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here's what i have so far - 9/5/2003 7:36:19 PM   
DENNIS C



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From: frisco, TX, USA
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elev halfs with 2 1/2 counter balance

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here's what i have so far - 9/5/2003 7:37:38 PM   
DENNIS C



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here's what i have so far - 9/5/2003 7:38:13 PM   
DENNIS C



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about 45 deg's

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here's what i have so far - 9/5/2003 7:39:12 PM   
DENNIS C



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Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/5/2003 8:36:13 PM   
Tipover


 

Posts: 433
Joined: 6/24/2002
From: Outoftown, WI, USA
Status: offline 		Scou- those numbers look lots better, had me worried there for a moment unlikely to be doing any 3D at 65mph, I have a 8411 on my rudder just in case

Dennis- your planes really comming along great, I used your same wing attachment system. That carbon fiber gear looks real nice, whats it weight?

Kevin

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Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/5/2003 8:43:55 PM   
Tipover


 

Posts: 433
Joined: 6/24/2002
From: Outoftown, WI, USA
Status: offline 		Dennis,
Just a heads up, You'll have to taper the inside of your elevators quite a bit to clear a long pull-pull horn on the rudder.

Kevin

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Carbon landing gear - 9/5/2003 9:39:37 PM   
Scoubidou



Posts: 1569
Joined: 7/7/2003
From: Boisbriand, QC, CANADA
Status: offline 		Hi
Hey guys if you are interested in a C/F gear. there is a member here on RCU. by the user name of TT2 i bought my gear from him for 30.00 shipped. i think he has a few left. they are not perfect but i think they will hold just fine. plus they are a little taller then the stock one

I send a PM to TT2 and the 24% CAExtra carbon landing gear will be available next month. More details to come

ref: http://www.fiber-lite.com/
Option:
The CLG-114 from TNT weight 3.95oz only!! 40$
Scou.

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Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/5/2003 11:22:42 PM   
DENNIS C



Posts: 2965
Joined: 7/8/2002
From: frisco, TX, USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Dennis- your planes really comming along great, I used your same wing attachment system. That carbon fiber gear looks real nice, whats it weight[/QUOTE]

Tipover

According to my ditigal fish scale it's .5 oz's. probably a little on the heavy side but i need the taller gear for prop clearance.

Thanks for the heads up on the elev. but i have consider that one already

I have'nt got to the hard point's yet or the servo well's either.

So far this plane is going toegther great. Thinking about the 34%'r for this winter

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Re: Carbon landing gear - 9/5/2003 11:25:35 PM   
DENNIS C



Posts: 2965
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From: frisco, TX, USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Scoubidou
Hi
Hey guys if you are interested in a C/F gear. there is a member here on RCU. by the user name of TT2 i bought my gear from him for 30.00 shipped. i think he has a few left. they are not perfect but i think they will hold just fine. plus they are a little taller then the stock one

I send a PM to TT2 and the 24% CAExtra carbon landing gear will be available next month. More details to come

ref: http://www.fiber-lite.com/
Option:
The CLG-114 from TNT weight 3.95oz only!! 40$
Scou. [/QUOTE]

Scoubidou

The C/F gear that i got had some blemishe's in it. you really can't tell. TT2 Does some nice work

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Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/5/2003 11:27:16 PM   
Tipover


 

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From: Outoftown, WI, USA
Status: offline 		.5 oz's???? thats very light could it be .5 lb's??

Kevin

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Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/5/2003 11:45:03 PM   
DENNIS C



Posts: 2965
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From: frisco, TX, USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Tipover
.5 oz's???? thats very light could it be .5 lb's??

Kevin [/QUOTE]

No not 5 lbs

it is 5.0 oz's how's that

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test flight results - 9/9/2003 4:08:46 AM   
Tipover


 

Posts: 433
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From: Outoftown, WI, USA
Status: offline 		Got a few test flights on mine this weekend. It flys nice at 11 lbs. 3 point landings are comfortably slow, but the stall is rather abrupt when it comes. Seems to stall straight ahead. Try to keep your cg at the wing tube, 1/2" behind is very nuetral on this plane I had to throw my receiver pack up on the firewall to get the balance close to the tube. Was worried about ignition interference, but everything is working fine(FM ppm).

