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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/21/2011 6:28 AM   
A10FLYR



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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/21/2011 2:56 PM   
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ORIGINAL: Jim Cattanach


Skymaster, Fei-Bao, & Jet Legend are ones I have experience of. I am sure there will be others.



I guess in your location, you don't have an option for Skymaster, but if you want FB or JL, can't you go through GJC and just do 50%?

Bob

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/23/2011 9:57 PM   
Airplanes400



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Status: offline 		Just found this from another thread. Now if a Chinese R/C airplane company like CMPro can manage to do this type of operation, why can't a Chinese Jet company do the same?

Here's a thread that was posted on RCU nearly two years ago showing an ARF plant...............

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7930272/anchors_7930272/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#7930272

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/23/2011 10:10 PM   
invertmast


 

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Status: offline 		Granted CMpro probably has higher sales of 1 model than a jet company does of 1 of theirs, but I can't understand/ see why their is ANY reason why any of the ARF jet companies can't have atleast 4 or 5 of the models (that are painted out of the mold) in stock and "ready for paint". That way the wait time is down to 2 or 3 weeks now. I know I would have placed orders for a few models over the past 2 years if the wait time was only a a few weeks, compared to what comes to a few months, and thats only if they stick to their 8-12 weeks. I've seen posts of people saying their 12 weeks turned into 16 weeks or longer.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/23/2011 10:12 PM   
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Status: offline 		Doesn't compare really. These are balsa planes for the most part. The 182 is a composite model, but one color scheme only. No custom options I promise you that. Just base airframes. Once you start putting things in and installing items the entire game changes and gets expensive; extremely labor intensive.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/24/2011 12:15 AM   
rhklenke



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Airplanes400

Just found this from another thread. Now if a Chinese R/C airplane company like CMPro can manage to do this type of operation, why can't a Chinese Jet company do the same?

Here's a thread that was posted on RCU nearly two years ago showing an ARF plant...............

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7930272/anchors_7930272/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#7930272


John just said it above and others have already in this thread - its a totally different game. I have one of the CMP Cessna 182's in your picture and there are at least three others in clubs around my area - one in my own club. On the other hand, I just ordered (as I said before) one of the smaller Xtreme Jets F-4 through BVM, and so far, I know of only 3 others that have been sold in the entire world - and I doubt there are many more than that. The volume is *totally* different....

Bob

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/24/2011 1:22 AM   
invertmast


 

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Status: offline 		Bob,
Lemme know how the small f4 is. That is another one i would like to have but have delayed on it since there is nothing out here about it.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/24/2011 2:00 AM   
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Status: offline 		Who has more planes ready to ship? See the photos and the answer is obvious.

Most jet factories we are working with have at least 5-10 kits ready to paint, but it still takes them 4-6 weeks to do so (confirm order, line up assembly schedule, assign works to workers, and then the really work starts). There are a lot of special requests and customization. See another photo showing 1 F16 with ordnance packages, cockpit kit, and L/G installed. It's more complicated than a Cessna, isn't it? The time/labor management is very complicated. 10 times more than a FDA approved medical manufacturing operation.

I think Dave was referring to some small owner operated work shop who makes 1 to 10 kits a year. Normally they take longer time to get it done. I have a Hawk from an European company, and it took them 7 months to get it to my builder, and it took my builder 10 months to finish it. All at the cost of over 3 to 4 times of these semi-mass produced Chinese Jets.

Mike

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/24/2011 2:25 AM   
invertmast


 

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Not to argue, but if they have these" jets in white" ready to paint, then why the 8-12 week delivery time frame and pennies discount on the kit (compaired to a painted model) when someone requests an all white/in primer model?

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/24/2011 3:48 AM   
mikedenilin


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Thomas,

If a factory has a primer version then normally it will take 4 to 6 weeks to paint one, then add 2 - 3 weeks for optional installations, such as lights, servos, etc., so the delivery time quickly adds up to 8-12 weeks for most of the factory. We are no exception either.

It's a hard to imagine why a factory can't deliver a primer kit version within 2 weeks of time. It could be due to the fact that it's an 1 man operation and he could be tied up in other project. Or he might have missing parts due to special request. 8-12 weeks are simply too long and unacceptable. I will avoid buying from them.

Normally, a primer version can be shipped within 1 week of time. We take 1-2 days to wait for the payments, then 1-2 days to inspect (we can't inspect product immediately because the QC team need to work in a row of priorities. 1-2 days to pack, ship and clear custom. Most of time is used in confirmation.


Mike

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/24/2011 7:39 AM   
invertmast


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mikedenilin

Hi Thomas,

If a factory has a primer version then normally it will take 4 to 6 weeks to paint one, then add 2 - 3 weeks for optional installations, such as lights, servos, etc., so the delivery time quickly adds up to 8-12 weeks for most of the factory. We are no exception either.

