. Bob Hunt has a method of building a wing like that where he cuts a foam block to hold the wing as he builds it. (BH was the World Champ in CL and Editor of Model Aviation Magazine.)
Old 12-05-2014, 03:35 PM
  #2127  
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Dave that wing looks a lot like some of the CL I Beamer wings. Now just add a molded sheet LE. to it. Super strong, super light. But do not push it to the edge. Unless you like picking up tooth picks.

Ken
Old 12-05-2014, 04:53 PM
  #2128  
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The wing is no problem to make but the junker's type flaps and aileron maybe an other story. The wing is made that way so you get a lot of prop wash to the tail. If you look close at the pictures you will see some other funny things at the tail end of the plane.
Old 12-05-2014, 05:05 PM
  #2129  
N1EDM
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Zor, as for the cats, my wife never met a stray that she couldn't feed, so I understand your situation

Regarding the wing, I once had a conversation with SIG and they told me that the basic airfoil on the LT-40 is a Clark-Y (in case anyone was curious). If you're working on a new design of wing, this is a heads-up that the wing mount has an incidence of 1-1/2 degrees, I believe. You've probably already caught this but I thought I'd mention it just in case.

Bob
Old 12-05-2014, 06:16 PM
  #2130  
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Originally Posted by soarrich

Lots of planes have used this type of construction, most famous, in RC away, are the Honker, Honker Bipe, and Top Cat. I've built the Honker and the Top Cat, they both actually use the same wing, the Top Cat's wing is just two Honker wings end to end. The Honker's wing is 36", the Top Cat's 72", The front 1/3 of the wing is hard 1/4" balsa, the rest is maybe 3/16" hard balsa. My Top Cat was doped, I don't remember how I finished the Honker other than I used Walnut stain on it.
soarrich,

i do not see illustration of Jedelsky build in the two pics.

Zor
Old 12-05-2014, 07:14 PM
  #2131  
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Default About the incidences for the Kadet Sr.

Originally Posted by N1EDM

Zor,

as for the cats, my wife never met a stray that she couldn't feed, so I understand your situation

Regarding the wing, I once had a conversation with SIG and they told me that the basic airfoil on the LT-40 is a Clark-Y (in case anyone was curious). If you're working on a new design of wing, this is a heads-up that the wing mount has an incidence of 1-1/2 degrees, I believe. You've probably already caught this but I thought I'd mention it just in case.

Bob
Bob and any interested,

Your post above made me investigate the drawings concerning incidences.

There is a reference line drawn in dash-dot line on the main part of the fuselage profile and marked as such just above the prop spinner ( nowhere else ). That ref line is also on the part of the drawing showing the tail but is not marked as being the ref line. That line is 2 13/16" above the bottom of the fuselage at location YZ just in front ot the fin to fuselage junction ( drawing in two parts ).

I find that the bottom of the main wings airfoil is parallel to the ref line so the main wings in effect have an incidence of just about 1 1/2 degrees at the roots. The stabilizer has a zero degree of incidence.

I also find by drawing measurements that the thrust line has just about 3 degrees of downthrust to the ref llne. I do not see any side thrust ( the engne is not shown in the fuselage top view ) but the drawing of the engine mount lines are parallel to the fuselage center line; so I conclude no side thrust.

With my own experience in drafting I can understand the difficulty of not missing some small details somewhere . I have lots of admiration for Claude McCullough the designer and draftsman.

Zor
Old 12-05-2014, 08:10 PM
  #2132  
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Rich & Ken - I can't believe my lack of visual acuity - you're right, it really DOES look like a CL wing. I've got nearly a dozen CL planes active and I didn't notice that. Definitely getting old.
Old 12-05-2014, 09:36 PM
  #2133  
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Ya old fart Dave!
uh never mind I was about to tangent the thread. Just wash yer classes

I have never built an I Beamer (not real sure I want to), But I hang out a lot on a couple of CL sites, so seen 'em their.

Ken
Old 12-05-2014, 09:46 PM
  #2134  
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Originally Posted by Zor
soarrich,

i do not see illustration of Jedelsky build in the two pics.

Zor
Look at the tip of the flying plane, you can just see it on the tip of the plane on the grass. The other picture is a little out of focus, it was taken while I was building it.

Hobby Lobby once had a plane almost as big as a Kadet that had a odd wing, it was just a very thick piece of wood angled up to the highpoint of the airfoil, then it had flat bottom ribs holding the sheet of wood in the front and a trailing edge. The wing was covered in Mylar, it looked easy and cheap to build, you could probably make a Kadet's wing that way if you wanted something different.
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Old 12-05-2014, 11:54 PM
  #2135  
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a few more pictures
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Old 12-06-2014, 05:24 AM
  #2136  
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I stand corrected, Zor. It was the wing airfoil that was at 1.5 degrees. I was trying to visualize the drawing from memory. I should have checked the hard copy.

