barndawg77

I've been flying for a few years, can assemble an ARF...now I want to learn to turn sticks and parts into an airplane for the following reasons: I love airplanes!!! More importantly (or not), to be able to fix what's broken when I make a mistake, and I need something to do when it's cold outside! I have a brother that's into building already, and our father was a builder / flyer so we have tools and some basic knowledge...so my question is : What would be a good first kit? I want something that has a wingspan in the neighborhood of 60 inches or bigger. Any advice and sugestions are welcome and definately appreciated!

Campgems

Good on you

The Sig 4*60 is a very good kit. Modern Laser cut parts and a well engineered design, in addition to being a very fun plane to fly. It's just about impossible to screw it up if you follow the instructions exactly. They even warn about building two left sides or two right wings, which you can do if you are not carefull. Anyway, the kit will give you a well built kit, and require you to just about everything you would do in building more complex kits.

The next step would ba a scratch, or build from plans. A lot of the plans avaiable are old school designs, but taking what you learned from building the 4*60, it is easy to translate the old designs to a more modern and much lighter plane.

Jump into the pond, the waters great.

Don

Star7

I have to second the SIG suggestion. Lots of kits have come my way but the wood in the SIG kits seems the most consistently good. The 4* series has sensible instructions without foggy areas. The SSE and the astrohog are fun as well but a (small) step up in building skill.

MinnFlyer

My Feedback: (4)

Something else to consider is the Sig Wonder.

It's a lot smaller than what you're looking for, but it will teach you tons of skills in a short time.

The other advantages are:

It's inexpensive, so it won't break the bank (even if you have to buy a small engine)

You'll get a chance to practice skills like; sheeting a leading edge, sanding a nose and wingtips to shape, Covering, etc And due to its small size, none of these tasks will over-tax your patience.

Any mistakes can be a learning experience and if they are major mistakes, you haven't ruined a really nice or expensive plane.

And once it's done, it's a blast to fly!

Now you can decide if you enjoyed the building process and plan for something more challenging for next year's build!

foodstick

The ultrasport kits are nice as well.. And both the 4star and ultrasport are easy to reshape the hood and turtle deck, letting you make custom looking planes easily without effecting the flight characteristics.....

Redback

Not sure about the Ultra Sport as a first plane. There's an awful lot of balsa bashing to do compared to something like a 4*

Great model though, I'm just finishing off a US60 which will be my fourth (2 "real" ones and 2 USPlus)

Terry

Insanemoondoggie

I think with all the balsa carving and fuse fillets and bellypan , the US might be a challege for soneones first kit. The Sig 4 * and SSE,s are very easy kits to build but I,m not sure where your going to find them. Has Sig got the issues straightened out yet?

EscapeFlyer

My Feedback: (1)

Goldberg Tiger 60.

Don41

You can't go wrong with a Sig kit. Just follow the instructions and take your time.
The wood and instructions are always first rate. I build an occasional TopFlite, good but not as good as Sig.

Sig's Spacewalker II is a kit with tons of sticks and pre-cut parts yet not too difficult to build. It has a 7 foot wingspan and will require a fairly large engine. You just need the basic set of hand tools and sanding sticks to build it. The 1/5 scale Cub is also a great kit but I think it's more complex and you'll end up with a gentle high wing plane. I suspect you want something more. Of course, the Cub is a pretty plane and it will fly just fine on a 52 size four stroke which might be attractive, depending on the engines you own.

BTW: Depending on which ARFs you have built I'd say you are probably a better builder than you think. If you have ever correctly assembled, and corrected the problems of a piece of cr*p that someone like NitroPlanes sells then you have to have something going for yourself as a builder.

Regards

MinnFlyer

My Feedback: (4)

I hear this quote so often and it just makes my skin crawl.

Maybe not with Sig's NEWER kits, but their older kits haven't been updated since the 60's and are "Builder's Kits" in the truest sense of the word.

Navy18

My Feedback: (4)

Bang-for-the-buck with great results in both building and flying has to be the Sig four-star60 option. I have seen some "less-than-straight" builders end-up with still respectable flyers... if built on a flat surface, you can't lose. Servo in wing design is done for you and straight forward build concepts are taught. I have built four 4stars and will probably build another since they are fun to bash.

