Newbie question

Newbie question Gallery slideshow

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Search This Thread

Printable Version

All Forums >> Radios, Batteries, Clubhouse and more >> RC Radios, Transmitters, Receivers, Servos, gyros >> Newbie question

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

Newbie question - 4/22/2012 7:34 AM

CPTOZZY

Posts: 27
Score: 100
Joined: 4/22/2012
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Richmond Hill, GA, USA
Status: offline

I'm looking forward to gettingback into RC airplanes after I return from deployment . It has been a Loooong time since I built or flew anything, and all I remember from my youth was 3 or 4 channel radio's (and rubber band power). I have seen Ads for on a Futaba 7C 2.4 Ghz FAAST and I have some true newbie questions:

Why would you need 7 Channels for (elevator, rudder, aelerons, engine, wheel retraction, ??, ???)

What is FAAST?

could I use one radio (such as the Futaba 7C) for both Glow and Electric?

Glow vs Gas Vs Electric - Pro's & Cons??

I now have the Great Planes RealFlight simulator to practice, any recommendations for my first plane and/or Radio?

Thanks

CPT Ozzy

Hide Signatures

Post #: 1

RE: Newbie question - 4/22/2012 10:34 AM

winggunner46

Posts: 4
Score: 100
Joined: 6/19/2011
Last Login: 7/6/2012
From: Pickens, SC, USA
Status: offline

Many things have changed.
I prefer Electric over gas and glow
Reason: Nice clean plane when all is done. No slime or grease to clean, less chance of turning your car into a bomb from carrying around all that fuel.
Endless supply of power, just pop in a freshlly charged battery.
NOT WITHOUT POSSIBLE PROBLEMS: LiPo batteries must be handles in a special way so learn that stragiht away.
Get the best radio you can afford. As you get into it you will be glad to have those extra channels. I use a Spectrum DX and a # of different receivers
DO NOT EVER FORGET THAT THESE NEW PLANE CAN HURT YOU. I got careless a short time ago and got a quick trip to the ER and 8 stiches in my right forearm ( they are posted somewhere here.)
Start with a good trainer. FORGET JETS FOR NOW. A nice high wing plane Cub or knockoff is just the ticket. For learning BIGGER is better and 50 inch or so wing span is about right. SLOW is your friend right now. Speed can come later.
Whatever plane you use BUY A WAD OF SPARE PARTS, You will need. If you are a HUNTER cut open a couple of shotgun shells of different sized shot and keep then at hand to help BALANCE YOU PLANE.
BALANCE is one of your most important jobs.
iN ORDER TO FLY straight and true your PLANE MUST BE BALANCED. Balance it EVERY TIME YOU GO FLYING.

READ EVERYTHING YOU CAN GET YOUR HANDS ON.

AND ASK QUESTIONS. The members here are GREAT AND WILL HELP EVERY WAY THEY CAN.

All from me. Good Luck and stand by for the real experts to kick in. I sleep must of the day and work at night. They have regular hours and will be on line shortly.

Hide Signatures

(in reply to CPTOZZY)

Post #: 2

RE: Newbie question - 4/22/2012 11:13 AM

aeajr

Posts: 7486
Score: 205
Joined: 1/14/2003
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPTOZZY

I'm looking forward to gettingback into RC airplanes after I return from deployment . It has been a Loooong time since I built or flew anything, and all I remember from my youth was 3 or 4 channel radio's (and rubber band power). I have seen Ads for on a Futaba 7C 2.4 Ghz FAAST and I have some true newbie questions:

Why would you need 7 Channels for (elevator, rudder, aelerons, engine, wheel retraction, ??, ???)

What is FAAST?

could I use one radio (such as the Futaba 7C) for both Glow and Electric?

Glow vs Gas Vs Electric - Pro's & Cons??

I now have the Great Planes RealFlight simulator to practice, any recommendations for my firt plane and/or Radio?

Thanks

CPT Ozzy

Welcome back!

Yes more channels for more controls. But often it is the software of the higher channel count radios that you want. I have an 8 channel Futaba. I use up to 7 channels but I wanted the software mixing features.

I fly gliders and electric, no fuel.

FASST is Futaba's brand of 2.4 GHz. No frequency control needed.

