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Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 2:45 AM   
jarvis johnson


 

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From: chino, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Ok Guys here we go, day 1 of the Nat's are over, we will start up again in the morning, Here are the sheets from today, Masters will have new system, for the final 8 pilots
the top 8 pilots, with the lowest combine scores, will go to the finals on Saturday, so no semi-final for Masters. The scores for FAI have not been posted.

Example for Masters

4 groups of pilots, if you win your flightline grouping you are 1st, it = 1 pts, 2 nd = 2pts and 3rd is 3pts and so on, after 6 rounds, the 8 pilots with the lower score
go to the finals on Saturday, only FAI will have a semi-finals


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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 2:53 AM   
Gregg G


 

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Status: offline 		Jarvis are they going to post the scores? Thanks
Greg

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 3:20 AM   
jarvis johnson


 

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 3:32 AM   
jarvis johnson


 

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 3:34 AM   
jarvis johnson


 

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 3:38 AM   
jarvis johnson


 

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 3:51 AM   
chris j


 

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Status: offline 		And the magician says " wahla" after three tries. Thanks for the scores. Good luck buddy!

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 4:17 AM   
corch


 

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From: grand rapids, MI, USA
Status: offline 		Wow, I just realized there are "just a few" guys that just finished their duties for the WC and now competing themselves....that's a lot of time in Munchie....Good luck to all my D4/D5 pattern friends!  Hopefully the heat broke for y'all today.


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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 4:53 AM   
mwick


 

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Status: offline 		Any scores for FAI?

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 11:59 AM   
wattsup


 

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Status: offline 		This is starting to look like de ja vu all over again...............

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 2:31 PM   
Don Szczur



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From: Chantilly, VA, USA
Status: offline 		Someone told me I had a good day yesterday but I've got to pick up laundry now (10 days worth) and then pack up and head to the field.

Don

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/4/2011 4:25 PM   
gaRCfield



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Status: offline 		Go D1 and D4!!! =D

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 2:24 AM   
d_bodary


 

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Status: offline 		Ok i give what about today's scores Jarvis?

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 12:37 PM   
Fixed Wing



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Status: offline 		Here' a Photo of the Master's score sheet after day 2.


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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 1:53 PM   
flyintexan



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Status: offline 		Some talent there in the top 10.....thanks for posting.

-mark


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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 3:40 PM   
walter e


 

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From: hopewell jct., NY, USA
Status: offline 		anyone have results for FAI
thanks
walter

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 5:06 PM   
wattsup


 

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Status: offline 		More important than that, since this is an NSRCA event according to the AMA, why hasn't someone from NSRCA posted the standings of each class at the end of each day on a more timely basis? I don't want to hear they were too busy! Just my thoughts___Everette

< Message edited by wattsup -- 8/5/2011 6:26 PM >

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 7:38 PM   
Ryan Smith


 

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Status: offline 		Why are Masters scores being posted with placing in the round versus the normalized score?

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 8:06 PM   
Fixed Wing



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ryan Smith

Why are Masters scores being posted with placing in the round versus the normalized score?

Reference the 1st post of this thread for explanation.


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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 8:11 PM   
Planeclaims


 

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From: Ocoee, FL, USA
Status: offline 		Ryan,

See Post #1. Other than that, I'm wondering if the final 8 will be placed according to the scores and not where they placed.

Steve

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 8:56 PM   
Derek.Koopowitz


 

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From: Oakland, CA, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wattsup

More important than that, since this is an NSRCA event according to the AMA, why hasn't someone from NSRCA posted the standings of each class at the end of each day on a more timely basis? I don't want to hear they were too busy! Just my thoughts___Everette



I'm sure the scores are posted timely... at the AMA site where they need to be posted.

Everette - you really should take into account that a lot of people are doing a lot of work at the Nats and I can tell you from experience that their primary customers are the ones located in Muncie and not on RCU. This has got nothing to do with the NSRCA or the AMA. Perhaps you should get off your high horse and offer to help out at the Nats some time and then you'll know what I'm talking about...

Kudos to all those people that have volunteered their time at the Nats to help ensure that all those competitors enjoy themselves and have a great experience.

