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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 12:11 PM   
wayne d



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Status: offline 		I personally feel that if the jets don't have there own class it will turn into "Top Gun Jets". Given the number of jets verses say WW-1.
I can say this given we were downgraded for a slight wing dip on the slow speed pass and landing. Even thought the rules suggest no downgrade should be given if corrected.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 1:21 PM   
ram3500-RCU



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ORIGINAL: wayne d

I personally feel that if the jets don't have there own class it will turn into ''Top Gun Jets''. Given the number of jets verses say WW-1.
I can say this given we were downgraded for a slight wing dip on the slow speed pass and landing. Even thought the rules suggest no downgrade should be given if corrected.

I totally agree. In our class, Dave Shulman crashed out his jet in practice, or we would have had to contend with this. As it was, it is very hard to out fly gyro controlled jets in even the Pro/Am class I was in with Zombie. In a moving body of air, corrections WILL be necessary. I think the WWI guys really take a hit on this. Even though they did a great job with the wind for the most part.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 1:28 PM   
ram3500-RCU



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quote:

ORIGINAL: wayne d


quote:

ORIGINAL: ram3500-RCU

The biggest controversy for me is flying against planes with gyros on all axis. IMO humble opinion, they should be in their own class (jets) (don't see this happening anytime soon because of the impact on the schedule) and compete against each other. This would take the question of whether they are on board or not (they are allowed for Top Gun), out of the equation.

Don't mean to start anything here, but this was discussed in many circles during the week. The judges look for steady fast and slow passes, as well as coordinated turns, and the gyro controlled planes have a distinct, and some would say, unfair, advantage.


Here is a little something I found. One can draw their own reference.
http://www.rcjetaddiction.com/forum/topics/top-gun-rules

Interesting for sure. I still say, give them their own class, and let them have at it, or, just don't down grade for corrected movement and headings. And, the thrush won primarily on static (highest static in our class and half the scoring). It did not have the highest flight scores.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 1:35 PM   
wayne d



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Status: offline 		Please don't take this as its time to bash Top Gun, The judges and so forth. I just think that the tides are turning for a few rule corrections, and maybe a new class.
Or Gyro up the WW-II and WW-I and may the best man or electronics win.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 1:35 PM   
ram3500-RCU



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Status: offline 		Frank announced that there would be some changes for the 25th anniversary Top Gun in 2013. It will be interesting to see what he comes up with.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 1:40 PM   
ram3500-RCU



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quote:

ORIGINAL: wayne d

Please don't take this as its time to bash Top Gun, The judges and so forth. I just think that the tides are turning for a few rule corrections, and maybe a new class.
Or Gyro up the WW-II and WW-I and may the best man or electronics win.

Well, I guess it will always be a matter of opinion with judges. You can get an 8 and a 9.5 from two guys sitting next to each other who are looking at the same thing from the same perspective.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 1:52 PM   
wayne d



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ORIGINAL: ram3500-RCU

Frank announced that there would be some changes for the 25th anniversary Top Gun in 2013. It will be interesting to see what he comes up with.


You are talking about what he said at the awards. "That he MAY combine Expert and Masters next year due to the lack of builders".

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 1:53 PM   
wayne d



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quote:

ORIGINAL: ram3500-RCU


quote:

ORIGINAL: wayne d

Please don't take this as its time to bash Top Gun, The judges and so forth. I just think that the tides are turning for a few rule corrections, and maybe a new class.
Or Gyro up the WW-II and WW-I and may the best man or electronics win.

Well, I guess it will always be a matter of opinion with judges. You can get an 8 and a 9.5 from two guys sitting next to each other who are looking at the same thing from the same perspective.


How true that is......

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 2:35 PM   
Mustangman40


 

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Status: offline 		Gary,
thanks for bringing me up to speed on everything, congrats again.. I look forward to your next builds, my dad always told me, "If your going to learn something, learn it from the best"....


Jimbo

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 2:39 PM   
mirce


 

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Status: offline 		OK, few my opinions, on my bad English...