< Message edited by aeajr -- 4/22/2012 5:11 PM >

_____________________________

Long Island Silent Flyers
www.lisf.org

Hide Signatures

(in reply to CPTOZZY)

Post #: 3

RE: Newbie question - 4/22/2012 2:27 PM

BuschBarber

Posts: 4698
Score: 104
Joined: 1/7/2002
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Rochester, NY, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPTOZZY

I'm looking forward to gettingback into RC airplanes after I return from deployment . It has been a Loooong time since I built or flew anything, and all I remember from my youth was 3 or 4 channel radio's (and rubber band power). I have seen Ads for on a Futaba 7C 2.4 Ghz FAAST and I have some true newbie questions:

Why would you need 7 Channels for (elevator, rudder, aelerons, engine, wheel retraction, ??, ???)

What is FAAST?

could I use one radio (such as the Futaba 7C) for both Glow and Electric?

Glow vs Gas Vs Electric - Pro's & Cons??

I now have the Great Planes RealFlight simulator to practice, any recommendations for my first plane and/or Radio?

Thanks

CPT Ozzy

I have been flying RC for 34 years. I have seen many radios. When you pick a particular brand, for the most part, you will always be using that brand's receivers. 2.4 is very proprietary.

Spektrum uses DSM2 or DSMX. JR was using DSM2 or DSMX but will be moving to DMSS in the near future. Futaba uses FASST, FASSTEST, and FHSS-S. Great Planes uses SLT for Tactic radios and Anylink. Hitec uses their own version and Airtronics uses their own version. Except for DSM2 and DSMX, which are cross compatible with one another, each implementation of Spread Spektrum (2.4Ghz) is not compatible with each other. There are others worth looking at as well as Chinese Clones.

If you have a model club or a Local Hobby Shop (LHS), go there and look at the radios. See what your fellow modelers are using because they will be your major resource for programming and what is or is not working well in your part of the country.

Electric is quiet and clean, but flights are short depending upon the size of the electric you build and the capacity of the batteries. I have a 1/3 scale Hangar 9 Carden Yak with and electric motor the equivalent of a 50cc to 80cc Gas engine. 4lbs of batteries gets you a 5 minute flight. With lighter and smaller aircraft, you can get longer flights. There is a large Upfront expense for Chargers and Batteries. As you move up in battery size, you will find that the battery under the hood of your car will not last long if you use it to power your chargers all day. Many of my fellow pilots bought two Energizer 6v Golf Cart batteries and put them in series to power the chargers. Some even use 1000w or 2000w Honda generators and power supplies.

I abandoned Glow because it averages $25 per gallon and is messy. Gasoline is relatively clean, cheap (for models), and easy to get. It can be a bit noisier, but you can fly forever on a tank of Gas. Gas engines are now offered in sizes from10cc to 400cc and larger so you can fly almost any size aircraft.

_____________________________

Rich
byronf16@gmail.com

Hide Signatures

(in reply to CPTOZZY)

Post #: 4

RE: Newbie question - 4/22/2012 4:51 PM

aeajr

Posts: 7486
Score: 205
Joined: 1/14/2003
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Status: offline

buschbarber makes some very good comments.

Electrics are exploding in popularity. They are most popular in planes and helis under 5 pounds. Here the up front cost of batteries and chargers are quite reasonable. Since they can be fairly quiet they get less resistance from neighborhoods and businesses who would scream about noise from glow planes. Some electrics are under 1 ounce and many can be flown indoors or in front of your house. When at the field you can charge them from your car battery.

Above 15 pounds electric can seem quite expensive due to the up-front investment in chargers and batteries. And you will need a power source to recharge those big battery packs. A couple of chargers from the car battery and the car won't start.

Today's computer radios are basically computer systems. They include multiple models memories that store the settings for each plane. As Buschbarber said, normally you can't mix brands of receivers and radios. It is more like PCM than PPM/FM, if that means anything to you. But there are a growing number of compatible receivers that are helping to lower the cost of 2.4 GHz radios. You can get FASST (Futaba) and DSM2 (JR/Spektrum) receivers that are 1/3 to 1/4 the cost of the brand name receivers.

2.4 GHz is the way of the world now with 72 MHz dying off. For the simple fact that it eliminates frequency control issues it is a better technology. And there are things like telemetry that are hitting the market for these 2.4 GHz systems.