It's a hard to imagine why a factory can't deliver a primer kit version within 2 weeks of time. It could be due to the fact that it's an 1 man operation and he could be tied up in other project. Or he might have missing parts due to special request. 8-12 weeks are simply too long and unacceptable. I will avoid buying from them.

Normally, a primer version can be shipped within 1 week of time. We take 1-2 days to wait for the payments, then 1-2 days to inspect (we can't inspect product immediately because the QC team need to work in a row of priorities. 1-2 days to pack, ship and clear custom. Most of time is used in confirmation.


Mike


Understandable on a few days up to a week or 2 to get one shipped out. The place's i asked about getting these primer only models from are not 1 man operations. I was told that it was basically a "custom" job since they don't typically sell primer/in white models only, so they would have to lay up a new model to get me one in w/o any paint. With that response, it makes it sound like they have all of their models pre-painted as they are laid up and in stock, which now makes me wonder, if a primer/in white model is a special order/custom job, why does it take 8-12 weeks for a normal model to ship?

And those are why i have refused to buy anything from any of the chinese manufacturers..

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 8/26/2011 4:05 PM   
Airplanes400



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Status: offline 		For me, waiting 8~12 weeks is not acceptable, unless I was asking for a custom build. But to be asked to wait that length of time for a stock jet (in primer) would make me walk away from the purchase. Especially if the manufacturer wants all the money up-front (including the shipping charge).

For me, as a rule, I buy in-stock items only. When I plunk down hundreds or thousands of dollars, I want instant gratification.

If I were to buy a jet I had to wait for, I could understand 10% down, but that's it. If a custom build, then another percentage later, then final payment when ready to ship. That would be my rule. Other people may be willing to pay 100% up-front, but not me. Maybe the manufacturer would not want to deal with me because I would not put 100% down... That's OK with me. There are lots of untouched jets being sold on RCU and other sites that I'd be willing to pay full price just to avoid the wait of a similar jet from the factory. There are enough people buying the jets then realizing they don't have the space or talent to put it together. So those jets end up being sold at less than full price. This is true for all brands of jets.

From what others are writing about the long waiting period, it seems that the manufacturers are losing their business too. Maybe in time, the manufacturers can adjust to the demand, stock a few "high-sale" jets, and sell more jets as a result. It just seems that the current system needs improvement. From that improvement, more business may grow?

When a company rep tells me that the item could be delivered before the 8 week period, I have come to experience that "line" was used to close the deal. It was just an enticement to close the deal. Remember, no promise was made to deliver earlier.

I found this picture on FaiBao's website. Looks like they have a decent production, yet still quote 8~12 weeks for delivery.



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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 3:05 AM   
ddennison


 

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Status: offline 		Just re-reading this post as I am still waiting for my SM large hawk; I cant even remember when I ordered it anymore. Then a breath of hope - a December delivery? Perhaps with Santa. That didnt happen either. January, this week, word that they hope to get it out before the big holiday-...do I even hope to see it in February? I am still looking forward to it though....

I ordered this jet as a trial to see what the process would be like. While BVM has been excellent (Patty and Dustin) keeping me up to date and getting me my bvm upgrades early, I have little left of my building season and wish I guess I had ordered it in March of 2012 perhaps.

I dont think I will order another plane from overseas, I could have built or finished a stock kit by now. My BV kits where delivered within two weeks of the time I was quoted (UB).
I also was thinking that probably about 90-100 Boeing 737s have been produced since my order. I know, apples-oranges.

Dave

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 3:30 AM   
johnzqh


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Dave

Sorry to hear it.Your hawk was finished.Please contact BVM to check.Here is photo.

Best regards

John
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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 3:37 AM   
ddennison


 

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Status: offline 		Thank you John. It looks great, I appreciate your work and for taking the time to comment here.
I have already confirmed with BVM regarding the balance in order to ship asap.

DD

I should clarify - I should have stated that I would consider future overseas-in stock purchase.



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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 5:38 AM   
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Status: offline 		I would love 8-12 weeks for delivery, I'm at week 27 for my twin F-18 from FEJ and now they are in the middle of moving to a different factory

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 1:39 PM   
ddennison


 

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Status: offline 		I have been thinking about this and I also would agree that 8-12 weeks is not bad for delivery, but we should be aware of 10-12 weeks rather than told 6 weeks. That is why I would likely consider an in-stock purchase next time or just plan for a bit more time.

I am still excited to see the Hawk (my first SM jet) and the new turbine is on the way for it as well.




