Where have all the builders gone
#801
It really is funny and sad sometimes when people think thats the nicest arf they have ever seen I have yet to do a rare plane from absolute scratch..
I SO WISH I KNEW 3D DRAFTING...
I SO WISH I KNEW 3D DRAFTING...
#803
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It really is funny and sad sometimes when people think thats the nicest arf they have ever seen I have yet to do a rare plane from absolute scratch..
I SO WISH I KNEW 3D DRAFTING...
Foodstick, why should not knowing 3D drafting keep you from scratch building? May's issue of Model Aviation has an article on reading drawings that gives you the basics of plans and that should serve you well as a start, just go for it, you might just surprise yourself.
I SO WISH I KNEW 3D DRAFTING...
Foodstick, why should not knowing 3D drafting keep you from scratch building? May's issue of Model Aviation has an article on reading drawings that gives you the basics of plans and that should serve you well as a start, just go for it, you might just surprise yourself.
#805
My Feedback: (-1)
It really is funny and sad sometimes when people think thats the nicest arf they have ever seen I have yet to do a rare plane from absolute scratch..
I SO WISH I KNEW 3D DRAFTING...
Foodstick, why should not knowing 3D drafting keep you from scratch building? May's issue of Model Aviation has an article on reading drawings that gives you the basics of plans and that should serve you well as a start, just go for it, you might just surprise yourself.
I SO WISH I KNEW 3D DRAFTING...
Foodstick, why should not knowing 3D drafting keep you from scratch building? May's issue of Model Aviation has an article on reading drawings that gives you the basics of plans and that should serve you well as a start, just go for it, you might just surprise yourself.
I still have my scratch building books too and often refer to them. My days of projecting plans on the wall and tracing them onto paper is also over. It was state of the art at one point though. It's how we enlarged a plane.
#806
Duncman,
I have the fantasy of being able to draw out easy building kits in 3D passing them out on the web, and seeing them built all around the world I could probably manage with a well traced hand drawn set of plans and parts.. eventually...
I just figure it would be nice if they were ready to laser cut and the parts fit perfect.
I have the fantasy of being able to draw out easy building kits in 3D passing them out on the web, and seeing them built all around the world I could probably manage with a well traced hand drawn set of plans and parts.. eventually...
I just figure it would be nice if they were ready to laser cut and the parts fit perfect.
#808
My Feedback: (7)
I like to build but I like to fly more.
Nowadays there is a huge surplus of really great airplanes for super cheap.
A lot of old timers are passing and this leaves a ton of airplanes to flood the market.
Nothing against builders. I love to build when I have time. However, I would rather be flying.
The surplus is a big plus for me. I have acquired a ton of really amazing aircraft which I did not build. I absolutely love flying them.
I love the hobby. Hope the builders continue. Don't hate me because I would rather fly than build.
I have had the chance to fly hundreds of planes that I would never have had time to build.
Nowadays there is a huge surplus of really great airplanes for super cheap.
A lot of old timers are passing and this leaves a ton of airplanes to flood the market.
Nothing against builders. I love to build when I have time. However, I would rather be flying.
The surplus is a big plus for me. I have acquired a ton of really amazing aircraft which I did not build. I absolutely love flying them.
I love the hobby. Hope the builders continue. Don't hate me because I would rather fly than build.
I have had the chance to fly hundreds of planes that I would never have had time to build.
#811
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Hey Rick,
I'm with you, for me it's butcher paper, drafting ruler, and a calculator. All I need is a good 3 view with cross sections and I'm set! All three of these are 1/4 scale built from a 3-view, I flew the Fiat CR-32 t a fourth place in Masters at Top Gun this year so I'm thinking that I must be doing something right
Larry B
I'm with you, for me it's butcher paper, drafting ruler, and a calculator. All I need is a good 3 view with cross sections and I'm set! All three of these are 1/4 scale built from a 3-view, I flew the Fiat CR-32 t a fourth place in Masters at Top Gun this year so I'm thinking that I must be doing something right
Larry B
Last edited by lawrence b; 05-17-2015 at 06:26 PM.
