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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 12:06 AM   
Modellbau USA



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Status: offline 		I tried to fit a mercury today on the engine mount and it is to big. Plus it would be very heavy with that engine. Do me a favor and give me a call 954-224-1700 and we can discuss an option

< Message edited by Modellbau USA -- 12/9/2010 10:25 PM >


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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 12:31 AM   
Modellbau USA



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Status: offline 		More pics of what's in the box!!! 

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 12:57 AM   
RCISFUN



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ORIGINAL: Modellbau USA

The servos used are HS225 size for the elevator and rudder, ailerons,flaps steering are standard size. As for the airplane being pre-hinged, the answer is no. The slots are cut for the hinges but not glued. Remember the wings and elevator are built up not composite. 



I don't want to start a controversy however a 225 servo on the elivator on a Turbine Jet model....really???

HS-225 Specs
Operating Speed (4.8V): 0.14sec/60° at no load
Operating Speed (6.0V): 0.11sec/60° at no load
Stall Torque (4.8V): 54.15 oz/in. (3.9kg.cm)
Stall Torque (6.0V): 66.65 oz/in. (4.8kg.cm)

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 12:59 AM   
Pepperpete



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Status: offline 		I am very surprised to see a metal wing tube instead of carbon fiber. The metal tubes on the Falcon where reported to fail and weighed much more. Will you offer carbon as an upgrade?

Hellfire and I fly from a grass field here in Kelowna and we need to see exactly what the strut and wheel package will include. There is no way we want to keep lousy wire gear on this bird. Will the strut package also come with new wheel well plastic covers to compensate for the size increase?

Thank you for answering my MANY questions as you are really doing a great job at communicating with your customer base.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 1:10 AM   
KC36330



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ORIGINAL: RCISFUN




I don't want to start a controversy however a 225 servo on the elivator on a Turbine Jet model....really???


they are close to about the same specs as JR DS3421's and i've used the 3421s on rudder/elevators/ailerons on both my TamJet A4's and a few other jets with no problems.


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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 2:56 AM   
joeflyer



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Status: offline 		I used HS225 servos on a couple of planes in the past. They do not center well and I've had several fail on me. Also if you use 6 volts they don't last very long. I would never again use them for control surfaces on any plane, let alone a jet.

Joe

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 3:12 AM   
joeflyer



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Status: offline 		I have a couple comments/suggestions after looking at the photos.

The front of the engine mount surface has the same sharp corner as the Falcon 120. Unless that area is strengthened it will crack there the first time someone bounces a landing. Have you sufficiently strengthened the rear fuse/mount area?

Hopefully the wheel/strut openings and the servo openings will not be cut out as shown in the picture. If the kit comes with the monokote intact over those areas then the builder will have the option to relocate the main wheel wells for shorter or knee action struts without having to patch the monokote. Also the plane looks a lot better if the rudder servos are on the inboard side of the booms. It would also be desireable to be able to make that modification without having to patch monokote over the servo openings on the outboard side of the booms.

Other than that it looks like a winner.

Joe

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 3:17 AM   
Pepperpete



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quote:

ORIGINAL: joeflyer

I have a couple comments/suggestions after looking at the photos.

The front of the engine mount surface has the same sharp corner as the Falcon 120. Unless that area is strengthened it will crack there the first time someone bounces a landing. Have you sufficiently strengthened the rear fuse/mount area?

Hopefully the wheel/strut openings and the servo openings will not be cut out as shown in the picture. If the kit comes with the monokote intact over those areas then the builder will have the option to relocate the main wheel wells for shorter or knee action struts without having to patch the monokote. Also the plane looks a lot better if the rudder servos are on the inboard side of the booms. It would also be desireable to be able to make that modification without having to patch monokote over the servo openings on the outboard side of the booms.

Other than that it looks like a winner.