Here is an free on-line book on electric flight:

EVERYTHING YOU WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT ELECTRIC POWERED FLIGHT

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7100376/tm.htm

More reading

How Many Channels Do You Need?

http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/vbglossar.php?do=showentry&id=35

Upgrading your 72 MHz radio to 2.4 GHz –

http://www.flyesl.org/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=454

< Message edited by aeajr -- 4/22/2012 9:28 PM >

_____________________________

Long Island Silent Flyers
www.lisf.org

Hide Signatures

(in reply to BuschBarber)

Post #: 5

RE: Newbie question - 4/22/2012 7:02 PM

karolh

Posts: 5623
Score: 310
Joined: 5/16/2002
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Mandeville, JAMAICA
Status: offline

Welcome back to one of the greatest hobbies ever. You have been given some excellent advice by all the posters to this thread, to which I will just add my .02 cents. Read everything you can get your hands on, as a multitude of things have changed and numerous new developments have taken place in our sport during your absence. My advice is to get hooked up with a club in your area so as to see first hand where we are now at, and to get a good feel of what's what.

Karol

_____________________________

When inverted always remember that down is up and visa versa

Hide Signatures

(in reply to CPTOZZY)

Post #: 6

RE: Newbie question - 4/22/2012 10:25 PM

bem

Certified

Posts: 1008
Score: 115
Joined: 2/24/2009
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Filipstad, , SWEDEN
Status: offline

Hi,

Maybe this plane that includes everyting you need to get started can be something?

http://www.hobbiconexstar.com/nexstar-ep/index.html

It is rather large but that is not any disadvantage when learning to fly (I learned to fly with a rather large plane, 60 inch/1500 mm wingspan, and it was great).

Some want to learn by themselves, others prefer to be member of an RC club and get help that way.
The later is usually cheaper, safer and more fun.

You do not need a 7-8 ch radio to start with but if You are sure you are going to be in the hobby for a while it can be good to buy a radio with some extra channels already from the start. Visit some RC club where You live and talk to them what they recommend, it can be good to use radio brand that is used by many there to get advice on programming of the radio and such later. And I'm sure they can recommend some good plane based on present and past experience. And assign You a teacher for Your student traning flights etc.

I learned to fly RC in 1973 and I learned on a Graupner Taxi plane with Enya 29 glow engine, radio was Robbe 4 ch (3 ch used with the Taxi plane) - Robbe radio was actually a Futaba radio, back then as it is today. I use Futaba today (14MZ).

/Bo

Hide Signatures

(in reply to karolh)

Post #: 7

RE: Newbie question - 4/23/2012 10:22 AM

CPTOZZY

Posts: 27
Score: 100
Joined: 4/22/2012
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Richmond Hill, GA, USA
Status: offline

Thanks for the Great info !

Once I get back Home I will get my "First" Plane, and I will remember your advice to start with a Larger Wingspan. A nice slow trainer like the Nexstar looks good. I'm not one of those guys that wants to start off with 200mph Jet ........... Although the "3D" Planes that Hover look really fun.

I used to be pretty good at building the models (and I REALLY Enjoyed that), but from what I now see online the vast majority seems to be ARF and styrofoam.....

Right now I am In Seoul South Korea, right in the heart of the City So my available space to actually fly a model plane is non-existant. There is enough park space to play with a helicopter , although when I last flew there wern't any RC helicopters to speak of - So one more question about Radios - Can I buy one Radio and use it for both RC Planes and RC Helicopters, or are there practical features of each rotary wing aircraft radio that would exclude its use in a fixed wing (and vice - versa).

Thanks Again !

CPT Ozzy

Hide Signatures

(in reply to CPTOZZY)

Post #: 8

RE: Newbie question - 4/23/2012 12:07 PM

BuschBarber

Posts: 4698
Score: 104
Joined: 1/7/2002
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Rochester, NY, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CPTOZZY

Thanks for the Great info !

Once I get back Home I will get my ''First'' Plane, and I will remember your advice to start with a Larger Wingspan. A nice slow trainer like the Nexstar looks good. I'm not one of those guys that wants to start off with 200mph Jet ........... Although the ''3D'' Planes that Hover look really fun.

