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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 3:12 AM   
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Jake, I have the Pro version of the compiler installed. How do I switch it back to the free version if possible? Is there a command to reset it within the program?

I made two curves using the new spreadsheet Beta 99B8 version and will be testing monday evening if I get the static tests working.
Since I recompiled the last version and reprogrammed my PIC with it, I haven't had the problems as before.

Figured out the transistor problems also by changing the load resistor in the tuning resistors on the HV board. Everything now seems to run much cooler. As a side benefit, current draw from the HV board has gone down, around 60 mah without the engine running, and around 300 mah engine at max rpm.. That is good. Tuning resistors are opposite the .47 cap on the HV board. most boards I built had a 2.4 k resistor in the first position. Using just that resistor works fine alone. I was tuning for more output on the .47 cap and a parallel resistance total should have ended up around 2.2k. I think I got greedy and went down to 2k and that's when I started having the heating problems and excess current draw, so I solved that now by just using one 2.2k resistor, works fine and everything is back to normal.

John


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 4:09 AM   
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Static tests completed...Version 99b8 compiled without a problem. Compiler worked ok and produced the required hex file. Programmed the hex to the PIC and all went well. Put the PIC in the timer, fired it up and it worked perfectly. Switches work as planned. Engine testing of the new curves will be done tomorrow possibly before I go to work and I'll post the results.

John

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 10:03 AM   
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Not everyone was having a flashlight for 8 or 10 years ago, so we make a flashlight into the PIC.
People can also use the output for a rotationmeter, or......you name it.
A few years ago I make a flashlight without using the PIC, no wires between CDI and flashlight (safety)
I say, remove the LED out of the code.

BTW, it's right if you say you see dim the LED.
But flash on a disk with one line at TDC and you will see the line flash up somewhere between TDC and 40 degrees BTDC.
The only problem will be the time the LED is on, at high rpm the "up" time will be shorter and the brigdness will be less but it didn't loose the function.



Next, why a killswitch into the software ?
A killswitch is on the engine, shortcircuit the ignition, in ever motorsport I know.
We know all the HV-baoard can make sparks even if the hall isn't flyby the magnet.
How is the killswitch working with low batteries or EMP into the PIC ?
I say remove the killswitch and make a real one on the engine and short the ignitioncoil with a real switch.

Software is not allways the holygrail to make solutions.

< Message edited by Gompy -- 10/22/2012 10:58 AM >


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 10:45 AM   
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Rob,

The killswitch in software is for remote operation.

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 11:04 AM   
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I know Charlie, but what happens when the switch is tripped above the audience if there is suddenly a radio interference.
An emergency switch must be mechanically and should never be written in software.
Software can not be sure enough to switch and operate the hardware for continue working.
Hardware must disable by hardware with a real switch, a shut-off switch.

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 1:08 PM   
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Charlie, have you experimented with the "on" time of the led?
When I get home from work today ill try changing the delay time to see if the brightness can be adjusted enough to bring that function back. On the dyno my friend built to test engines, we were making use of that function. I have one of Rob's strobeoscope's and will have to use it seperately I guess if the built in one won't work bright enough. It was not bad using it just to check that the timing was actually changing with rpm as programmed.

John


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 1:13 PM   
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Forgot to mention that the engine run test of the curves worked great this morning. Switches function also, very positive engine kill.
I programmed two greatly different curves in the pic so I could tell if the curve switch worked, it does!

John


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 3:11 PM   
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Hi Gompy
quote:

I say, remove the LED out of the code.


No way.
For my hardware(zvs cdi), it will not be good for the code.
I use 7 pin scr control.
The inverted output is required.
Alternatively, control can be used HV generator.(on-off)


quote:

I know Charlie, but what happens when the switch is tripped above the audience if there is suddenly a radio interference.
An emergency switch must be mechanically and should never be written in software.
Software can not be sure enough to switch and operate the hardware for continue working.
Hardware must disable by hardware with a real switch, a shut-off switch.


