SilverEagle2

My Feedback: (9)

When/Where is the best to use an Aliphatic Resin?

When/Where is the best to use CA?

What are the advantages/disadvantages to either?

I have built a number of planes and always used CA with no problems.

Thanks

quint-rcu

My Feedback: (24)

Here is the first 2 cents worth...

Yellow glues are easy to sand when joining sheets edge to edge, let you move parts around to align before setting and can be applied to areas where there will be no access after fitting a part. On the negative side is that the work must be fixed and held in place while it dries.

CA is quick and in the case of fast (thin) CA it can be 'wicked' into a joint after the pieces are aligned. The negatives are some odor and short set times that require precise alignments. Also it emits strong fumes when cut with a Dremel abrasive disk.

Don't forget epoxies that bond plywoods, plastics and metals... A good build job uses them all.

quint

Oh yes, I forgot the specialty adhesives like Gorrilla glue, canopy glues, etc.

ramcharger

Normally I use the aliphatic glues because its cheaper, sands well, and I see no reason to be in a hurry. However, if the piece to be glued requires extensive pinning, rubber bands or whatever to hold in place while the glue is drying I use thin CA. This applies to planking on the front and trailing prortion of the wing, planking on the top of the fuselage, and stringers that need to be bent. I also use 5 and 12 minute epoxy a lot. I use them all. They all work but CA and epoxies are much more expensive than aliphatics.

Intruder38

All of the above are good advice. Be wary, however, of the way you use CA. I used it in any and all applications for at least five years, before I developed an allergic reaction to the stuff. Now, one whiff is all it takes to bring on asthmatic bronchitis, with all its effects, for a week to ten days. Thin plus kicker is the worst of all.
For me,, the aliphatic resins are the best compromise, but the odorless CA does do a passable job in a lot of applications. Good luck and keep building.

rajul

My Feedback: (58)

Is the adhesive strength of the odorless CA less than conventional CA ? Any other tradeoffs ? Thanks.........................

GrnBrt

My Feedback: (5)

First off, never but never use kicker with thin as it cooks like crazy and just isn't needed. User friendly Ca is usually quite a bit more expensive and the life span seems to be short. I use the glue that I import from Australia now and it has proven to me to be the best user friendly Ca that I have ever used.

quint-rcu

My Feedback: (24)

Art is correct as usual, yet most modellers won't have a problem with conventional CA as long as they use it in a well ventilated space and keep their noses out of the fumes Paint thinners and even contact cements may kill off those brain cells (I can't spare even one more...) Follow his advice, but if you use the regular stuff place a fan to blow any fumes away from you.

quint

Intruder38

User-Friendly CA does have some trades to consider. Probably the most frustrating is variable set time. I've tried several brands; some take almost as long to set up as alaphatics. Currently using B&B Specialties Super-Gold thin with pretty good results including fairly quick set up. Anchor Bond odorless sets up really slow. Hot Stuff UFO lies somewhere in between. One problem I have run into lately is finding user-friendly CA in my local hobby shops. They complain that the shelf life is too short for them to keep in stock. I have found that it does gel a lot quicker than the regular CA I resort to when nothing else will do.

As for relative strengths, I haven't conducted any tests that would produce an opinion one way or the other. When it works, the U-F seems to do the job.

By the way, I have used fans, even limited my use of regular CA to outdoors. As I said, even the slightest whiff sets me off.

Would like to know what User-Friendly brands get high marks from the builders.

r1morris

My Feedback: (1)

Like so many others that have been in this hobby for some time CA goes get to most after awhile. I build with it but mostly the slower or gel so I can walk away for a bit to let it cure. A number of years ago I learned to use Aliphatic Resin glues with heat to build a bit faster and do away with a lot of CA . When planking leading and trailing areeas of the wing I lay a thin bead of glue everywhere the sheeting will touch then I take the sheeting and press into place so that the matting surfaces touch each other. I left up the sheeting and with a finger spread the glue to a thin layer same for the wing structure. it only takes a very thin layer . Then wait till the glue sets but is still a bit damp . indorrs about 10 min . Get out the Sealing iron turn it on med to high heat and iron the sheeting down. I have used this method with wood up to 1/8" and it never has failed . Saves the CA and does a good job without rushing before the CA kicks off or waiting and putting a bunch of pin holes where you don't want them.
Anyway thats my 2 cents worth.