I was also a draftsman for many years and graduated to CAD. I laid a lot of lead back in the day.
Old 12-06-2014, 11:11 AM
  #2137  
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Originally Posted by N1EDM

I stand corrected, Zor.

It was the wing airfoil that was at 1.5 degrees. I was trying to visualize the drawing from memory. I should have checked the hard copy.

I was also a draftsman for many years and graduated to CAD. I laid a lot of lead back in the day.
From measurements on an actual drawing of the Clark-Y airfoild that I did a while ago using the actual coordinate data we find that when the bottom surface is horizontal the actual chord of that airfoil is just about 1 1/2 degree(s).

About drafting, you and I have something in common beside ham radio. I learned drafting at technical school with drafting boards, T squares and plastic templates including some for lettering. Computer drafting came to me while working in the engineering department when not flying the corporate aircraft.

Zor
Old 12-06-2014, 11:28 AM
  #2138  
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Default Now easier to see

Originally Posted by soarrich
Look at the tip of the flying plane, you can just see it on the tip of the plane on the grass. The other picture is a little out of focus, it was taken while I was building it.

Hobby Lobby once had a plane almost as big as a Kadet that had a odd wing, it was just a very thick piece of wood angled up to the highpoint of the airfoil, then it had flat bottom ribs holding the sheet of wood in the front and a trailing edge. The wing was covered in Mylar, it looked easy and cheap to build, you could probably make a Kadet's wing that way if you wanted something different.
The new pic of the model in flight makes it easier to see but your explanation of what to look for and where sure made it easier to detect.

All I plan to modify for the wings ( initially ) is to build them in two parts so one half can be just pulled out at the joiners, add ailerons and likely flaps and add detachable working struts. Later I may build another wing in the Jedelsky style ( Junker's ). It would be most interesting I think.

Zor

Last edited by Zor; 12-06-2014 at 12:10 PM. Reason: changed aileorns to ailerons
Old 12-06-2014, 03:57 PM
  #2139  
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Count me in please. I can't imagine not having at least one Kadet Senior hanging somewhere in the shop. I believe this airplane to be the best trainer of all time! Sig kits are AAA+ in my book.
EddieMac
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Old 12-07-2014, 02:32 AM
  #2140  
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Originally Posted by EDDIEMAC
Count me in please. I can't imagine not having at least one Kadet Senior hanging somewhere in the shop. I believe this airplane to be the best trainer of all time! Sig kits are AAA+ in my book.
EddieMac
Absolutely! Welcome to the SIG Kadet Brotherhood. The Kadet's not just the best trainer out there, she's one of the most fun planes to let your imagination go wild with that you'll ever find. There don't seem to be any mods you can't make on her that don't work. A Kadet can do anything!

Those are some nice planes too. One day, when I hire a company of maids and a construction crew, my shop might look 5% as good as yours.

Naw, not a chance.

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[TD]rccrasher65[/TD]
[TD]108[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]scttsprg[/TD]
[TD]168[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]SigSenior[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]49[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]FMAY[/TD]
[TD]109[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]sbrillha[/TD]
[TD]169[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Zor[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]50[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Hrannar[/TD]
[TD]110[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Mike Gretz[/TD]
[TD]170[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]WMB[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]51[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Razor44[/TD]
[TD]111[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]skyrat71[/TD]
[TD]171[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]skimmey[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]52[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Ken Kehlet[/TD]
[TD]112[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]lumppi[/TD]
[TD]172[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]paul7194[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]53[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]oldfartpilot[/TD]
[TD]113[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]bchapman[/TD]
[TD]173[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]bebopgolf[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]54[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Soaring Steve[/TD]
[TD]114[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]scoooper[/TD]
[TD]174[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Big Stikflyer[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]55[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]freefall2907[/TD]
[TD]115[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Jolly Popper[/TD]
[TD]175[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]nealmontgomery[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]56[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]fix-n-fly[/TD]
[TD]116[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]CNY_Dave[/TD]
[TD]176[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Battle Short[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]57[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]SigMan[/TD]
[TD]117[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]rtn9105[/TD]
[TD]177[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]canadian8apilot[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]58[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]eroc144[/TD]
[TD]118[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]mbnt[/TD]
[TD]178[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]Mud Duck[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]59[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]nextofkin[/TD]
[TD]119[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]crawler tech[/TD]
[TD]179[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]EDDIEMAC[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]60[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]ALT[/TD]
[TD]120[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD]308jockey[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]




Old 12-07-2014, 06:33 AM
  #2141  
pacoflyer
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Anyone have a Mark II kit for sale??

Thanks,
paul
Old 12-07-2014, 09:02 AM
  #2142  
soarrich
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Originally Posted by pacoflyer
Anyone have a Mark II kit for sale??