I agree with you.


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 5:05 PM   
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Hopefully with some testing we can find the right on time for the LED so that it flashes well, and I'll make it the default. I just didn't have time to mess with it enough. My GF was getting mad about me running the engine in the doorway.

I've also read that LEDs can handle a lot higher current than they are rated for if it is in short pulses, which is exactly what we have. Perhaps someone can come up with a circuit that dumps a small cap through the LED when it is triggered.


The reason I put a kill switch in the software is that it just seemed to make sense. I figured why short out your circuit with a mechanical kill switch when you can just stop firing it? I also figure that it will be easy to tie the mechanical kill switch to the kill switch pin. That way it will increase the safety and reliability of the kill switch. The kill switch activates when it is grounded, so you can take the mechanical kill switch and also hook it to the kill switch pin. You can do that in a way that it grounds the ignition output AND turns it off in the software at the same time. Then you aren't really shorting the circuit and wasting power. You would have to hook this up to make sure you aren't sending the ignition spark to the kill switch pin, but if your switch has 4 pins on it I would think it would work.

In any case, I've been mainly thinking of RC and UAV/drone applications. Having a kill switch that doesn't require a relay or mechanical means is easier to control and takes less parts. I'm not saying it works this way right now, because I haven't tested it, but with the way I debounced the switch you should be able to run a PWM signal to the kill switch. If you have a +50% duty cycle it should keep the kill switch from activating, with -50% duty cycle it should activate the kill switch. I don't know yet if this actually works, it may take some tuning of the code, but some people might find it handy to have a easy kill switch on their TX.

I don't think the kill switch is vulnerable to EMI/noise/interference. It is only using the internal weak pull-up resistor in the PIC, but the main loop runs at around every 10ms and it takes 10 reads of the switch as activated to make it kill the ignition. So 10 * 10 = 100ms of grounded kill switch pin to activate it. That doesn't include the ISR overhead, so it is probably more like 200ms to activate the switch.

So it would take very low frequency interference, or very continuous interference, to activate it. Usually interference also induces voltage in the circuit, but the kill switch responds to being grounded. So I think if anything the kill switch might be vulnerable to NOT activating if there is a lot of noise in the ground.

In any case, it's easy to disable...
Simply delete lines 200-213 in the source code. They should look something like this...
if(GPIObits.GP4 == 0){   // If kill switch is on (grounded)
        if(KillSwitch < 10){ // Less than debounce value
            KillSwitch++;    // Increment value
            if(KillSwitch == 10){   // Debounce value reached
                INTCONbits.GIE = 0; // Disable interrupts
                sGPIO.GP1 = 1;      // Make sure HV trigger is off (turn GP1 on)
                GPIO = sGPIO.ALL;   // Update GPIO
            }
        }
    }
else if(KillSwitch > 0){ // Kill switch off (high)
        KillSwitch;       // Decrease counter
if(KillSwitch == 0){INTCONbits.GIE = 1;} // If debounced back to 0, enable interrupts
}

Without these lines it will not check the kill switch pins or have any lines that disable the interrupts. The compiler may complain that some variables are not used, but you can ignore this.
BTW I've noticed that this forum munges all sorts of things for no obvious reason, even when pasted inside the "code" BBcode tag. So never trust any code posted as text. I noticed it deleted a couple characters from the code above, but hopefully things are clear enough.


To switch the compiler between free and pro modes go to...
File -> Project Properties -> Conf: -> XC8 global options -> XC8 compiler
Then select "Option categories: Optimizations" from the drop down list box.
Then choose "Free" in the "Operation Mode" list box.

My free trial expired, so I'm stuck with the free version for the moment. It really doesn't seem to matter, pro mode saves only a tiny shred of memory. When I switch over to my laptop or upgrade one of my computers I'll probably get another 60 day free trial, but for the moment I can only compile in free mode so we should all stay on the same page.

