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All Forums >> Glow Engines, Gas Engines, Fuel & Mfg Support Forums >> RC Fuels >> Synthetic oil question for the experienced
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Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/12/2002 12:20:16 AM   
drywaller



Posts: 161
Joined: 1/10/2002
From: Klamath, CA, USA
Status: offline 		I want to add synthetic oil to bring the overall oil content up in my ducted fan fuel. I was told that "most any" synthetic oil will work. So, I added two ounces of Stihl synthetic oil to a gallon of Sig 15% nitro, 20% oil fuel.
The end result? Well, it looks like I added water to my fuel instead of oil. The added oil did not mix well at all. It looks as if about one oz. of the two ounces added were acually absorbed by the fuel. The rest has migrated to the walls of the container.
Any thoughts on this?
       Post #: 1

Go to the "FAQ' section - 4/12/2002 12:50:37 AM   
bob_nj


 

Posts: 3467
Joined: 12/3/2001
From: Vineland, NJ, USA
Status: offline 		Q: How come my fuel doesn't contain 2 stroke oil for my 2 stroke engine.

A: IT DOES!!! your glow fuel is designed with 2-stroke oils- the best ones out there for use in an alcohol based fuel. They are Castor oil and Synthetic Castors. Castor oil has been lubricating gasoline and alcohol based fuels since the internal combustion engine became viable. Widely used in WW I as the 2 stroke oil of choice in the rotary engines of the biplanes of the day. The 2-stroke oils you see on the shelf at the store for weed eaters and such will not work for our applications: that oil is designed to be used in gasoline in engines designed a little bit differently.

There is a plethora of plane information and a myriad of methanol facts there. Bottom line is, you need to use the proper synthetic and you'll be fine_Bob

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 2

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/12/2002 1:26:53 AM   
hauckf


 

Posts: 187
Joined: 3/1/2002
From: Decatur, AL, USA
Status: offline 		The "most any synthetic oil" advice was bad, bad, bad, but you are not the first one to make that mistake. A guy in my club tried the same thing with the same results. You must use an oil compatable with methanol, the primary ingredient in glow fuels. Klotz sells a straight synthetic called KL-200 Techniplate, and a synthetic/castor blend called KL-100 Super Techniplate. Either would work. I'm not too familiar with ducted fan engines, but why not just add castor oil to your fuel to up the percentage? Castor has a higher flash point than the synthetic oils, and is an excellent rust preventative. Castor is available from Klotz (BeNOL) and Sig.

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 3

what do I do now? - 4/12/2002 2:22:37 AM   
drywaller



Posts: 161
Joined: 1/10/2002
From: Klamath, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Thanks for answering my question. It sounds like the Klotz oil is the way to go.
So, now what do I do with this gallon of fuel that I have? Burn barrel anyone?

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 4

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/12/2002 10:37:14 PM   
1/4 flyboy



Posts: 113
Joined: 2/2/2002
From: Hill City, MN, USA
Status: offline 		Hey Drywaller

If it was mine and since spring is here you must have a brush pile that needs to be burned use it for that. just a thought. stand back when you light it though.

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 5

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/13/2002 2:12:55 AM   
drywaller



Posts: 161
Joined: 1/10/2002
From: Klamath, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Flyboy, I thought of that already but I dont have any brush to burn, not yet anyway.
I ran a couple of tanks through my OS 26 Surpass's mounted in my Twinstar. I did not notice any increase/decrease in power. The only noticable difference was the smell, oh and the dark green fuel.
Any thougths?

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 6

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/13/2002 5:54:45 AM   
1/4 flyboy



Posts: 113
Joined: 2/2/2002
From: Hill City, MN, USA
Status: offline 		Drywaller

If you really want to use it up you could get a extra fine paint strainer funnel at the auto parts store and strain the fuel to get rid of the clumps those clumps might plugs things up if you don't get rid of them,that would be my biggest concern with it.just my opinion though it's not the gospel. good luck.

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 7

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/13/2002 6:00:30 AM   
Scotty740



Posts: 645
Joined: 12/9/2001
From: Nashport, OH, USA
Status: offline 		I would try setting the jug of fuel someplace out of the way and see if the oil you added doesn't seperate to the bottom or the top. It might then be easy to poor off the fuel or oil.