Thanks,
paul

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sig-Kadet-Mk...item2c924f577b

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Sig-Kade...item3a9c966663

Was there a Sig Kadet Mk I? I remember building a Kadet that was print wood, you had to cutout a lot of the parts from sheet wood, it came with a plastic cowl that stunk when you cut it. I powered it with a OS Pet .30, you had to hit a bump in the runway for it to get off, and you had to use full power most of the time.
Old 12-07-2014, 12:32 PM
  #2143  
spaceworm
 
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Originally Posted by soarrich
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sig-Kadet-Mk...item2c924f577b

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Sig-Kade...item3a9c966663

Was there a Sig Kadet Mk I? I remember building a Kadet that was print wood, you had to cutout a lot of the parts from sheet wood, it came with a plastic cowl that stunk when you cut it. I powered it with a OS Pet .30, you had to hit a bump in the runway for it to get off, and you had to use full power most of the time.
The Mark I had a rubber banded on wing, a rounded vertical stabilizer and no ailerons. I don't know if it was formally called a Mark I, since maybe they did not know there would be a Mark II then. I have a MK I fuse with a MK II wing. Will fly it next with a Saito 56.

Sincerely, Richard
Cub Brotherhood #187; Sig 1/4, H9 100 inch (Gen 1), GB Anniv Cub
Club Saito #635; Saito 56, 100, 120abc, 130T, 180
Kadet Brotherhood #96; Mk I/II Kadet, Kadet Junior,
Sig Kougar, Sig 1/4 Cub, Sig 1/4 Spacewalker II
Old 12-07-2014, 02:40 PM
  #2144  
soarrich
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Originally Posted by spaceworm
The Mark I had a rubber banded on wing, a rounded vertical stabilizer and no ailerons.
I guess mine was a MK I I built mine in about '73, 41 years ago, wow time flies.
Old 12-07-2014, 02:41 PM
  #2145  
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Originally Posted by soarrich
Was there a Sig Kadet Mk I? I remember building a Kadet that was print wood, you had to cutout a lot of the parts from sheet wood, it came with a plastic cowl that stunk when you cut it. I powered it with a OS Pet .30, you had to hit a bump in the runway for it to get off, and you had to use full power most of the time.
Hey Rich, that was the original 1973 Kadet, SIG-RC31. The Mk-II came out in 1980, kit SIG-RC49, and the Mk-I came out just after that - a re-release of the original 1973 kit, kit SIG-RC51.

The entire SIG line (well, about 99% of it anyway) is in my old website, starts at http://www.wanderings-ds.com/whs/sig-history-1.html

BTW, Mk-II kits are still available directly through the SIG website.
Old 12-08-2014, 05:59 AM
  #2146  
pacoflyer
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Thanks guys,
I good friend of mine is trying to relive his childhood and build a Mark II.
I'll forward this on to him...
Old 12-08-2014, 06:17 AM
  #2147  
acdii
 
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Nice workshop. Mine is getting crowded now with 3 work benches. Have the big heavy 4'X6' one that I do most of the work on, and added 2 36x80 ones for building on. There is a Kadet LT-25 being built on one, the other is holding the remnants of my SIG Cub build, which is nearly complete. I had to run out and get a new tail brace kit, the one that came in the kit did not work, the clevises are so hard I snapped a bit trying to open the holes for the bolts, and then snapped them trying to bend the ends to fit. I had done such a nice job soldering them together too. Using a cable brace system instead. Once that is done, hopefully tomorrow, on to finishing my Corsair, then my P-51. After that I have a SIG Citabria, or I may get another 1/5th Cub and do the Biper Cub I have in mind.
Old 12-08-2014, 06:41 AM
  #2148  
Zor
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Greetings to all,

Reminiscing about the past, a long time ago, and reliving some of the past experiences is a most enjoyable activity.

Now that the cats' winter house is finished and placed outdoor I am devoting hobby time to pursue the Kadet Senior preparation to build the wings. The second rib to recieve the struts is done. The joiners are ready for cementing using the old 30 min epoxy that has now proven to still work well and harden solidly.

I am working on drafting the mods to the wing roots and fuselage for bolting and devices to prevent ( at least reduce ) the possibility of the wing's leading edge and trailing edges from getting closer or further apart in a crash landing thus damaging the fuselage. This is similar to what I did with the modified Spectra.

I will not post the details nor the drawings as I did before in this thread for other modifications. I was advised to avoid doing so and I respect others outlooks.

I expect to start on the modified wings in about a week.

Zor

Last edited by Zor; 12-08-2014 at 06:46 AM.
Old 12-08-2014, 08:17 AM
  #2149  
skylark-flier
 
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Hey pacoflyer, some (most) of us haven't left our first childhood yet - nothing to relive.

And I, for one, hope that never changes. I'm too old to even THINK about growing up anymore.

The Mk-II's a GREAT airplane. It's a bit heavier (proportionately) than the other versions and if you did like I did and cut the dihedral to 1/3 what it's supposed to be, she's even more fun and capable. I'm loving mine!!!!!!
Old 12-08-2014, 09:24 AM
  #2150  
FlyerInOKC
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Originally Posted by skylark-flier
Hey pacoflyer, some (most) of us haven't left our first childhood yet - nothing to relive.
Growing old is mandatory, growing up is discretionary!


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