Joe


It's just my opinion but I don't agree about having the rudder servo's on the inside. On the Falcon I had a hot start and the flame blast melted off all of the lower monocote on the tail but the elevator servo area (which is near the top) wasn't even scorched. If the rudder servo's had been on the inside of the boom in the lower position they would have been right in the way and who knows what damage would have been done. This is just my own situation and I haven't had a hotstart since but I'm glad the falcon was the way it was.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 3:28 AM   
Xairflyer



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Status: offline 		Would have preferred to see the elevator servo in the tailplane like many have done to the Falcon/bobcats much better job. Easy to modify this the same way I suppose.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 3:39 AM   
Modellbau USA



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Status: offline 		If you read my post closely I said HS225MG SIZE not that servo just that servo SIZE.  We are selling our own servo's so we will not use Hitec or any other brand by that matter.  As for the covering it is not cut so if you want to modify the plane and put the servos strapped to the turbine you as builders can do that, but the instructions will show how we recommend you build it and we will back our product as long as you build it per our instructions.  We have thoroughly tested our airplane and everything works great and does not break or fall apart. The motor mount area has been strengthened and if you install the size engine we recommend you will not have any problem.  The wing tub is a thick aluminum and has a   6 inch wood dowel that is glued on the in side. So if you bend the tub you have other problems to deal with!!! 


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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 3:43 AM   
Pepperpete



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ORIGINAL: Modellbau USA

If you read my post closely I said HS225MG SIZE not that servo just that servo SIZE.  We are selling our own servo's so we will not use Hitec or any other brand by that matter.  As for the covering it is not cut so if you want to modify the plane and put the servos strapped to the turbine you as builders can do that, but the instructions will show how we recommend you build it and we will back our product as long as you build it per our instructions.  We have thoroughly tested our airplane and everything works great and does not break or fall apart. The motor mount area has been strengthened and if you install the size engine we recommend you will not have any problem.  The wing tub is a thick aluminum and has a   6 inch wood dowel that is glued on the in side. So if you bend the tub you have other problems to deal with!!! 


Would that not be considerably heavier than carbon fiber for the wing tube? I suppose it's easy enough for us to swap. I bet my Falcon tube will slide right in. I also realize you guys are hitting an excellent price point here. K I'm sold. Thanks for answering all the questions. If you get a chance to show the struts/wheels that would be great but no rush.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 3:57 AM   
Modellbau USA



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Status: offline 		Again if you build the plane as per our instructions it will weight approx. 14lb. ready to fly without fuel. The wing spar weighs  3 oz I am trying to keep the cost of the kit down that is why i did not include a carbon spar. At the price we are selling this plane it is $165 dollars cheaper than the falcon 120 with the same gear which is far inferior from what this plane is.


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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 4:10 AM   
Modellbau USA



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Status: offline 		I would also like to announce  that Southern Cross RC will be our exclusive distributer for Australia and New Zealand.


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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 4:15 AM   
Pepperpete



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ORIGINAL: Modellbau USA

Again if you build the plane as per our instructions it will weight approx. 14lb. ready to fly without fuel. The wing spar weighs  3 oz I am trying to keep the cost of the kit down that is why i did not include a carbon spar. At the price we are selling this plane it is $165 dollars cheaper than the falcon 120 with the same gear which is far inferior from what this plane is.


Yup I completely understand what you are saying. I'm sold.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 4:30 AM   
dunk


 

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Status: offline 		I was wondering if you were able to come up with a solution for an AMT 180? The width of the front intake is 100mm= 3.93 inches and the min mounting width appears to be 125mm= 4.92 inches on my manual. It weighs 3.1 lbs to boot.



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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 4:52 AM   
rpat



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Status: offline 		Henry,
I am a little confused on the servos. I take it that the servos that you are talking about will not be offered as part of the kit. If that is the case I want other guys to chime in here and tell me what servos you would consider using on this bird. This will be my first jet and I know at the speed that this bird will be flying at will take some decent servos to handle the resistance from the speed.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 5:10 AM   
Modellbau USA



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Status: offline 		Well let me clear a few things up we are offering a servo package for this plane.  The servos are made by us they are all metal gear dual ball bearing servos. The are all very high quality and with stand what ever you put them through.  The servo package will cost $250 dollars that includes all servos needed for this airplane as well as extensions and a LiFe 6.6 battery.  I will not recommend anything else since we have been using our servos on everything we fly for many years. If you choose to use other brands I would steer you towards JR as a good alternative.  

As for the the AMT 180 sorry the turbine mount is made for only 3.25-3.75 engines, P60,P70,Super Bee,King Tech K-80, Wren 75, Jet Joe 1400
ah never mind JK LOL.   




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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 5:56 AM   
joeflyer



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pepperpete

quote:

ORIGINAL: joeflyer

I have a couple comments/suggestions after looking at the photos.

