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Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme Speeds - 5/8/2012 8:33 PM

dubdub

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Hi,

I Am Making A Dune Beast I Want To Beat The Baja's In Dune.

I Got A Rustler The Motor Is Broken And The ESC Is MMP In Good Condition Ordering Soon Steel CVD And FLM Case.
I Am Confused What Motor I Get.

Money Is Not A Problem.
There is No Diffrence Between The MMP And MMM Just The Size Right?
Lower Kv Means Higher Speeds Right?
I Looked At The Castle Creation 2200kv Its Realy Fast But Can It Beat The Tekin 1700kv On Speed?
I'll Run It On 6s LiPo When Racing With Baja 5s LiFe On Bashing.
Whats The Pros And Cons Of Both Brands And What Do You Recommend These Or Other Motor.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/8/2012 10:49 PM

SyCo_VeNoM

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quote:

Money Is Not A Problem.

Money might not be a problem but there are piles of problems with this

One it is a rustler... why in the hell you are trying to fit a 1/8th scale motor in rustler is beyond me. And how you will make the rustler gears, and driveshafts not snap under the torque is beyond me.

quote:

There is No Diffrence Between The MMP And MMM Just The Size Right?

YES there is a difference the MMP is rated 65 AMPS a 1/8th scale motor can potentially start that sucker on fire literally seeing most can pull 120amps. The MMM is 120A's(or was it 200A's CC really needs to stop the naming everything mamba nonsense, and just use damn current specs)
Good luck running the MMP on 6S while finding a motor with a low enough KV that will not explode from it.

quote:

Lower Kv Means Higher Speeds Right?

Higher KV = Higher speed less torque
KV = RPM's per volt
But hell this is a rustler for gods sake so torque IMO is a non factor.

quote:

I Looked At The Castle Creation 2200kv Its Realy Fast But Can It Beat The Tekin 1700kv On Speed?
I'll Run It On 6s LiPo When Racing With Baja 5s LiFe On Bashing.
Whats The Pros And Cons Of Both Brands And What Do You Recommend These Or Other Motor.

I wouldn't recommend either motor you listed. If you REALLY want a fast rustler get a 3500kv-4000kv 60-65A 1/10th scale motor and run it on 2S or 3S.

Trust me on this Traxxas's drive shafts have issues on 2S, and 3S. 5S, and 6S on them will destroy them instantly. Even the gears in the transmission will not survive. Outside getting a machine shop to custom make you all the parts in the transmission I do not see this being possible.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 1:49 AM

nitrosportsandrunner

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heres how I would build what you are going for....

1inch axle extenders on all 4 corners.

Lengthen the rustler chassis about 2 inches with custom metal plates.

MIP or integy driveshafts.

Paddle tires.

As for power....I dont think you need an insane system to beat baja's out in the sand.

You can go mamba, or a ezrun 120/180amp system.

But the VXL sytem on 3s will be enough.

If you use a 1/8 scale system....which will have a 5mm motor shaft...you will want a Hot Racing 32 pitch spur gear. That will open up the gear options. There are lots more 5mm shaft pinion gears.

It will also allow use of a lower KV motor. I wouldnt go to low tho. Id still use a 2900-3300kv myself, unless you really want to run 4s lipo.

Out in the hot, a fan and heatsink are a good idea.

Last idea is to use 14 or 17mm hub adapters so you can run larger paddle tires (like ones for a buggy or the emaxx)

2 pics for you...one shows slight chassis stretch by reversing the tranny's direction. This places the motor forward for better weight placement and adds some length.
The second shows a good 2 inch stretch.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 1:58 AM

nitrosportsandrunner

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or u can turn the rustler 2 1/5 sxale.

i didi it to a stampede.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 4:22 AM

dubdub

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*FLM Steel CVD

*FLM Case (can support to 1/8 motor)

*MMM ESC

*17mm hex for 1/8 puddle tire

*gearing will be 16/84 for bashing 31/76 for baja.
*CC CapPack

What about 2650kv castle creation?

I also do speed runs 100mph+ and then put it in Savage Xl.

Here in dubai dunes they got realy fast baja's all with OBR engines i want to beat them

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 4:56 AM

nitrosportsandrunner

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quote:

ORIGINAL: dubdub

Ok
*FLM Steel CVD
*FLM Case (can support to 1/8 motor)
*MMM ESC
*17mm hex for 1/8 puddle tire
*gearing will be 16/84 for bashing 31/76 for baja.
*CC CapPack
What about 2650kv castle creation?

I also do speed runs 100mph+ and then put it in Savage Xl.
Here in dubai dunes they got realy fast baja's all with OBR engines i want to beat them

personally, i would get the 14mm adapters and run emaxx paddle tires. much wider than 1/8 scale buggy paddle tires.

