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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/19/2012 5:13 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		If it pulls to the canopy in KE it could be flying with up elevator dialed in. Move the CG back and see if the elevator trim goes to neutral.


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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/19/2012 1:19 PM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		Thanks CP, that turned out to be having the ailerons drooped just a tiny bit so they were acting like flaps. Moving the CG back took out the rest. I changed the plans to reflect the CG with an empty tank and it gives a pretty good starting range (Your actual results may vary) I trimmed the top of the rudder back twice (also adjusted in plans), so now with just a touch of aileron mixed in she flies knife edge pretty much hands off and needs very little rudder to do it. I think I can still move the CG back even more, but right now I've been flying it in 15mph winds, so I want to try that on a calmer day.

There is a lot to be said for going through the trimming process one step at a time. And only burning 1oz per flight, there is realy no excuse not to.

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/19/2012 4:30 PM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		Nice job of looking your plane over to catch the elevator trim problem..!
The old saying of "bigger flies better" applies to knife edge flight where the Reynolds numbers of a 1/2A fuselage aren't in your favor. If you've got a 1/2A design that handles this chore well, you've got something special...... then it's time to seek out all the 1/2A pattern contests you can make it to.
It seems like I've read recently about interest in 1/2A pattern somewhere..?
It would make sense to see interest in small pattern if you have a bunch of giant scale flyers looking for a new challenge.


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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/19/2012 6:03 PM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		Thanks,
Yeah, we could just give the judges binoculers to see the planes
I'm not so much for pattern competitions, I just like planes that fly all the way through a manuver and not fall out half way through. Turns out the same planes fly in 15mph winds just fine too, so I'm a happy camper. It's just always hard to get it to translate down to 1/2A size.

Next up is a clean airfoil GLH for an AME on crank pressure. Nothing crazy, just something with more speed and I need a home for a couple of AME's anyway. Both are RC, one of them I have already cleaned up the crank and bored the carb out a bit, so I'll see what I can get with no muffler and crank pressure. I know the carb will be more of an on/off switch, but that's fine too.

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/19/2012 6:36 PM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		I think the Utah Pylon racers were building their GLHs with 1/2" to 5/8" thick airfoils....?
They are such great overall flying planes. It was my first fast plane and it was the most bizarre building experience for me at the time with the unorthodox design features.


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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/19/2012 7:06 PM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		I had one many moons ago with the foam wing and a Tee Dee. Didn't seem much faster than a Sig Hummer with the fat wing. I'm thinking of the tried and true RG14 airfoil. Or did you think thinner? That one is about 8.5%

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/20/2012 12:16 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		For all out speed in that size range [30"x 7"] and with a AME turning a 4.5x4 APC that first question is all wood or foam..?
If foam, do you want to vaccuum bag it..?
To get thin enough for a 4.5 inch prop to pull real fast, I look at what the control line speed guys do...look for a way to build it as thin but twist resistant as possible. Gotta think thin thin thin with 4 inch props.."normal or conventional" thinking about airfoil thicknesses like you would on bigger planes don't translate to such limited thrust with 1/2A.

So....oh yah, almost forgot...8% sounds pretty good...but pretty challenging to do with all wood.


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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/20/2012 1:28 AM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		Hey, I hijacked my own thread!
I would go all wood. Probably try and lighten/streamline the fuse too. As for a wing, I built this one all wood. 32" X 6.75" and just over 1/2" thick at the root, much thinner at the tips. Something similar?

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/20/2012 1:49 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		That's the ticket..! For a 1/2" thick wing that is a big as that one, what are you using for spars..?
What would really help [I think] would be a real high heat covering that might not have much shrink, but will hold it's size after being ironed on, stay tight as a drum and of course not weigh too much.
Micafilm IIRC was something similar to that, but I only used it once 25 years ago and I vaguely remember how it actually performed.
Both GLHs in the photo are rough copies of the original. The one in the foreground needed a couple wraps of lead solder around the engine to fly right. There is a HS-65 elevator servo mounted behind the wing with a 2-56 pushrod....but it was easy and makes me feel safe[r].
Trouble is, it did cause the model to come out tail heavy without using lead.

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/20/2012 1:55 PM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		Nice looking planes CP. Looks like cyclone or Fora? The one in the back looks more stock, the foreground looks like some mods and streamlining were done.
I ended up using 3/32 X 1/4 hardwood spars. I wanted to use 1/8X1/4 but by the time I got to the tip ribs they were basically touching. With 3/32 I had just a sliver of rib between, so the 3 outboard ribs were some delicate work . Then I used 1/32 sheeting. Doing a constant cord wing would be duck soup after that.

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/20/2012 3:16 PM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		Sounds like delicate surgery fitting those ribs. I've never tried doing a wing that thin the conventional built up way.
The plane in the background is slightly larger than the original GLH and it carries .10 size engines. The red one has a Cyclon. The plane was built for a local club's racing rules which stipulated minimum 200 sq inch and 1 inch thickness wing, but anything goes for the fuselage....just no cowls. The engines are either TDs or AMEs.
The course record at that club might still be held by a GLH running a AME .061. All the AMEs are supposed to be stock, but there's 1 guy who runs the show down there whose engines / planes are noticeably faster on the course. I'll bet they are doing over 90 mph.


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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/23/2012 12:59 AM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		I got a chance to get some video today in between the rain. Enjoy!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DuFvfKcRuY&feature=youtu.be



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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/23/2012 7:24 AM   
alcarafa



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Status: offline 		Cool like your video, plane flies fast, very acrobatic and does not show any bad habits.
Congratulations you scored high with your design.

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/23/2012 2:00 PM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		Thanks Rafa,
The whole flight, even the avalanche and vertical snap roll was done on low rates (65%) At full throttle and high rates the rolls become a blur and the snaps get real violent (and fun) I still have some room to move the CG back even more as it is still rock solid slow speed. I think I may swap the Sullivan tank out for a Hayes rectangle, which should lose another oz or so in the nose, and overall which is always a good thing

Bill

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/23/2012 6:38 PM   
alcarafa



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Status: offline 		Bill just noticed you live in Vero Beach my oldest brother went to FLIGHT SAFETY school in there, he was pilot for Mexicana Airlines like my father.

Sad Mexicana broke and was shut down .

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/23/2012 9:28 PM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		Really gorgeous, Bill.
You hit a HR with the size, the looks and the way it flys.
It looks like all onboard survived the belly landing, too.


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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 6/24/2012 12:05 AM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		Thanks CP,
I refuse to be restricted by reynolds numbers I've been fighting them for a long time trying to get a 1/2A that flys like a 40. This one seems the closest yet. Has good low and high speed and seems to have a good weight to power ratio so I don't have to fly full throttle just to get it through a manuver.

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RE: SlipStream 74 (Video and plans added) - 7/12/2012 2:54 PM   
hllywdb



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Status: online 		As an addendum, Kudos to Mr. Cox. The Sullivan tanks are quite heavy, due in part to the large stopper (the same setup as a 16oz tank.) After reading his Chipmonk thread, I switched to a Hayes 2oz and saved almost an oz, most importantly in the nose, which let me take some weight off the tail I had added for balance, so I probably saved somewhere between an 1 and 1 1/2 oz. Plus it fits a lot better and the fuel draw runs straight out the firewall with no bends.

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