Don41

I recommend Sig because, like any “older� builder I have been exposed to a lot of kits and Sig has never been a disappointment to me. I can’t say the same for others.

If the barndawg wishes to delve into building then I still think he should go to Sig first. Possibly a simple build like a FourStar but I got the impression he wants to be surrounded by “sticks� and cutouts which is why I might have gone a little crazy with my recommendations (:-).

Regards

twn

The main problem with arfs is that people don’t get the “essential� building skill needed for this hobby, then like you they decide to build from a kit and are forced into a beginner corner again in the sense that the easier kits tends to be the beginner plane… It can be frustrating and depressing.

If you are already skilled in flying you should put some thought into what kind of plane you are willing to settle with because 4-stars, tigers and such are beginner to intermediate fliers. They are an easier kit to build. However they might not be desirable for you in the air. If you are ok with possibly not getting much (in the air) from your first kit then go for the simple kit. It is also nice if you have other people who are willing to buy your planes when you are done with them!

Something else to think about is not getting into bad habit planes. You see them at lots of events. Somethin extra, twist etc.. Stay away from fun fly planes. They teach you bad habits like twitchy flying or stick banging. I found out the hard way just how hard it was to remove the twitchy flying. That ruined me for 3 months and once in a while I still find my self stick banging. For me 3 months is a long time as I fly a lot. My new imac buddy slaps me hard with the pattern stick when I do it. If you have been flying for 2 years you will still be in that critical stage where planes can influence your flying.

Where do you want to go with your flying skills? Have you thought about pattern or imac. (You would want to learn pattern before imac of course.) If this interests you then an ultra sport (built-up-wing) or a king kobra (foam-core-wing) or kougar (foam-core-wing) is a good place to start. The sig kits (kobra-kougar) will be harder to build in the sence that the instruction is limited with balsa shaping etc.. The ultra sport probably has better instruction. There are also links on rcu to other old school pattern fliers too. Building a pattern ship and not overpowering it can teach you some pretty serious skills like maintaining energy with accuracy. This builds skill that produces fluidic maneuvers.

If you are concerned with biting off more than you can chew with the kit you go with. Do it as a build thread, specifically ask for help with your progress. In fact ask with every step. There are many people here who are itching to help.

MinnFlyer

My Feedback: (4)

Well, let me clarify my view on Sig kits...

If you were to take a Goldberg kit, ANY Goldberg kit, you would find a Fuse that is constructed of lite-ply with interlocking pieces.

If you were to look at any Great Planes kit, you would find a similar situation.

Sig on the other hand, has kits like the LT-40, the 4* or the Something Extra which, like GP and Goldberg, all use modern building techniques and are a joy to build.

However...

If you chose a Sig Seniorita, you would find yourself with a box of sticks that need to be cut-to-size, pinned to the plans and glued together to form a fuselage side. This is a MUCH more intensive build than many of today's kits.

Furthermore, a Sig, 1/5 scale Cub is all laser-cut parts and well engineered for an enjoyable build. but their 1/4 scale cub is a "builder's kit" which has fuse formers whose shapes are printed on a piece of balsa which you must cut out yourself (No easy task if you don't have a scroll saw) and wing tips that are 4 rectangular strips which must be laminated in place, and then carved and sanded to shape. Not to mention the fact that with any "Builder's Kit" the instructions are very vague and can easily confuse a novice.

So, what I am getting at is: While Sig kits are excellent, some are much more difficult to build than others - especially for a first-time builder.

Therefore, I just like to point out the fact that the phrase, "You can't go wrong with a Sig kit" is very misleading.

The first-time builder can't go wrong with many of Sig's kits - he just needs to know which ones he will not tear his hair out over.

Lnewqban

barndawg77,

You can find excellent articles about model building at this site:

http://www.airfieldmodels.com/

impulse09

My Feedback: (3)

Uproar 40

foodstick

try building that 1/6th piper cub

Man , I have built LOTS of kits..but that thing is a BUILD! However that being said it builds LIGHT. I was told by someone that it is a kit designed in the 50's and I believe it. Back when I was in a building frenzy I actually built that thing, flew it and sold it...just to get something new to build. Wish I had kept it sometimes. It was a very nice flying plane.