You can go as low KV as you want if you are prepared to run more power, 4 or 6s.

Go with the 32 pitch steel spur upgrade as well. It bolts onto the stock slipper clutch. And if you are gonna run a motor with a 5mm shaft then youll want to have a 32 pitch pinion gear.

Do you plan to lengthen it? If you dont, with all the power it will just wheely all the time. That wont let it be fast in the sand.
Maybe lengthen it and mount the extra battery packs up front somehow.

Maybe a custom skid plate up front as well? One that will keep the front from digging into the sand on jumps ect?

New, sealled ball bearings all the way around isnt a bad idea either.

Id bet a 1/5 scale rustler on 6s lipo would mess with those baja guys

My 1/5 stampede was stretched 10 inches, used integy CVD's (worked, but not the best) and a widened front end (modded rear a-arms to work on the front)

< Message edited by nitrosportsandrunner -- 5/11/2012 5:58 PM >

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 8:55 AM

dubdub

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So All Good 2200kv Motor? (the 2650kv On 6s Is Faster than the 2200kv motor right?)Where Can I Make a Custom Chassis For My Rustler I Want To Make It 1/7 Or There Is Another Way.I Am Just Wondering On A Water Cooled rc I Can get good Radiator About 300gram And Small With A Pump But Where Can I Get A Water Cool Jacket For CC 1515 For Best Cooling

quote:

ORIGINAL: nitrosportsandrunner

quote:

ORIGINAL: dubdub

Ok
*FLM Steel CVD
*FLM Case (can support to 1/8 motor)
*MMM ESC
*17mm hex for 1/8 puddle tire
*gearing will be 16/84 for bashing 31/76 for baja.
*CC CapPack
What about 2650kv castle creation?
Â
I also do speed runs 100mph+ and then put it in Savage Xl.
Here in dubai dunes they got realy fast baja's all with OBR engines i want to beat them

personally, i would get the 14mm adapters and run emaxx paddle tires. much wider than 1/8 scale buggy paddle tires.

You can go as low KV as you want if you are prepared to run more power, 4 or 6s.

Go with the 32 pitch steel spur upgrade as well. It bolts onto the stock slipper clutch. And if you are gonna run a motor with a 5mm shaft then youll want to have a 32 pitch pinion gear.

Do you plan to lengthen it? If you dont, with all the power it will just wheely all the time. That wont let it be fast in the sand.
Maybe lengthen it and mount the extra battery packs up front somehow.

Maybe a custom skid plate up front as well? One that will keep the front from digging into the sand on jumps ect?

New, sealled ball bearings all the way around isnt a bad idea either.

Id bet a 1/5 scale rustler on 6s lipo would mess with those baja guys My 1/5 stampede was stretched 10 inches, used integy CVD's (worked, but not the best) and a widened front end (modded rear a-arms to work on the front)

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 5:00 PM

nitrosportsandrunner

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A good fan and heat sink is more effective than water cooling. Water cooling is still to complex, and the radiator would have to large to catch enough air to actually cool the fluid.

You wont find a ready made stretched chassis for the rustler.

The easiest way is to remove the transmission for the chassis. The get some decent metal plate and drill it so that it can bolt where the tranny should go...and then bolt the tranny onto it. The longer the plate...the greater the stretch.I g

On my stampede, I actually cut the chassis in half, then used alum plate to add 8 inches. The plates just bolted to either half of the chassis. The same could be done to the rustler as well.
If you are gonna stretch it that far, then you will want axle extensions and a modified front end (using rear a-arms) If you add more than 2 inches to the length without adding width it will end up looking funny.

I bought the metal I used for my stampede at a hardware store. A hardware kit (like the stainless steel kits sold for many traxxas models on ebay) help alot in this kinda project. You are gonna want plenty of screws/nuts to attatch the plates to the chassis.

Depending on how long a stretch you do, you could end up using a Baja, or Rampage XB body on the rustler. I used a Rampage XT body on my stampede.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 5:48 PM

dubdub

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Where Can I Get The Best Heat Sink + Fan( I Thought Of Dual Fan Toeghter x2.)
I Dont Want To Soo Long 4-5 Inchs Will Be Enogh I Think.

quote:

ORIGINAL: nitrosportsandrunner

A good fan and heat sink is more effective than water cooling. Water cooling is still to complex, and the radiator would have to large to catch enough air to actually cool the fluid.

You wont find a ready made stretched chassis for the rustler.

