LMH Helicopter Discussion of all LMH helicopters both electric and glow.

cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

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Old 11-07-2003, 06:15 PM
  #26
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Darth, you can get the clutch bells in several different teeth count. Off road racers change gear ratios this way all the time. Notasme has used an Associated clutch so apparently it is the same pitch as the LMH main gear and bell. I also know that Traxxas clutch bells are the same pitch as the LMH because I have one. The car clutches are mechanically superior because they don't use flex points that will fatigue and crack. Traxxas clutches are basically two shoes held together by an encircling spring. You can even change the clutch engagement rpm by shortening the spring. There are even racing clutch shoes that allow engines to gain mid rpm before engagement. The clutch bells are supported by two ball bearings. It's all so cool that the LMH may work with this equipment. If an easy modification can done then I know that it is in all of our best interest. My vmax7 has and is doing well......but I think the O.S. CV engines are far better than the Norvels. Like you I wonder about the mounting of the CV engine like the vmax7 but notasme may be correct about keeping the heatsink mass close to the center line of the heli. When I try this I may make my first attempt with the engine mounted LMH traditional. This is all so awesome!
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Old 11-07-2003, 07:47 PM
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Spfdrek, Darth, Lyk2fly,


Spfdrerk, you are correct the longer shaft is for the cone start. I thought about the rear exhuast but I did nt want to deal with how to mount it. There are some other mufflers for the side mount that I think could workout better then the one I have but this was a matter of availability and time. Today was to cold and to windy to fly. Maybe yet this weekend (can't wait).

Darth, I have the CP mod built and sitting ton the bench. I like to make one change at a time and prove it in before making another change.

Lyk2fly, I agree with what you have said about the clutch. Also I feel that haveing baerings in the engine if far better then bushings (like v7). I also thing that haveing bearings supporting the clutch is better and puts less strsee on the shaft.

I think that you could use the starter cone from the v7 by drilling it out. You may also find that a small local machine shop would turn the shaft for you (if you wanted to go that route). I know many people that fly heli's have bought small lathes or have friends that have one. I have made parts for people that I have flown with and after they worked with me on making parts went out and bought a lathe. You can get some nice small lathe's that for under $400.00. Once you have one you would be suprized how many thing you will use it for.
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Old 11-09-2003, 03:51 PM
  #28
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Darth, Lyk2fly,

Today I had one of the kids do two Vid’s. This is with a new mod. (to address one of Darth’s concerns) I mad a mod to the LMH clutch to make it work with the OS 12cv.

The first with 4-degree blade grips, the second with 6-degree blade grips. I like the 6-degree better.

I bored the clutch to 5mm. and turned a new shaft that fits the lmh clutch bell.

I flew yesterday but did not get a vid. The Associated clutch worked just fine. I checked the pitch and it is 15t 32p. I think that I would like a 14t better. Maybe when I get to the LHS.

I wanted to try the LMH clutch since I could make the mod I did. I think with the LHM 9T the engine rev’s to high, but, there is of course less load.

If someone wants these and either has a place to put them or wants them email let me know. I do not see how to post them here.
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Old 11-10-2003, 01:08 AM
  #29
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

How large are the vids?

I could host them on a high speed server for a while. If size is a problem I could also possibly convert them to a smaller format if desired. Drop me an email if you are interested.

For what it is worth,
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Old 11-14-2003, 07:10 PM
  #30
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

notasme, I want to try the video but I have a "crappy" computer. I still might try to run it......let me know how to go about this or email it to me.
Thanks,
Mark
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Old 11-15-2003, 09:52 AM
  #31
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Lyk2fly,

I am working on getting the size of the video reduced so that I can get them posted on the web. Once I get the size down I am going to email them to Sprio. He has a place to post them. Right now to two ~90 sec. are about 30meg each and that is just two big to email or post.
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Old 11-24-2003, 11:01 AM
  #32
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Lyk2fly,

I am still waiting on the video for the person I gave the files to. He has another project that he need to complete before he gets to mine. When he is done we should have a file that can be put on a sever that will not take 2hrs to download.
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Old 11-26-2003, 04:12 PM
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Lyk2fly,

Today was in the 50s here and I had the day off. It was an excellent day to fly and fly I did. I finally got to put some real stick time on the os 12. Let me tell you it flies OUTSTANDING. The power seem to be twice that of the v7 even with all of the weight I have (aluminum crutch and larger battery pack 1200mah). Forward flight could be as much as twice that of the v7 and pull-out power was outstanding. The hard part is coming down, you really have to cut the power a lot, but, that is not a problem because even in a very rapid descend you just add power and your there.

I am going to put on the larger tail rotor blades (120 tr blades). I think I would like more tr power and I think this will do it.

I emailed the video clips to you (two emails 1m each). Post them if you can, Thanks.
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Old 11-26-2003, 06:52 PM
  #34
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Notasme, thanks for the update.............WOW.....that's good news! I'll see what I can do with the video clips.
Thanks again,
Mark
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Old 11-28-2003, 09:46 PM
  #35
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

The videos should be up. The downloads seem to work find, but let me know if you have any problem.

http://www.public.iastate.edu/~spiro...-deg-pitch.wmv
http://www.public.iastate.edu/~spiro...-deg-pitch.wmv


Enjoy!

Spiro


ps: Now lets see some FFF circuits
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Old 11-29-2003, 09:15 AM
  #36
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Very impressive . . . . I guess I just have to get hold of this kind of engine now!