#813
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Cashpoboy, I don't think anyone will hold your purchase practice against you, heck, I would think we all are guilty of that to some degree.
Let's clarify something here, there is fundamental difference between 3-view and 3-D. 3-view is still a 2 dimensional drawing just looking at a subject from a different perpendicular direction, in other words, still an X - Y axis, no depth. 3-D or 3 Dimensional adds the Z - axis to the equation and gives the 2 - D drawing depth. To give a proper rendition of the subject it often skewed off the horizontal and depicts the unseen side of the subject and essentially removes the need for 3-view. 3-D has been around forever but only has recently become practical with advances in CAD software and CNC software, now a very desirable format.
There is a lot of free CAD software out there and what they want you to do is use the free software and learn it so you will come back and buy the full program (sort of "first one is free" concept). All are simple to use and have good help menus and are more than powerful enough to design anything we need for models, and if you are lucky enough to have someone in your area that has a CNC Laser Cutter you can easily contract him to cut you a short kit off of your freshly drawn CAD plans, sweet. Some may even have upgraded to 3-D, even sweeter. Personally, the only thing between us and Burt Rutan is us.
A quick P.S. on the free software. Whatever program you select please read the fine print, since all are internet downloads some providers want permission on your PC's and/or place cookies, not an NSA thing, just be aware of what you are giving them access to and none I know will follow your banking transactions, these are reputable companies, they just want a market view of your activity.
Let's clarify something here, there is fundamental difference between 3-view and 3-D. 3-view is still a 2 dimensional drawing just looking at a subject from a different perpendicular direction, in other words, still an X - Y axis, no depth. 3-D or 3 Dimensional adds the Z - axis to the equation and gives the 2 - D drawing depth. To give a proper rendition of the subject it often skewed off the horizontal and depicts the unseen side of the subject and essentially removes the need for 3-view. 3-D has been around forever but only has recently become practical with advances in CAD software and CNC software, now a very desirable format.
There is a lot of free CAD software out there and what they want you to do is use the free software and learn it so you will come back and buy the full program (sort of "first one is free" concept). All are simple to use and have good help menus and are more than powerful enough to design anything we need for models, and if you are lucky enough to have someone in your area that has a CNC Laser Cutter you can easily contract him to cut you a short kit off of your freshly drawn CAD plans, sweet. Some may even have upgraded to 3-D, even sweeter. Personally, the only thing between us and Burt Rutan is us.
A quick P.S. on the free software. Whatever program you select please read the fine print, since all are internet downloads some providers want permission on your PC's and/or place cookies, not an NSA thing, just be aware of what you are giving them access to and none I know will follow your banking transactions, these are reputable companies, they just want a market view of your activity.
#814
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Carl, What do you mean getting old! I'm only 69, just a kid, I have built since the 1950's when the kits were ink stamped on balsa and you cut everything out and the covering was silkspan.
I have always found time to build because I love the hobby so much, most of the guys in our club who say they build kits are building the ARF's, even though it takes a lot of time to do all the scale detail it still is not what I call building.
People today I think don't want to take the time to get involved in the building process, they want to fly now, not a year later.
I love to build because I like to re-engineer the kits, a lot of them have weak points that can be strengthened, and it feels good to have a model that will hold up to many years of flying without repairs.
I have nothing against people going to this ARF route, it's just not for me.
Ron
I'm building a 1/3 Waco right now and have a Mick Reeves Sopwith Strutter lined up right behind that one.
I have always found time to build because I love the hobby so much, most of the guys in our club who say they build kits are building the ARF's, even though it takes a lot of time to do all the scale detail it still is not what I call building.
People today I think don't want to take the time to get involved in the building process, they want to fly now, not a year later.
I love to build because I like to re-engineer the kits, a lot of them have weak points that can be strengthened, and it feels good to have a model that will hold up to many years of flying without repairs.
I have nothing against people going to this ARF route, it's just not for me.
Ron
I'm building a 1/3 Waco right now and have a Mick Reeves Sopwith Strutter lined up right behind that one.