The easiest way is to remove the transmission for the chassis. The get some decent metal plate and drill it so that it can bolt where the tranny should go...and then bolt the tranny onto it. The longer the plate...the greater the stretch.I g

On my stampede, I actually cut the chassis in half, then used alum plate to add 8 inches. The plates just bolted to either half of the chassis. The same could be done to the rustler as well.
If you are gonna stretch it that far, then you will want axle extensions and a modified front end (using rear a-arms) If you add more than 2 inches to the length without adding width it will end up looking funny.

I bought the metal I used for my stampede at a hardware store. A hardware kit (like the stainless steel kits sold for many traxxas models on ebay) help alot in this kinda project. You are gonna want plenty of screws/nuts to attatch the plates to the chassis.

Depending on how long a stretch you do, you could end up using a Baja, or Rampage XB body on the rustler. I used a Rampage XT body on my stampede.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 5:55 PM

nitrosportsandrunner

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Getting a heatsink/fan for the motor is a bit tough for the 2wd traxxas models....since half of the motor sits in the trans case.

I know there are some heat sink/fan combos sold on ebay for the 2wd's. The heat sink has to be kinda small to fit onto the motor.

If you will be using a longer can motor, this might help some.

As far as the ESC, whatever fan looks like it would be easiest to mount is what I would get.

As long as you dont gear the crap out of your system, then heat wont be a huge issue for you. I know you want high speeds, but the right ESC/motor/lipo combo will get you there easy enough.
figure that the rustler will do 60mph with conservative gearing on the stock VXL system on 3s lipo.
Run a conservative gearing on a 6s system with a high 2000ish KV motor and you should be able to hit 100mph without much trouble...except the trouble of keeping the front wheels on the ground.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/9/2012 7:24 PM

dubdub

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All Good But WHAT MOTOR?? 2650kv Or 2200kv
BTW the 2650kv is faster by how much?
The FLM Trans Case Is Good.

quote:

ORIGINAL: nitrosportsandrunner

Getting a heatsink/fan for the motor is a bit tough for the 2wd traxxas models....since half of the motor sits in the trans case.

I know there are some heat sink/fan combos sold on ebay for the 2wd's. The heat sink has to be kinda small to fit onto the motor.

If you will be using a longer can motor, this might help some.

As far as the ESC, whatever fan looks like it would be easiest to mount is what I would get.

As long as you dont gear the crap out of your system, then heat wont be a huge issue for you. I know you want high speeds, but the right ESC/motor/lipo combo will get you there easy enough.
figure that the rustler will do 60mph with conservative gearing on the stock VXL system on 3s lipo.
Run a conservative gearing on a 6s system with a high 2000ish KV motor and you should be able to hit 100mph without much trouble...except the trouble of keeping the front wheels on the ground.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/10/2012 7:51 PM

jayjay283

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FLM makes an extended chassis for the rustler, its only 25mm more but I ran 5s and 6s on a 2200kv MMM system and it made using larger lipos easier

http://www.fastlanemachine.net/products.php?cat=14&pg=2

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/10/2012 8:32 PM

nitrosportsandrunner

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you can stretch the chassis to just what you want for under $20 in metal/nuts/bolts.

I dont see that chassis worth $70+

And Id bet its heavier.

A metal trans case will help to lower motor temps a bit.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/10/2012 9:25 PM

FahrtAutoRC

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Don't you love it when the best advice is pushed aside because it didn't coincide exactly with the persons plans?

quote:

ORIGINAL: SyCo_VeNoM

quote:

Money Is Not A Problem.

Money might not be a problem but there are piles of problems with this

One it is a rustler... why in the hell you are trying to fit a 1/8th scale motor in rustler is beyond me. And how you will make the rustler gears, and driveshafts not snap under the torque is beyond me.

quote:

There is No Diffrence Between The MMP And MMM Just The Size Right?

YES there is a difference the MMP is rated 65 AMPS a 1/8th scale motor can potentially start that sucker on fire literally seeing most can pull 120amps. The MMM is 120A's(or was it 200A's CC really needs to stop the naming everything mamba nonsense, and just use damn current specs)
Good luck running the MMP on 6S while finding a motor with a low enough KV that will not explode from it.

quote:

Lower Kv Means Higher Speeds Right?

Higher KV = Higher speed less torque
KV = RPM's per volt
But hell this is a rustler for gods sake so torque IMO is a non factor.

quote:

I Looked At The Castle Creation 2200kv Its Realy Fast But Can It Beat The Tekin 1700kv On Speed?
I'll Run It On 6s LiPo When Racing With Baja 5s LiFe On Bashing.
Whats The Pros And Cons Of Both Brands And What Do You Recommend These Or Other Motor.

I wouldn't recommend either motor you listed. If you REALLY want a fast rustler get a 3500kv-4000kv 60-65A 1/10th scale motor and run it on 2S or 3S.