First one more time congratulation to Dominic - Garry - Dino team on good result.

My, maybe, biggest impression about modelers in USA are how are they persistent.
Garry and Brian, are taking 25+ times wing up and down from Corser, changed electric motor of smoke system, welded wires on batteries, changing satelite recivers, and so on...
Dino was perfect doing his part of job, check everithing. Everything he told, Garry and Brian are made, without objection. When they have problem with Moki engine, there was no hesitation, they all runing around to find a part...
I spent a lot of time under this tent, and looked from the side how many effort was invested, just there on Top Gun... Bravo for all...

Same story is with Mike Selby, Boga (from Mibo Model) told me that he wake up at 4 AM and went in Franks workshop to fix something on model, to be ready for that day...


My other impression is that level of Top Gun is little lower than it was be before. Please, don't get me wrong, it's phenomenal event, but when I was visit this event at 2007, 2008, 2009, it was more perfect airplanes.
In the noon show was flying Somenzini, and other world champions, there where more competitors, more scratch build models...

Mr Top Gun this year is Mr Top Gun at third time with same model. Where are new masterpieces like that airplane?
Don't to mention those model for spraying corn...

I don't want to made trip of 6000 miles and look same models...


I'm just visitor, I look this event sideward, and for me plane like Mike Selby made, from the zero, and Graeme Mearse T 33, are not a same. Graems model is kit, it was made perfect, Greame is magician, but it's a kit...
Mike made all parts, 25+ molds, retracts are custom made just for that model, all in all, it is not same level...

As I heard, many serious modelers, which made models from scratch build, they are not coming (David Plat, Ziroli, Hahn...) because they could not be in same level with guys who went and bought kit...

Same story is here, in this topic, with giros...

OK, that is rules, no problem, and everybody use it, but as I told, I expected little more from Top Gun.
Confirmation of this story is Frank intention to merge the two best class...


Other Top Gun side is that I spent great time with all modelers, special thanks to Scott Prossen, Steve an Jully from Bob's Hooby Center, and to all you guys from MeisterScale and Solo prop tenth...
I made new acquaintances, and for sure that worth more than watching just models.

To be frank, can't wait to come again...
Please don't get me wrong, this was just my opinion...

Best regards from Serbia

Mirce

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 5:40 PM   
snir2001



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Status: offline 		  awesome man !!!!

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 5:55 PM   
Dwhart24



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Status: offline 		Still trying to upload photos and getting an error. Grrr....


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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 6:20 PM   
wayne d



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ORIGINAL: Dwhart24

Still trying to upload photos and getting an error. Grrr....


I have the same problem with RCU.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 8:35 PM   
luckyb


 

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Status: offline 		Although still upset over Mirces refusal to fly with us in the Warbird gaggle, I must agree with a lot of what he said. However,I think consideration should be given to the economic climate. Even though certain costs are being met ( Moki's, Carfs, etc.), TIME is a scarce commodity for a lot of us, hence the " kits" vs. the scratch builds. I think the quality of the Pro Am classes has improved, but the amount of "Masters" quality aircraft have declined. To sit and design an aircraft from an idea in your head is a tremendous undertaking , leading to "Team", Unlimited etc. I still think it is a great event, and a little tweaking of the setup will make it even better. However, if TG doesn't work for you, you can join us at the "Warbird Alley Bar and Grill" over a beer and we will commiserate. LOL...............Doug

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 8:45 PM   
Dwhart24



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However, if TG doesn't work for you, you can join us at the "Warbird Alley Bar and Grill" over a beer and we will commiserate. LOL...............Doug


That works for me! 


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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/17/2012 9:51 PM   
mirce


 

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Status: offline 		Sorry Doug for Warbird gaggle, it was so kind to offer me plane for flying...

Not to be indecent, I forgot to sad thank you to Frank Tiano.
He help me a lot, I'm coming in his firm like in my house, he purchases modeling equipment for me, this year I get free tickets... Thank you Frank...