Tony

PS: If you still have the 6-grip blades fitted and are still having trouble "getting down" maybe your 4-grips would be a better option in this respect
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Old 11-30-2003, 08:19 AM
  #37
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

T.W.

Fours do not put enough load on the engine for it to run correct, and I like the lift power the sixes provide. When you want to climb fast it can really go.
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Old 12-02-2003, 01:38 PM
  #38
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

I can't see any video....just have sound

Joey
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Old 12-02-2003, 06:18 PM
  #39
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

What are you trying to play this on? It "should" work ok on the latest windows media player, or even the ancient one I use for that matter. My buddy with a mac has some trouble with these files sometimes. Seems the good honest folk at microsoft dont always update the mac wmv player quite as often as they should.

For what it is worth,
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Old 12-02-2003, 06:25 PM
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

mac osx with the newest windows media player

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Old 12-02-2003, 06:31 PM
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Sorry to hear it. Like I said, my buddy has the same problem. He gets sound but no video, Mac OSX with latest windows media player.

I am looking right now to see if I can easily convert this into another format for you... Can you play divx files? I can do that without too much problem. Also, if you had an email account I could directly send the files to, that would helpe me out.

As far as MWV on OSX goes, if you figure anything out let me know. My buddy would be very interested

For what it is worth,
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Old 12-02-2003, 07:58 PM
  #42
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email at toloud@pop.ctctel.com

I have no divx decoders at all....Anything avi and mpg mpeg should work for me.Some wmv files I can play some I can't...its very odd.I'll have to look for a covertor of some sort.

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Old 12-04-2003, 04:36 PM
  #43
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

All,

I was just looking at ebay and there is a few 12s there for some great prices. They may be worth looking at if you are thinking about trying a conversion.
look under car, engine. (at least one is a new pull-start). These may not be the short shaft that I used but you may be able to come up with a way to use the long shaft type.
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Old 12-04-2003, 05:36 PM
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

I just bought the cv-x pull start for $40 on ebay[8D] Got a 24"x24" sheet of aluminum yesterday to make a crutch out of....Should be fun.

Joey
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Old 12-04-2003, 11:18 PM
  #45
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Curious...when you refere to making the clutch from 5/8...is that the actually flywheel by chance?I wanna know if I can use a stock associated flywheel with this setup.Also i notice on tower hobbies that the pull start and none pull start fly wheels are different sizes...anyone wanna tell me why?Thanx a bunch.....I can't wait to fly this thing...BTW is the rotor safe at the increased rpm the cv gives it?Duratrax muffler right?Whatcha think of the one from the associated dualsport?Just gathering ideas...Thanx

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Old 12-05-2003, 09:44 AM
  #46
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

spdfrek,

5/8" is the diameter of the stock I used to turn the clutch shaft from.

I am using the Associate flywheel for both the LMH clutch and the Associate clutch.

I am using a pressurized tank (Pylon SS-2) two oz tank.

The muffler I have is the Duratrax muffler (it was available and cheep).

I have not flown at full throttle yet (haven't had to). I get to about 40' up at just over 1/2 throttle and I have not bee flying at a place where I could use full power. Now I have about 1" on snow so I will not be doing any flying for sometime.

I have written some high level steps on what I did If you are interested I can email them to you (MSword). Or if you want some pics of how I assembled the frame I can email them also.
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Old 12-05-2003, 10:46 AM
  #47
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

I have word...and the pics would be great as well....I've been thinking about making a few small changes to the frame when I build it.I am going to try either mounting just like a vmax or a reverse mount....as too keep the exhaust off of everything.I figure it wouldnt be tough though,with just adding a deflector tube on whatever muffler I choose...Thanx a bunch for your help

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Old 12-05-2003, 02:45 PM
  #48
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Talked to the guys at litemachines today....They said safe mr speed is about 2200 rpm....IF you stretch the limits MAYBE 2500...lift off rpm around 1600...The stock cv is definatly going to be a bit much with even the smallest associated clutch bell at 14t...I asked about a different main gear but I guess they are hard to come by.the norvel runs at about 19krpm at full throttle...so you just gained an extra 11k...and 5 teeth...He mentioned possibly using the vmax 7 clutch and bell to at least keep the 9 teeth...Anyone have any other ideas?

Joey
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Old 12-05-2003, 04:01 PM
  #49
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

Joey,

Well two thngs
1 run on the rich side
2 you do not have to go to full throttle
set the top of the throttle at about 2/3 open
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Old 12-05-2003, 06:23 PM
  #50
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Default RE: cv 12 mounted on lmh 117

SPDFREK,

At the start of this post I wrote that I had a long talk with Paul at LMH about this conversion. I also stated that Paul said that with this engine it could ripe the rotor blades off at full throttle and tuned to its best performance.

This is NOT a cosmetic change (like a new canopy). This is a very serious mechanical change and anyone thinking about this type of modification had better exercise a great deal of caution.

This change was to use an engine that is a much better engine than a v-max. One that would run much better and not be breaking down all the time (at least until you finally get a good v=max). An engine that has a crank supported by bearing rather than bushings, and a carb. rather than exhaust restriction for throttle control.

With this change I expect that the engine will run longer between rebuilds and will be no where near as touchy as the v-max. I do not think that I will use all of the power that this engine can deliver (which far exceeds the v7).

I am NOT in any way recommending that other make this conversion!!

If someone is interested I am willing to share what I did.
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