I used to be pretty good at building the models (and I REALLY Enjoyed that), but from what I now see online the vast majority seems to be ARF and styrofoam.....

Right now I am In Seoul South Korea, right in the heart of the City So my available space to actually fly a model plane is non-existant. There is enough park space to play with a helicopter , although when I last flew there wern't any RC helicopters to speak of - So one more question about Radios - Can I buy one Radio and use it for both RC Planes and RC Helicopters, or are there practical features of each rotary wing aircraft radio that would exclude its use in a fixed wing (and vice - versa).

Thanks Again !

CPT Ozzy

Many people use one radio for both, but as you get more serious about Helis, you will find that there are switch locations and ratchetless throttle that are more appropriate for Helis than Fixed Wing aircraft.

There are a number of Micro aircraft that can be flown indoors or in tight spaces from companies like Parkzone. The Ember and Vapor can fly very slow, for example, but there are smaller aircraft than that.

_____________________________

Rich
byronf16@gmail.com

Hide Signatures

(in reply to CPTOZZY)

Post #: 9

RE: Newbie question - 4/23/2012 12:23 PM

bem

Certified

Posts: 1008
Score: 115
Joined: 2/24/2009
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Filipstad, , SWEDEN
Status: offline

Hi,

Another large rather popular beginner plane here in Europe is Mentor from Multiplex. It is a foam (named Elapor) plane.
http://www.multiplexusa.com/model-kits/mentor.html
http://www.multiplex-rc.de/en/products/categories/products/details/productgroup/rc-accessories/productcategory/elapor-models-1/product/kit-mentor-1.html?tx_lwshopitems_pi1%5Baction%5D=show&tx_lwshopitems_pi1%5Bcontroller%5D=Product&cHash=cd0b7ecd7244d779f868773fc7e10dd0
Spare parts is also avaliable.

Today many computer driven radios about 6 ch and up usually have both airplane and heli basic programming so they can be used for both.
For example Futaba 6EX and up have that, Spektrum DX6i and up have that.
For more advanced programming for both airplane and helicopters usually 8 ch or more have that, like Futaba 8FG and up, and Spektrum DX8 and up.
Although there are many China clones (copies) today it can be good in the long run to get a brand that has been RC business for long time. Quality, reliability, good and promt service, good and plenty of accessories etc is important but if one has a tight budget the China clones may well be worth to consider. There are some European radios also that is sold in US like Graupner (their MX-12 to 20 2.4 GHz radios for example). Two in my club have Graupner MX-16 (8 ch) radios with telemetry and they work fine.
http://www.v-eastonline.com/categories/Radio-Equipment/RC-System/
Many use Spektrum radios in USA, it is US radio (Horizon Hobby).

/Bo

Hide Signatures

(in reply to CPTOZZY)

Post #: 10

RE: Newbie question - 4/23/2012 9:29 PM

chuckk2

Posts: 366
Score: 106
Joined: 7/24/2007
Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Warner Robins, GA, USA
Status: offline

The need and use for "extra channels is not always obvious, and can be hard to explain.
Basics
One channel per servo is usually preferred, since this allows the channel to be setup in terms of centering and travel for each servo. (Trim)
Channels can be related to each other. This allows the transmitter to send channel control pulses based upon function rather than an arbitrary order.
There are output channels, and input sources, such as switches, levers knobs, and joysticks. In the past each used up at least a channel.
Today's computerized transmitters provide ways to do other things , such as mixing, master slave, and multiple settings for flight modes.
There is both input and output mixing, as well as supplementary mixing.

Simple examples include Flaps with two servos, and coupling via mixing to the elevator.
Another newer feature is the ability to make the primary flight control channels less sensitive around the center.
Or, perhaps differential, where you want say ailerons to deflect more up than down, or perhaps add a little down aileron when the flaps are used.
A full size airplane often has adjustable trim controls. Generally these are placed in different settings for landing, take-off, and cruse.
Today's computerized transmitters can sort of duplicate this.

Perhaps an expansion of the channel concept should be to more clearly discriminate between output channels and input channels, where each"human interface" input device
becomes an input channel. I.E. eight output channels may have at least twice as many "input channels"

Hide Signatures

(in reply to bem)