Dave

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 3:02 PM   
quist



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Status: offline 		Dave,

The wait should be worth it. I pulled mine off the ceiling to fly it a couple of weeks ago. What a great flying model. Makes me wonder why I hung it up, it flies great. I also used the BVM manual as a guide with the BVM group 1 upgrades and main door cylinders. BVM cg has been very good.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 5:51 PM   
Zagzoo



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ORIGINAL: DiscoWings

I would love 8-12 weeks for delivery, I'm at week 27 for my twin F-18 from FEJ and now they are in the middle of moving to a different factory



I thought my 18 week for my BD-5 from xtreme/skymaster was bad... Hopefully my twin F15 from FEJ isnt on that same time frame. Currently on week 8.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 6:04 PM   
DiscoWings



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Status: offline 		Funny thing is I had a guy who order a BAE Hawk from FEJ this was 9 weeks into my F-18, and he made FEJ make him give them a ready date, if the jet was not ready to ship by the date he would get his deposite (33%) back and could walk away form the deal. Needless to say, the Hawk has already started to arrive with 2 boxes here and 1 on the way, his delivery time of 8-9 weeks was kept by FEJ.

I'll be sure to have a clause like this in the future from any vendor.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 7:38 PM   
kingair41



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quote:

ORIGINAL: DiscoWings

Funny thing is I had a guy who order a BAE Hawk from FEJ this was 9 weeks into my F-18, and he made FEJ make him give them a ready date, if the jet was not ready to ship by the date he would get his deposite (33%) back and could walk away form the deal. Needless to say, the Hawk has already started to arrive with 2 boxes here and 1 on the way, his delivery time of 8-9 weeks was kept by FEJ.

I'll be sure to have a clause like this in the future from any vendor.



I ordered my FEJ Large Hawk 22 weeks ago. Was told 7-8 week delivery time.

Just now getting my delivery. Also one box at a time.

My next order will be along these same lines.

Doubt if I would have ordered if I knew it was going to be 5 1/2 months time and I'm still waiting for the rest to show up.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 8:51 PM   
Zagzoo



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ORIGINAL: DiscoWings

Funny thing is I had a guy who order a BAE Hawk from FEJ this was 9 weeks into my F-18, and he made FEJ make him give them a ready date, if the jet was not ready to ship by the date he would get his deposite (33%) back and could walk away form the deal. Needless to say, the Hawk has already started to arrive with 2 boxes here and 1 on the way, his delivery time of 8-9 weeks was kept by FEJ.

I'll be sure to have a clause like this in the future from any vendor.


This would have been good info to have before I ordered.. lol

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 9:24 PM   
David Searles


 

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ORIGINAL: kingair41

[
quote:

ORIGINAL: DiscoWings

Funny thing is I had a guy who order a BAE Hawk from FEJ this was 9 weeks into my F-18, and he made FEJ make him give them a ready date, if the jet was not ready to ship by the date he would get his deposite (33%) back and could walk away form the deal. Needless to say, the Hawk has already started to arrive with 2 boxes here and 1 on the way, his delivery time of 8-9 weeks was kept by FEJ.

I'll be sure to have a clause like this in the future from any vendor.



I ordered my FEJ Large Hawk 22 weeks ago. Was told 7-8 week delivery time.

Just now getting my delivery. Also one box at a time.

My next order will be along these same lines.

Doubt if I would have ordered if I knew it was going to be 5 1/2 months time and I'm still waiting for the rest to show up.


KingAir41,

Did you pay for the kit in full at the time of the order or, did you make a partial deposit? How much was the deposit, if made?

These kind of stories are exactly what my concern was two years ago! Does anyone believe that holding a customer's money for 22 weeks, against an initial 7-8 week schedule, is ethical? This example proves that Once they have your money, you are completely SOL and at their mercy! Still unacceptable to me!

25% deposit at time of offer, final payment upon notice of ready to ship, and if delivery extends 50% beyond initial projected delivery, buyer has the option to cancel with full refund. That would be my recommended agreement. These type of abuses will continue until buyers stand firm against it. IMO this market needs to change before a lot of people get burned!

David S


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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/23/2013 10:07 PM   
kingair41



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Status: offline 		Dave,
I put 25% down and made a couple payments along the way.

Then when it was ready to ship I made the final payment.

It's still over a month from my final payment did I start to get some of my order.

The plane, what I have of it, is beautiful and well constructed.

But to say 7-8 weeks and then miss that mark by that great of a margin.

I would buy another FEJ model. But better terms would be in place next time.

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RE: 8 - 12 WEEKS DELIVERY? Seriously? - 1/24/2013 12:25 AM   
David Searles


 

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ORIGINAL: kingair41

Dave,
I put 25% down and made a couple payments along the way.

Then when it was ready to ship I made the final payment.

It's still over a month from my final payment did I start to get some of my order.

The plane, what I have of it, is beautiful and well constructed.

But to say 7-8 weeks and then miss that mark by that great of a margin.

I would buy another FEJ model. But better terms would be in place next time.


So, in other words, THEY LIED, when they claimed it was "ready to ship," in order to get your final payment early! My question is, what good are "better terms", when the company apparently feels free to flat out lie to the customer! They KNEW that jet was not completely ready to ship when they asked for and got your final payment! FEJ has a couple of jets that I would love to have, & their quality has improved greatly from the 6 of their jets I purchased in the past, but no way am I going to submit myself to this type of dealings! And really don't understand why others continue to line up to do so?! Just my opinion.

David S



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