SeamusG

Do your homework. There are a ton of build threads on RCU. RCKen did a very nice build thread for a SIG LT-40. Not suggesting the LT-40, just suggesting that you read the thread - good tips-n-techniques. Find out where others had issues and how they resolved them. What tools are necessary and what tools are nice to have.

When it comes to covering - simple - listen to or ask help from MinnFlyer. He's done some super videos.

The reference to airfieldmodels.com is an excellent suggestion.

If you want your RCU friends lookin' over your shoulder and have a digital camera, do a build thread. Others will be more than happy to follow along and promptly answer your questions so that you can keep the build movin' along.

Oh yea, enjoy!

ArcticCatRider

My Feedback: (6)

While the Ultrasport is a great flyer...it is NOT a good first kit. In fact, you better know what you're doing before you tackle an Ultrasport....it is not a "checklist" kit like the 4 Star kit is. In fact, alot is left up to builder discretion. There is A LOT of sanding/shaping to do on an Ultrasport. As a first kit, it would probably drive you nuts.

foodstick

I admit its been years since i built an ultrasport, But I don't recall them being so difficult? I have quite a bit of building time before that though so I might not have noticed at the time.

The four star is quite straight forward with great instructions as noted.

If he can find a midstar somewhere that might be a good kit, I have built one of them ,and most people think they actually fly better than the four star.

My first rc kit was a sig seniorita after building TONS of stick and tissue stuff. So I may not have realized the learning curve of going from arfs, to an ultrasport,

I sure wish there was a huge shop around here where guys could get together and build all winter long.

Navy18

My Feedback: (4)

The MidStar 40 is an excellent choice... I bought an extra one to have in my "in-box" collection when I saw how well she flew; and your correct, when I got my hands on the sticks, they do fly every bit as nice if not better than the 4stars... just not available in a 60 size. It also lends itself to a nice "bash" into a shoulder winged aerobat.

twn

The midstar is a "FANTASTIC" sport flier and an easy checklist type build. It will knifedge until the cows come home. It will even do rolling circles! I overpowered the snot out of mine with a pumped 60 and eventually enlarged the ailerons with massive throw and installed 2 aileron servos but even just built as per instruction with a 46 2c or 56 4c is a very fun plane! When I sold it the new guy just used a saito fa56 and he loved it!

The guy that bought it, for him it was his first nitro plane and he learned on it (yes it was his trainer and even with that capacity is a very capable sport flier) even with the larger ailerons. He has moved on to extras and caps but still wishes that he still had it. He lost it due to radio interference with the Optic 6 tx. We all had Optic 6 radios and all had periodical strange interference with the hitec Optic and we all eventually went with Futaba and Spectrum 2.4.

This plane has a 65" wingspan so really it is close to a 60 size bird.

Some of you will say "a 60 on a midstar?? OMG" Honestly with the 60 it was a lot of fun. I have TRIED to snap the wing in half by doing (with the enlarged 2" ailerons & 1.5" of throw) full powered full throw snap rolls and full powered extremely sharp banks split-s and imelmans and she held together. I put at least 400+ flights on her with the 60 and the guy I sold it to put about 100 on it. She was a very strong plane.

If I can find some photos of it I will post them but I think they are from during and after I moded it. I don't have any of the actual build.

foodstick

I did actually see one snap a wing off at about 100 foot once..it ended ugly! This guy used to just torture that plane. He would break it and reglue on his tailgate and go right back up.

One day a guy says to him, "didn't you just use epoxy on that? "

His plane is out flying stunts over the field.....

He smiles and says "yeah" ..."It should be cured in about 2 minutes!"

Daddyo57

My Feedback: (15)

I second the Goldberg Tiger 60, it is easy to build but not too easy... the 4* are also great too. there is lots of good info to be had on basic building techniques and no need to go whold hog and break the bank either. A good flat building board with , Celotex, Balsa or drywall to pin into and a good Zona saw with a miter box and you are on your way. Enjoy your first building experience!!!!!! when you get to the Monokote it might be a good idea to have a guy with experience show you or just read up about it here. Have fun! it is relaxing and gratifying.

barndawg77

Well I committed to the build and bought a Sig midstar today. I have mainly low wing planes, so I went with something different. Plus, I have a soft spot for odd looking aircraft...haha! So, I'm looking at the magnetic building tables and I'm thinking of going that direction...what do y'all think?