I really think it was that memory location issue with the tables. I've noticed that the way the PIC memory/banks are setup and paged it will roll addresses over. So in some cases by using the pointer arithmetic that I did it probably was screwing things up. I didn't change the memory scheme, but by letting the compiler place the table in memory it is probably picking a better spot that won't run into this problem.


-Jake


P.S. We really need to come up with a name for the project! I've just been calling it "CDI-2012" for now, but it would be nice to have a catchy and distinctive name for the project.

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 5:16 PM   
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I think you don't call it.......Project-X.

But wat do you think of Jake-in-the-box ?

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 5:52 PM   
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Jake, things are working great now except for the led issue that you are working on. Switches are fine, ran long wires right by my receiver to a switch, no interference at all. Also the curve switch done the same way with no problems noted. I must mention that this a 72mhz setup which normally everything will affect, but still no problem.

Rob, let's have a name contest ! I like the "Jake in the box" name. Lol

John


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 6:09 PM   
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Jake-in-the-box is out! I actually worked at the dang place once and heard that plenty.

"Project-X" was a movie that came out fairly recently, and I think it pretty well used up.

This is also the work of a lot of people. I've just written one software for the device, others have designed and produced the hardware, and figured all the things out to this point.

I'm sure I can figure out a name for the software at some point, but it would be cool to have a name for the whole project. It will help people find it and know what everyone's talking about.

I kind of liked "Vortex" since it seems to go well with my "Electrofunnel" domain name, but I looked and there already is a "Vortex" electronic ignition system.

I'm sure with all the creative minds here we can come up with a cool name. Don't be afraid to throw something out there, we're just brainstorming so there's no wrong answers!

Some random stabs here...

Calculon CDI
Twister "
Turbo Tap "
Electro Tap "
Time-O-Matic (TOM)
Blaster
Snapper
Mega-blast
Electro-blast
Combust-O-Matic (COM)
Electro-blaster
Master blaster
Big Wheeler Cap Peeler
Cap Snap
Snap Cap

So on and so forth I guess. An acronym type name would be good also.


-Jake

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 6:57 PM   
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Hi Jake
I found a bug in your code.
******   GP 543210  *******/
******  Pin 234567  *******/
TRISIO    = 0b111100;    // 0/1=Output/Input, Pin 234567, Label (GP543210)
WPU       = 0b110101;    // Internal pull-ups on GP5+4+2+0

WPU  0Bit  Why is the value 1?
The output is defined.(GP0-Pin 7)



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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 7:47 PM   
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Projext X is a Facebook party.......and we don't like it.

TIT V1 (Table Ignition Timer Version 1).

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 8:27 PM   
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I agree that we need both a hardware and software kill feature. I for one want software kill.
John:
Are you talking about R8 on the schematic?


Jake:
 I was looking at the schematic and thinking about what you said about the LED turning on when you touch the back of the board. In this case you are introducing stray voltage from your fingers and it is high enough to turn the transistor on. I suggest that instead of using a resistor to limit current between the PIC and the base of the transistor, switch the resistor to a small signal diode and place the diode as close the ‘base’ as possible. The diode will help to ensure that a signal of at least .4v to 1v only gets through to the base. (.4 – 1v) depending on the diode you use (Schottky or Standard).
BAT42, 43, 85, 113 or 1N4148,1N914 my favorite.

For the other circuit I use a zener or diode and a resistor for filtering and to make sure the sgnal is at the level I want.
 
The ceramic decoupling capacitor between signal and ground is extra filtering or better yet use an electrolytic cap between the diode and the 'Base' then it will filter and keep the LED turned on a little longer. If you use one of the circuits the ‘on’ time of the LED may need to be increased slightly. Try the first circuit first it should be sufficient. I’ll show the files as soon as I figure out how to upload pics and PDFs.