_____________________________

Scott Stickle

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 8

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/13/2002 6:13:04 AM   
drywaller



Posts: 161
Joined: 1/10/2002
From: Klamath, CA, USA
Status: offline 		good idea Flyboy. Scotty740, I have the fuel sitting in the corner now. I already transferred it from one jug to another. Most of the oil has seperated from the fuel already. I have noticed that there is more oil starting to acummulate on the walls of the jug.
I will give it a week or so. If it settles by then I will strain it and use it. Otherwise, off to the brush pile it goes.

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 9

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/13/2002 7:19:33 AM   
Fuelman


 

Posts: 1009
Joined: 12/31/2001
From: Jordan, NY, USA
Status: offline 		Drywaller,
Sorry to hear of the bad experience.
I once had a guy call me that bought a case of my fuel from a hobby shop. He wanted a low nitro/ high oil (22%) ducted fan fuel and the shop did'nt have any in stock, only had the 20% oil fuel in stock. An employee (I think) recommended he purchase some 2-stroke weed eater/chain saw oil and add a few ounces of it to bump up the lube. Well, as you found out, the results are quite a bit less than acceptable. I made it right by the customer and educated him and the hobby shop a bit and hav'nt heard of that kind of problem since.

Personally, I would not use the fuel that you added the non compatable oil to. Ducted fan engines are expensive and so are the planes they fly in. No since in risking those kind of dollars when the only thing that needs to be done is get some more fuel. If you dont have any brush to burn, the contaminated fuel is a great weed killer. (not trying to add insult to injury here)

In ducted fans (I'm going to go against the grain here) I would go with a 20% oil fuel if it had AT LEAST 4% castor in it (80/20 blend) or go with a 22%-23% fuel if it was fully synthetic. I tend to really prefer the 20% oil with the castor.

The Sig fuel you started with, if it was the "Champion " blend, has a 20% oil blended at 50syn/50 castor. That would certainly work well in a properly tuned ducted fan engine. More oil will not hurt anything, if you choose to go higher.

For adding, Klotz Techniplate, Super Techniplate or BeNol, Sig castor (Bakers AA) and Blendzall Castor can be used depending on what kind of lube you want to add.


Bob,
Thanks for cutting and pasting from the FAQ's, you beat me to it.

Drywaller, if you have any further questions, feel free to privatly e-mail me. I will be more than happy to try helping you out.


Fuelman


_____________________________

Fuelman
Cooper Fuels LLC

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 10

You're Welcome Dude - 4/13/2002 9:18:26 AM   
bob_nj


 

Posts: 3467
Joined: 12/3/2001
From: Vineland, NJ, USA
Status: offline 		I'm all over it

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 11

Synthetic oil question for the experienced - 4/13/2002 11:32:04 AM   
drywaller



Posts: 161
Joined: 1/10/2002
From: Klamath, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Fuelman, thanks for the heads up. The fuel I added the oil to was the champion blend. I have read and been told to always add oil to any fuel to bring the overall oil content up to the 23% range. I was also told that the 50/50 castor/syn. blend is a great blend but adding two to three ounces of synthetic oil would be an easy way to bring up the percentages and also would not be as messy as castor. Next time I will just add the castor.

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 12

Let it be written - 4/13/2002 2:21:36 PM   
bob_nj


 

Posts: 3467
Joined: 12/3/2001
From: Vineland, NJ, USA
Status: offline 		I used to do the same thing by adding castor to each and every gallon of fuel to be on the safe side of things. I don't do that anymore! I didn't know it then, but it was actually making some of my engines run worse and perform badly. Some of the bigger engines out there now don't like too much oil. Moki and Super Tigre come to mind immediately. My smaller Rossi and MVVS ran and transitioned much much better when I went to a total of 17% oil with 1/5 of that being castor. Too much oil also accelerates the formation of carbon deposits and all of the malaties that go along with them. Bottom line is, give the engine what it wants, and set the needle properly. Don't misunderstand me and think that I can run a Super Tigre on 10% oil and it won't melt downwhen I get stupid For the legal department, these are my observations and not everyone should try them at home

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 13

Bad Fuel - 4/13/2002 6:15:10 PM   
Ed Smith


 

Posts: 2798
Joined: 12/29/2001
From: Brantford, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		From a previous post:-

>>So, now what do I do with this gallon of fuel that I have? Burn barrel anyone?<<

For the price of a gallon of fuel and the cost of the damage it could do, I would dump it and be done with it!

Ed S

(in reply to drywaller)
       Post #: 14

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