#815
Cashpoboy, I don't think anyone will hold your purchase practice against you, heck, I would think we all are guilty of that to some degree.
Let's clarify something here, there is fundamental difference between 3-view and 3-D. 3-view is still a 2 dimensional drawing just looking at a subject from a different perpendicular direction, in other words, still an X - Y axis, no depth. 3-D or 3 Dimensional adds the Z - axis to the equation and gives the 2 - D drawing depth. To give a proper rendition of the subject it often skewed off the horizontal and depicts the unseen side of the subject and essentially removes the need for 3-view. 3-D has been around forever but only has recently become practical with advances in CAD software and CNC software, now a very desirable format.
There is a lot of free CAD software out there and what they want you to do is use the free software and learn it so you will come back and buy the full program (sort of "first one is free" concept). All are simple to use and have good help menus and are more than powerful enough to design anything we need for models, and if you are lucky enough to have someone in your area that has a CNC Laser Cutter you can easily contract him to cut you a short kit off of your freshly drawn CAD plans, sweet. Some may even have upgraded to 3-D, even sweeter. Personally, the only thing between us and Burt Rutan is us.
A quick P.S. on the free software. Whatever program you select please read the fine print, since all are internet downloads some providers want permission on your PC's and/or place cookies, not an NSA thing, just be aware of what you are giving them access to and none I know will follow your banking transactions, these are reputable companies, they just want a market view of your activity.
Let's clarify something here, there is fundamental difference between 3-view and 3-D. 3-view is still a 2 dimensional drawing just looking at a subject from a different perpendicular direction, in other words, still an X - Y axis, no depth. 3-D or 3 Dimensional adds the Z - axis to the equation and gives the 2 - D drawing depth. To give a proper rendition of the subject it often skewed off the horizontal and depicts the unseen side of the subject and essentially removes the need for 3-view. 3-D has been around forever but only has recently become practical with advances in CAD software and CNC software, now a very desirable format.
There is a lot of free CAD software out there and what they want you to do is use the free software and learn it so you will come back and buy the full program (sort of "first one is free" concept). All are simple to use and have good help menus and are more than powerful enough to design anything we need for models, and if you are lucky enough to have someone in your area that has a CNC Laser Cutter you can easily contract him to cut you a short kit off of your freshly drawn CAD plans, sweet. Some may even have upgraded to 3-D, even sweeter. Personally, the only thing between us and Burt Rutan is us.
A quick P.S. on the free software. Whatever program you select please read the fine print, since all are internet downloads some providers want permission on your PC's and/or place cookies, not an NSA thing, just be aware of what you are giving them access to and none I know will follow your banking transactions, these are reputable companies, they just want a market view of your activity.
Can you name a few of the CAD programs that are user friendly. I tried to use Compufoil to generate fuselage bulkheads along the entire length of the my fuselage project and is was not exactly what I wanted.
#816
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I have been building and flying r/c airplanes since the 60's. Started with a Sig Kadet and built many kits afterwards. When the kids got bigger and their activities took up more time (and money), I cut way back on my hobby. I started back up again and was blown away by the progress made in the electric motors, the 4 stroke engines and especially, the radios and receivers. I live on my 400 acre farm and have my own 500' grass runway and a 14 acre watershed pond to fly off of. I have trained about 60 pilots over the years and I still get to do the maidens on new aircraft. I only build the ARFs now because I'm 70 years old and don't think I have the time left to do all of the projects I still dream of. I have 19 flyable airplanes, 2 partially built kits to finish and 6 more still in the box. I tried to collect all of the H9 warbirds and have most of them. I have an 85" Yak 54 with a DA 50 on it but have not got around to getting it in the air yet. I spent 3 years building a 90" P 38, even though it was an ARF, it took that long for me to find the engines, and other equipment at the price I was willing to pay. Everything I do is not over half price so I have to be patient. I love to go to the giant scale meets and ALL other events within a few hours driving distance. I do not belong to a club but am an AMA member. It is very hard to find anyone anymore that is capable of building in my area. The electric park flyers are the big thing and most give up after a crash. I am not a builder of kits anymore but I have a lot of experience in rebuilding after a crash and all of my planes fly better afterwards. I had an operation 3 years back that kept me off my feet for about 4 months so I got interested in helicopters. It took me 3 years and a thousand dollars to learn how to hover, all on my own without help. I am an expert rebuilder of helicopters now too! Happy flying everyone!