Remember always avoid negative altitude manuvers.

Intruder38

Never heard of the aliphatic plus heat bit before, but it sounds very interesting. Wish I had this idea when I sheeted the front end of the TF Elder 40 I am building. Thanks for the input.

Rodney

The heat idea works fine on dried glue also. When putting thin cap strips on (1/16 inch thick) I often coat both the cap strip and the rib then let them dry. Now, just iron the cap strip onto the rib. It takes a pretty hot iron as you have to heat through the wood which is a pretty good insulator. You can use the heat sealing trick with alphatic resins very well on covering also. If you get a loose edge or peel back, just coat both surfaces with alphatic resin, let it dry, then iron the covering back down. It will stick better than the original backing. This technique works well on wood that has been fuel soaked also.

Joe B.

My Feedback: (1)

Am I correct in assuming alphatic resin is the same as Elmers Wood Glue?

Intruder38

I have not used Elmer's, so I can't say for sure. I suspect it is, but not all yellow glues are the same. I used one I had on the shelf that had lost its label and found it remained rubbery. It holds fine, but does not like being sanded. I have used Tite-Bond(available at local hardware stores) and Great Planes Pro Glue (More expensive) with much success.

banktoturn

Aliphatic resin, epoxy, polyurethane, and CA are all stronger than the wood you are gluing, if you get good contact. For environmental and health reasons, I like to use aliphatic resin whenever I can make it work. For pieces that are hard to clamp, it is much easier to use CA, because it is so fast. If it absolutely needs to be fuelproof, then epoxy is best. I do avoid aliphatic resin for large areas where the water may cause a warping problem, but I seem to read about a lot of people using it for sheeting, so it must not be as big a problem as I have always thought. Titebond II is a waterproof aliphatic resin. I have begun using it for everything, since it never hurts to have a waterproof joint, and the woodworking guys seem to swear by it.

banktoturn

Steve Lewin

I like to use mainly aliphatics. Where it might be tricky clamping or pinning the joints it's often possible to put the aliphatic on leaving a couple of dry spots which you can hit with a drop or two of thin CA just to keep the parts together until the aliphatic dries. Best of both worlds.

Steve

CHOCOFAN

I've used alsfaltic resin a few time's already & it works for me, i mainly use it on sheeting doublers,sheeting the wing & the tail pretty efective, the balsa seem's to soak it up very good.with some sand bags on it. and let it dry over nite.

Rex

My Feedback: (18)

I've really been impressed with Pica's Gluit. I picked up a bottle at Joe Nall a few years back and must say it by far the fastest setting aliphatic I've used (in comparison to Titebond and Elmers). I previously used alipahtics for sheet joining, but this stuff is so fast I use it for general construction, with the exception of epoxies for firewall, landing gear mounts, and spar joining.

Pica's info:


Gluit has satisfied model builder’s and crafts enthusiast for over twenty years. Its formulation, stressing quality over cost factors makes Gluit the strongest PVOH aliphatic glue in the market place. This standard of quality has proven its worth with Gluits ability to sand without gumming up the paper. Testing has always proven that Gluit out performs the "Watered down" glues in areas such as wet tack, assembly time, peel strength, shear strength and flexibility.

JetAwithPrist

I vote for Gluit also. Its fast, bonds tight, and goes on easy. The only thing you have to be carefull of that i found was big jobs. Its just dries/cures too fast at least for my application speed on a large joint.

I probably use CA more than i should, but i am going to try and use aliphatic more after hearing you guys talk about reactions to it. I am starting to get allergic to epoxies so i try to wear latex gloves when working with it. From what i understand, with epoxy, if you work with it enough, you WILL become allergic to it. Everyone has a different tolerance though. CA glues are probably the same.