Trust me on this Traxxas's drive shafts have issues on 2S, and 3S. 5S, and 6S on them will destroy them instantly. Even the gears in the transmission will not survive. Outside getting a machine shop to custom make you all the parts in the transmission I do not see this being possible.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/10/2012 10:17 PM

kahnen

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People learn differently.

Some people learn from others mistakes, some learn from their own.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/11/2012 3:41 PM

jayjay283

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the 2650 on 6s will be 66,000 rpm, so over the 60,000 recommended. Dubai is hot, the 2200 could be geared up and most likely stay cooler. A 2200 on 6s could propel a rustler to over 125mph. According to BrianG's site http://scriptasylum.com/rc_speed/top_speed.html

Differential Ratio: 1
Transmission Ratio: 2.727272727272727
Other Ratio: 1
Spur Tooth Count: 36
Pinion Tooth Count: 20
Total Voltage: 25.20
Motor KV: 2200
Tire Diameter (inches): 4.25
Tire Ballooning (inches): 0
Motor Current Draw: 0
Motor Coil Resistance: 0.006
Spur/Pinion Ratio: 1.8 : 1
Total Ratio: 4.90909 : 1
Tire Circumference (inches): 13.35 inches (339.13 mm)
Rollout: 2.72:1
Total Motor Speed: 55440 RPM
Vehicle Speed: 142.79 mph (229.37 km/h)
Effective KV Value: 2200

thats with a nitro revo 36t spur and a 20tooth pinion

either way you HAVE to take some video of this ripping across the dunes. It will be sick !!!!

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/11/2012 4:17 PM

Foxy

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If you have plans for 6S bashing in a hot country, don't go over 2000kv.

You want this...nothing else... http://www.amainhobbies.com/product_info.php/cPath/1_221_1355/products_id/36905/n/Tekin-RX8-Redline-T8-1-8th-Scale-Truggy-Brushless-ESC-Motor-Combo-2000kV

By the way, if you put this in a rustler on 6S, the car will last less then 30 seconds. Less than 10 on sand, mark my words. The wheels won't even stay on.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/11/2012 4:25 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jayjay283
either way you HAVE to take some video of this leaving a trail of broken parts across the dunes. It will be sick !!!!

There ya go, fixed that for ya. lol.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/11/2012 4:34 PM

SyCo_VeNoM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Foxy

quote:

ORIGINAL: jayjay283
either way you HAVE to take some video of this leaving a trail of broken parts across the dunes. It will be sick !!!!

There ya go, fixed that for ya. lol.

I doubt it would move 5 feet before the tranny explodes seeing we all know the thing would be floored right away(even tapping the throttle would prolly destroy it)

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/11/2012 6:07 PM

nitrosportsandrunner

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If 100mph is the goal....and we dont want to blow the rusty to pieces then a 4s system should do the job. 2500-2900kv 1/8 scale motor with a 4s ESC (or better yet a system made to handle 6s but run with 4s, which will keep the heat down)

I dont see any reason that a high 2000ish KV 1/8 scale motor wont hit 100mph on 4s in a rustler.

And with CVD driveshafts it should hold up OK.

Some have mentioned the tranny gears. Yes, even on 3s it is possible to break the trans gears.....but only after a good deal of hard bashing.

And since sand gives (low traction) this should lesson the strain on the driveline! It should be like driving a onroad car with drift tires (again, low traction)
Since there isnt alot of resistance getting the tires turning.

Id say grab a 6s ESC, and a 1/8 scale 2500-2900kv motor. Youll have to play with gearing a bit, but it shouldnt be hard to find one that will get you better than 75mph.

VXL motor on 11.1v=38,850 rpms(no load)
2900kv motor on 14.2v=41,180

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/12/2012 3:29 PM

jayjay283

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thats what im saying nitrosportsandrunner. Its sand ! that bad boy will roost 50ft roosts. I didnt rip up the vxl tranny on 6s on the street. I did blow out the diff eventually then packed it with jb weld and went with a poor mans spool. I did have the fastlane tranny case and the flm cvds http://www.fastlanemachine.net/proddetail.php?prod=flm26515&cat=14

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/13/2012 3:34 PM

PortoRocSC10

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Definitely would like to see a video of this project. 50ft roosts in dubai's over 100 degrees of weather.

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RE: Tekin Or Castle Creation For Rustler Dune Extreme S... - 5/13/2012 7:23 PM

jayjay283

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looks like it will be over 100 there all week with a nice break of 98 on thursday, prime conditions for heat stroke, but as long as you keep airflow going to the bad boy it will stay cool (?) Video

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