So far just doing loops ,rolls, and basic aerobatics.... knife edge seems good with a slight pull to the belly. couldn't detect any roll couple. On slower high alpha KE, the tail wanted to bounce up and down??? could be my rudder pull pull is not tight enough??? not sure yet. No 3D tests yet, 11 lbs may be a bit much for that. will see.

I still think theres something up with the wing area on this plane. I don't think its a full 300L span. Would be fun to build a set of slightly larger wings for it, get the wing loading down in the mid 20's. Would be very little weight gained in doing so. What's 8 inches of foam weigh?

Kevin

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RE: test flight results - 9/9/2003 7:12:20 AM   
Ragz



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Joined: 12/6/2001
From: Nagpur, INDIA
Status: offline 		I agree with you tipover..the stalls are rather sudden on landings...moreover, how do u intend to increase wing area? just increas the span but adding more foam to the root? if so, how many inches both sides? I have another kit in the box, that i want to modify. I want to re-engineer the new one to make it lighter and a true 3d aerobat. Any suggestions?

Anurag

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RE: Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/9/2003 1:53:16 PM   
Scoubidou



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From: Boisbriand, QC, CANADA
Status: offline 		Hum....

I still think theres something up with the wing area on this plane. I don't think its a full 300L span. Would be fun to build a set of slightly larger wings for it, get the wing loading down in the mid 20's. Would be very little weight gained in doing so. What's 8 inches of foam weigh?

That 'stall problem' can be a problem for landing but during your flight at 1/2 throttle, the airspeed coming over the wing should be enough to do whatever we ask to that plane! Before changing the wing design, would it be much easier to fly it at the recommended CG before?

1)Tipover, your CG is only 1/2 inche to far the wing tube. Let us know how it flies once you improve the actual position.

2) Would it be much easier to remove the servos from the tail and use a MK bellcrank instead of adding wing area in your case?

3) If the stall comes abrupt, you can use the ailerons servos to use them as flaperons! . 30 degres should be enough to see a better wing lift up and reduce that stall abrupt effect? It should reduce the landing speed too!

4) I agree the receiver pack must be installed as far as possible to the ignition, not to firewall.
5) If we do all these trimming adjustements and still see those problems, after that we can look at adding more span.


Daniel

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RE: Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/9/2003 5:00:42 PM   
Ragz



Posts: 1706
Joined: 12/6/2001
From: Nagpur, INDIA
Status: offline 		if you see my post above...i have mentioned that even after removing the tail servos...totally..the plane barely balances..and that too with 350 gms upfrontright behind the engine on the engine box...

bottom line..nice plane for imac..but no 3d machine..unless re-engineered...

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RE: Wing area on 24% CA Extra - 9/9/2003 5:54:18 PM   
Tipover


 

Posts: 433
Joined: 6/24/2002
From: Outoftown, WI, USA
Status: offline 		I wouldn't go so far as saying this plane has a bad stall. It is a tripple taper wing, so pretty much what one should expect considering the weights were coming in at.

The real issue is how to build the plane light, when you need every oz of weight on board crammed to the nose for balance. I have a 3 lb gasser up there, my reciever packs on the firewall. I'm now very close to balanced on the wing tube. Maybe 1/8-1/4" behind. I don't think 9-10 lbs is possible with the current wing location. With a light glow motor on the nose, you could cut the tail off, move it to the front, and still be tail heavy

Very simply, the manufacture needs to posistion the wings center of lift location, in relation to the planes natural balance point. Moving the wing back 1/2 to 1" would shift all the weight forward. The plane would then balance around the required cg. Not exactly rocket science(well, sort of ). There should be no need to move all your gear to the nose. A good design should have its center of mass more centrally located around the cg. Also, its much easyer to balance a nose heavy plane with a few oz's of tail weight, rather than adding pounds to the nose of a tail heavy design.

On adding wing area, that would be the easyest way to get this plane floating without adding much weight. Unfortunatly, doing it right would require cutting new foam cores. For best proportions, you would want to add to the root of the wing. That would also have the advantage of adding depth to the wing, for even more wing area. Because the root is a more critical stress point, the sheeting should not be spliced at that point IMO.
One could add to the tips, but that would take a lot more length to get the same added area. Just my thoughts.....

Kevin

< Message edited by Tipover -- 9/9/2003 1:01:03 PM >

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