As Doug sad, economic situation have a great influence on all. It's bad, but that is reality...

Regards

Mirce

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 1:39 AM   
ram3500-RCU



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Status: offline 		Thanks for all the comments. As a first timer at Top Gun, I had nothing to compare this year to. It did appear that manufactured jets were in plenty. I enjoyed watching them perform, when I could. As noted, I wish I had had more time to just observe. I did get to visit that wonderful "Warbird Alley", but again, it was because they graciously offered then lighted tent to work on the Corsair. Much appreciated, but not the visit I would have preferred. It did appear that Brian "visited" the festivities much more than I did, at times. Good for him.

One thing I was surprised at was the confusion on the flight line at times. Better communication between the controllers would seem a good idea. Dino told me they used to use radios, but now they just use the paddles. Radios would seem a better way to go, given the number of close calls I witnessed, and happened to us personally. I don't want to propose to tell Frank how to run an event. This is just an objective observation from a fresh set of eyes.

Another thing I was surprised at was what happened when, in the middle of one round, they reversed the pattern, from left to right (left hand turns) to right to left. I was amazed at how many did not seem nearly as comfortable with the right hand turn at Top Gun. I saw a couple planes go in. Dino didn't skip a beat. He is every bit as smooth turning right as left, the way you would expect. I see this at local fields, and in fact, some guys won't even fly in a right hand pattern. Just surprised to see it at that level.

Having said this, the flying skill I saw among most competitors was fun to watch. I witnessed many cross wind saves that were impressive.

No event is without challenges, but Top Gun is a wonderful event for anyone with a passion for scale. As the economy worsens, and fuel cost become a bigger factor for those who travel great distances, who knows what will happen, but for us here in Ohio, it was a joy to go south and spend some time with our friends in sunny Florida.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 3:00 AM   
wphilb


 

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Status: offline 		Does  anyone know why the right hand turn is viewed as more difficult?

Whit


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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 4:18 AM   
JSZ



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Status: offline 		I believe it's the pilots that have more difficulty with the
right to left take off that prohibits the same pattern.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 5:09 AM   
Buckmeister


 

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Status: offline 		I have heard that it has to do with engine torque making turns in one direction easier than another. Sounds good to me.
Mostly I think it is in the Mental Transmitter

I crash and burn them in both directions equally well!

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 5:28 AM   
ram3500-RCU



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ORIGINAL: Buckmeister

I have heard that it has to do with engine torque making turns in one direction easier than another. Sounds good to me.
Mostly I think it is in the Mental Transmitter

I crash and burn them in both directions equally well!

Good one, and me too.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 1:11 PM   
Dwhart24



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Status: offline 		The upload finally worked! You can see in the one straight on shot the red lights lighting up from the gun ports during the straffing run.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 1:19 PM   
ram3500-RCU



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Status: offline 		SWEET Dave. I wondered if any shots would pick them up. See how they alternated as they fired. On one of the videos you can clearly hear them as well. The Judges loved that. 10s across the board on that maneuver every time.

You can see the nav lights as well. Very cool.

I like the underside shot also. One of the static judges commented that "it looks freshly painted". I respectfully disagree. At this time in it's (Big Hog) service, it had been in operation just 6 weeks, and this was explained in the documentation, I think she looks like it. In another 6 months, she appeared much more weathered in the pictures I had. Opinions vary don't they.

Thanks for your persistence. It was worth the wait.

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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 1:21 PM   
Mustangman40


 

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ORIGINAL: Dwhart24

The upload finally worked! You can see in the one straight on shot the red lights lighting up from the gun ports during the straffing run.


Just awesome, what a cool plane..... Thanks for posting them, great pics for sure...

Jimbo


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RE: CARF F4U-1 Corsair build thread - 5/18/2012 1:48 PM   
Dwhart24



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Status: offline 		Thanks guys. The weathering looks great! Another thing I noticed while going through the photos is the weathering in front of the canopy on the fuse. You can see where it looks like stuff ran down the sides of the fuse in the first photo.


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