The front of the engine mount surface has the same sharp corner as the Falcon 120. Unless that area is strengthened it will crack there the first time someone bounces a landing. Have you sufficiently strengthened the rear fuse/mount area?

Hopefully the wheel/strut openings and the servo openings will not be cut out as shown in the picture. If the kit comes with the monokote intact over those areas then the builder will have the option to relocate the main wheel wells for shorter or knee action struts without having to patch the monokote. Also the plane looks a lot better if the rudder servos are on the inboard side of the booms. It would also be desireable to be able to make that modification without having to patch monokote over the servo openings on the outboard side of the booms.

Other than that it looks like a winner.

Joe


It's just my opinion but I don't agree about having the rudder servo's on the inside. On the Falcon I had a hot start and the flame blast melted off all of the lower monocote on the tail but the elevator servo area (which is near the top) wasn't even scorched. If the rudder servo's had been on the inside of the boom in the lower position they would have been right in the way and who knows what damage would have been done. This is just my own situation and I haven't had a hotstart since but I'm glad the falcon was the way it was.


Exactly what was melted? Mine are outboard but if I were to build another I would put them in the same location on the boom as original except inboard. Additionally I would mount them sideways, so that the servo is inside the boom. I just took some measurements off of my Falcon and that would be about 6 inches behind and about 9 inches to the right and left of the tailcone. From looking at the plane that would clearly be out of the path of any flame exiting the tailcone.

There are about 10 Falcons in my RC club and several of the guys have put them there. Some have experienced hot-starts and the only area that got torched was the bottom of the elevator stab. Sounds like your experience was different.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 6:16 AM   
Mike06659



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Status: offline 		It's a record for RCU. It took a whole five pages for the jet experts to chime in and re-engineer most of the jet. Build it per instructions and equipment and I'm sure it will be a great flyer.

Keep it simple it's suppost to be fun!!!!

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 7:14 AM   
ledd4u


 

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Status: offline 		Hit on the nail with the expert comment. Do this do that glue it here don't use that try this my way it's better this way drill here no drill no. Use this servo no try this engine what if page 4 said that why page 4 don't say this. You get it

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 7:16 AM   
doubledcom


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Henry,

I read the part where you said that the booms and rear stab are glued together and are taken off as one piece by removing the 4 boom screws from the wings. My question is, are the wings then of the plug in type and if so how are they attached to the fuse, or are the wings glued onto the fuse. I am asking this for the ease of transport and assembly at the field.

Thanks,


Dennis DeGregorio
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dennis@palosrc.com



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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 9:05 AM   
Pepperpete



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ORIGINAL: ledd4u

Hit on the nail with the expert comment. Do this do that glue it here don't use that try this my way it's better this way drill here no drill no. Use this servo no try this engine what if page 4 said that why page 4 don't say this. You get it


Hey look guys! More people just trying to get their post count up by posting absolutely nothing useful to the discussion of this new jet. Talking about what may work and what may be improved is the lifeblood of these boards. People so far are asking good honest questions. And as for re-engineering the whole aircraft? Give me a break. But hey lets get even more melodramatic!

Just move along guys or ignore the posts you don't like. Simple as that.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 10:34 AM   
ira d


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: doubledcom

Hi Henry,

I read the part where you said that the booms and rear stab are glued together and are taken off as one piece by removing the 4 boom screws from the wings. My question is, are the wings then of the plug in type and if so how are they attached to the fuse, or are the wings glued onto the fuse. I am asking this for the ease of transport and assembly at the field.

Thanks,


Dennis DeGregorio
www.palosrc.com
dennis@palosrc.com




The wings are the plug in type but I would guess they would be next to impossible to remove at the field once all your on board gear is installed I know its that way
on the Falcon 120.

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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 2:38 PM   
Modellbau USA



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Status: offline 		The booms are one piece like I have mentioned they do come off very easy with 4 screws, the wings are plug in and are held together by two screws on each wing that are also very easy to remove.  So the plane come apart fairly quickly. It is also small enough to keep built.  I have a full size SUV and it fits in there with out taking apart anything.  


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RE: The new Tornado sport jet - 11/2/2010 4:33 PM   
laserbeam


 

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Status: offline 		Those were great pictures , that is one awesome jet i can't wait to have !!! thank you Henry !!!

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