#819
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Sierratango, I've used 3 programs over the years, AutoCAD has a free version for students and occasional users (used too) which is the best and most capable, Bentley Micro Station which no longer supports a free version but is more civil oriented anyway, Corel Draw has a free version, used to be too basic for anything more than interior decorating but have expanded their program significantly to be effective for our purposes. It is hard to recommend any one program over another, the best advice I guess is to say that all the programs have similar basic functions and commands (wasn't always so but the industry self corrected to a point, they all still want the better mousetrap), which follows Auto Cad protocols to various degrees, so there is a familiarity in the icons. So it would be wise to suggest reading some descriptive and the permissions of several programs and pick a subject matter and try them out, the one you connect with the best is the one you obviously want. I prefer Auto Cad and have the LT version I purchased a while back ($1,700.00 at the time) and the free version which is very similar, but be aware of the permissions as they are extensive. Hope this helped a little. Good hunting and have fun.
#820
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Most people are giving their opinions on which way the hobby has progressed through the years, I have nothing against U-Control, Free Flight, Helicopters, or any form of modeling, it's just a friendly conversation about the change in the way the model industry has gone.
I build all my aircraft, because I get the satisfaction of doing a complete ground up build, there are a lot of hours put in before you get to the step of covering.
Ron
#821
My Feedback: (-1)
There are always some who can't or don't read the title of the thread, We call these people Snarks. Happens all the time.
This morning I was out flying mt little ARF electric and my scratch built Roar. Between flights my friend and I would sit and watch the U-Control stunt pilots. A very nice morning but we both agree, if we tried to fly a U-Control the plane would be in the ground in about 6 laps and we would be on the ground loosing out breakfast.
I'm assembling an ARF right now, just waiting for the epoxy to set up.
This morning I was out flying mt little ARF electric and my scratch built Roar. Between flights my friend and I would sit and watch the U-Control stunt pilots. A very nice morning but we both agree, if we tried to fly a U-Control the plane would be in the ground in about 6 laps and we would be on the ground loosing out breakfast.
I'm assembling an ARF right now, just waiting for the epoxy to set up.
HoundDog, who said anything about builders being better than ARF flyers, no one is bashing anyone, the question was "what happened to all the builders''.
Most people are giving their opinions on which way the hobby has progressed through the years, I have nothing against U-Control, Free Flight, Helicopters, or any form of modeling, it's just a friendly conversation about the change in the way the model industry has gone.
I build all my aircraft, because I get the satisfaction of doing a complete ground up build, there are a lot of hours put in before you get to the step of covering.
Ron
Most people are giving their opinions on which way the hobby has progressed through the years, I have nothing against U-Control, Free Flight, Helicopters, or any form of modeling, it's just a friendly conversation about the change in the way the model industry has gone.
I build all my aircraft, because I get the satisfaction of doing a complete ground up build, there are a lot of hours put in before you get to the step of covering.
Ron
#823
My Feedback: (6)
I agree there are threads out there for that. I'm the lazy type of builder, if I need something my LHS doesn't carry I just call him up and have him order it for me. I don't even order direct from Fiberglass Specialties. His pricing is always competitive and if advise and troubleshooting are free. If I do spend a few extra pennies well it keeps him around.
#825
My Feedback: (23)
None are "user friendly" as your not going to be able to just open the program and start designing airplanes. These programs will require HOURS of learning before you'll have the knowledge base of designing an airplane from a set of 3-views.
I have been using solidworks for 6-7 years now and routinely put on average 20 hours a week on it doing RC stuff. A few years ago, it was more like 40-60hrs a week for 2 years. I have just now gotten to the point where i feel confident enough to design an airplane completely from scratch.
That said, none of them are overly hard to use either, they just have a very steep learning curve that takes a lot of dedication to get to the pount of levelling off.