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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 8:43 PM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: nyemi
WPU  0Bit  Why is the value 1?
The output is defined.(GP0-Pin 7)


I'm not sure why I set that on. I noticed that when I was looking at it recently, but I didn't want to mess with things so I left it alone.

The pin is set as an output so the pull-up setting doesn't matter. I'm not sure if it just doesn't matter electrically or if the hardware actually turns it off. I'll probably change it in the next version, but I didn't want to risk introducing bugs or changing things once it was working right.


On another note, I found that switches from old computers work well for the table and timer switches. Many old computers have momentary (reset) and toggle (power or turbo) switches right next to each other. I cut one out and wired a servo connector to it and it works pretty slick. I took a saw and just cut the whole thing right out of the computer face piece. Now I have both switches in a handy chunk of plastic that's easy to hold on to.


-Jake

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 9:07 PM   
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Hi Jake
Thank you for your response.
Yes I know it does not matter.

I still have problems with the code.
Therefore, I need some modification, your code.
Interrupts are not treated, Hall inputs.
I hope you succeed.
I do not know C coding.
I accept help.



What do you think?
Why did you chose? The input interrupt handling.



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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 9:19 PM   
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I hope it will be dry tomorrow John !

BTW, If you want upload pics aso, you have to go to *post reply* left down under.
At the bottom you will see attachments upload more files aso.
Don't use fast reply, it doesn't work.


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Click for fullsize


< Message edited by Gompy -- 10/22/2012 9:43 PM >


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 9:32 PM   
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I hope . You make a video.
I would love to hear engine sounds.
I congratulate you. Precise work.


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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 9:38 PM   
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Ok here are my ideas for the LED, I hope they help.

Ray

www.unimatrixtech.com/CDI-2012/LED Fix.pdf




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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 9:40 PM   
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Sure is small, perfect for RC.

Ray

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 9:41 PM   
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Thx Nyemi, but it will be hard I have first to find the factory ignitiontime.
I also not know where john locate the hallsensor, I think 40 degrees BTDC.
Second problem, the curve he put into the PIC, I don't know if this curve will work for the Homie.
But I hope he will run thats the moment I know the CDI is working.

This is the LED we use into our CDI.
http://www.electronics.gompy.net/weedeatercdi/index.html
BTW, I use *post reply* and use upload more files.
If you can see the pic is ver small.

Attachments
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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 9:57 PM   
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> Why did you chose? The input interrupt handling.

Because I wanted to add features like the table switching and kill switch. I also want to add a lot more features to be used with the 12F1840 chip, so I wrote the first program with the idea that I would be able to move it to the 1840 and add features.

Because I'm using the interrupts the main loop is free to do other tasks. I can do whatever processing I want in the main loop and I don't have to worry about the timing since the interrupt will interrupt the main loop to do what it needs.

It's an easy way of multitasking. Other programmers can also be free to experiment with the code in the main loop without worrying that they will mess up the timing.


New Release...
12F1840 Version

I ported the code over to the 12F1840. There are no other changes. I've tested this on my engine and it seems to work exactly as the 683 version did. No problems and the timing seems the same. I'm running the 1840 at the same 8 mhz for now.

It's available on the website.


-Jake

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 10:09 PM   
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Jake, you have change the project name, CDI-2012_12F1840_v0.99b8.xlsm

CDI-2012_12F1840_v0.0.1.xlsm

CDI-2012/CDI-2012_12F683_v0.99b8.xlms must be first CDI-2012/CDI-2012_12F683_v1.xlsm

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RE: CDI gr8flyer55 - 10/22/2012 10:37 PM   
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Hi Gompy
Link:docs.google.com/file/d/0BxQHqG9HPIj3bXo2d3NDeFFnYWM/edit
Hall position. 28 ° -30 ° BTDC.
I'm curious, the main difference between the two codes.
Not sure that you will find!
Because it is very small,  difference.




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