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 9:29 PM   
Ryan Smith


 

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From: Champaign, IL, USA
Status: offline 		So there is no way that someone could have a higher normalized score than their placing in their line? Sorry for necesitating the Fisher Pricing down of scoring, I guess I could see instances where the normalized score would end up being higher than the placement score and causing someone to not place where they should. If this is all still tied into the matrix then that would be impossible, correct? If so, that still begs the question why the normalized scores are not being posted. What prompted the institution of this method of reporting?

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 10:02 PM   
Derek.Koopowitz


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wattsup

Excuse me Derek, I don't need you taking me to task about anything in this public forum. Now, if you can't handle the job or the truth you need to find another hobby! Keep in mind, you are the sole reason I dropped my membership with NSRCA several years ago. As verified by your above response, your attitude has not changed. Also, I took the liberty to check with AMA and was told it was the responsibilty of the NSRCA to post all updates, changes and daily scores as it relates to the 2011 Pattern Nationals. Ryan Smith should be commended for questioning the scoring process being used this year. BTW, you could be posting today's results, while you are resting, instead of diddling around here on RCU with the rest of us underlings! Regards, Everette



I'm glad I was the sole reason you dropped out of the NSRCA - we don't need people like you. Your whole "high and mighty" attitude is driving people away from this forum and I'm sure from pattern as well. I'll say this publicly once and for all - you're a bully and I don't take kindly to being bullied. And just so you know... I'm NOT at the Nats and so I am entitled to rest and diddle around RCU all I want. And for those people that are working at the Nats - they are entitled to rest and diddle around anywhere they want as well... and not have to cater to your wants.

As for responding to this message - don't even bother because it will just go to show exactly what you are all about - a bully, bigot, you name it...

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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 10:20 PM   
VerneK


 

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From: Livonia, MI, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Ryan,
The matrix was modified by the contest board during the last rules cycle to resolve problems the old system had. The biggest problem was that normalized scores from half the pilots that flew in front of one set of judges were being compared to normalized scores from the other half of the pilots that flew in front of a different set of judges. Compounding that problem was that one group of pilots was invariably stuck in an exceptionally hard group every day and it was totally unfair to compare their scores to someone who flew with an "easier" group in front of different judges. The system now is similar to what happens in hydroplane racing that use qualifying heats to get into the finals. Pilots are now ranked based on where they finish each round (1st, 2nd, 3rd) and only against the pilots they actually flew against each day in front of the same judges. Each pilot has to keep their best round/ranking from the two rounds each day. At the end of 3 days, every pilot will have flown 2 rounds against every other pilot and have to keep their best ranking (1st, 2nd, 3rd) from each day plus their single best throwaway ranking from the 3 days. The 8 pilots with the lowest ranking numbers go to the finals. The rest of the pilots will show normalized scores as in the past. The 8 finalists will also have the normalized scores from the finals where they they finally get to compete with equal judging exposure.

This is a very condensed version of how it works. The full version is in the 2011 AMA Competition Regulations. Every Masters pilot I talked to here at the Nats likes this system much better than what we had before.

I'm at the hotel right now and won't be back on a computer until I get home and catch up on all I've missed over the last 3 weeks, so I hope this explanation works for now. The short answer to your question is that it is possible for someone with higher normalized scores to rank lower (better) than someone else. The reason is that they flew in front of different judges when they got those higher normalized scores. It would be great if we could have an equal judging exposure Masters contest at the Nats but it's just not possible with the number of contestants we get along with contestant judging. BTW, I'm not in the finals and have no gripes. I didn't fly well and was scored accordingly.

Verne


quote:

ORIGINAL: Ryan Smith

So there is no way that someone could have a higher normalized score than their placing in their line? Sorry for necesitating the Fisher Pricing down of scoring, I guess I could see instances where the normalized score would end up being higher than the placement score and causing someone to not place where they should. If this is all still tied into the matrix then that would be impossible, correct? If so, that still begs the question why the normalized scores are not being posted. What prompted the institution of this method of reporting?



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RE: Nat's Scores Day 1 - 8/5/2011 11:41 PM   
rcpattern



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From: Great Mills, MD, USA
Status: offline 		Masters finalists,

Rick Byrd
Archie Stafford
Dave Snow
Tony Frackowiak
Chris Odom
Stephen Byrd
Glen Watson
Joe Walker

Don't know the FAI results. Been a great NATS, even though Rusty has been very short handed with many of the guys who normally work the NATS working the worlds.

Heading to dinner, then up early tomorrow to fly,

Arch

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