quote:

ORIGINAL: G4guy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rrragmanliam

Ok Jimmac here we go.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac do you consider yourself a christian[?]

If you mean have I accepted Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior, and do I realize that the only way I can have a relationship with the living God is to accept the sacrifice Jesus made for my sins on the cross, well then yes I am a Christian.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac AS for our health care system is based on the principal of universal health care.

Yea I understand the premise. I meant a nationalized government run health care system. The private sector can and does do it better.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac regardless of your income or background....

Your wrong here, what your system does is create a larger demand on a diminishing supply. It's why you have to wait days and weeks and months for appointments and procedures. Many patients with the means bypass your and Canada’s healthcare system and come to the states for treatment because they know the can get care now not later. Additionally we have a healthcare plan for those who cannot afford private health insurance it’s called Medicade .

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac I think any human regardless of their nationality wants to refuse to have universal health care for all the people in their country are no more better than the people who carry out genocide for whatever pitiful reason they do.

Think what you want. What I think is this is a stupid statement the two are in no way analogous.

Darren

Okay, would this happen in the UK or Canada?

I totaly screwed up my knee on vacation and then I went to a jet-fly where it was so bad, I had to get a golf cart to go to and from the Flight line to the set up tents and my RV. (I couldn't miss Kentucky Jets)I called on Wednesday (July 11, 2012 and got an appointment the following Wednesday (July 18, 2012). I saw one of the top orthopedic surgeons in Pittsburgh and am scheduled for a full Knee replacement on August 8th. Excactly 4 weeks from first visit to surgery.
My company Health care plan had no issues, and will cover nearly all of the charges. I am looking forward to being able to being active again with no pain. I will be 53 tomorrow.
What kind of waits would I expect in the Uk or Canada?
Will my company still provide health care as part of my salary package?
Well, as the former speaker of the house said,"We have to pass health care law to know what's in it"
I want no part of it........................

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charlie P.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac

AS for our health care system is based on the principal of universal health care for all regardless of your income or background, unlike your morally and probably financially corrupt system where if you cant pay you can die or lose everything you own to pay for your health I feel sucks.I think any human regardless of their nationality wants to refuse to have universal health care for all the people in their country are no more better than the people who carry out genocide for whatever pitiful reason they do.

Oh, can I play?  In the US the "easy" health care is if you are poor you go to the Emergency Room and then the state/fed pays your way through the gift of taxpayer subsidy.  Just like their foodstamps and housing allowance, tuition grants, etc.  The rich can afford the best and do.  It's only the suffering middle class that must pay both taxes and medical insurance/ high deductables who suffer the burden.  But we're disappearing through attrition and soon the poor will flow out ouf our country into Mexico and Canada.  ;-)  Natural tidal cycles. 

But on the other hand - our horrible and lousy school systems are much in demand by all the foreign students who come here to study medicine and science.  Go figure.


My ancestors booked out of England in the early 1700's; having stopped there long enough to despoil it on their way out of Normandy.  I can pick it out on a map.  It's that little airstrip just off the coast of France.

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ORIGINAL: GraemeEllis

As Canadians, our healthcare is something we are very proud of.

quote:

ORIGINAL: GraemeEllis

Vasek - I've had very good treatment in Quebec, on multiple occasions. We certainly do need more funding, but our  gov't would rather buy F35's while cutting from everything else.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TimWatson



You are so funny you should be on the telly with such a witty comment. I wonder have you got a passport

quote:

The private sector can and does do it better. 

quote:

Many patients with the means bypass your and Canada’s healthcare system and come to the states for treatment because they know the can get care now not later.  

quote:

Additionally we have a healthcare plan for those who cannot afford private health insurance it’s called Medicade .  

quote:

If you think its sad to have Mitt  

quote:

ORIGINAL: eddieC

Loving the Olympics, good job UK!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charlie P.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TimWatson



You are so funny you should be on the telly with such a witty comment. I wonder have you got a passport

Yep.  Even been to : England, Scotland, France, Belgium, Germany (West, at the time), Italy, Luxemburg, Portugal, Spain, Switzerland and Monaco.  Had a Eurail Pass and everything.  Didn't get to Ireland as planned as they nailed Heathrow while I was in Europe and we opted to sit it out instead in a peaceful place . . . Germany.   ;-)

Sailed into Canada in my own 34' sailboat - I think that's especially travelly. 

I was impressed.  All of Great Britian is almost 50% larger than New York State!  But I've been much further from home than Europe.  I've driven to California! 1,000 miles further from home than it is from home to London.  YOU guys have no idea of scale.  ;-)

quote:

There is data out that supports my point regarding patients from Canada and Great Britain going to other countries the get health services they don’t want to wait for or can’t get at home.  

#1 What the United States spent on health care in 2009 was greater than the entire GDP of Great Britain.
#2 According to the Bureau of Economic Analysis, health care costs accounted for just 9.5% of all personal consumption back in 1980. Today they account for approximately 16.3%.
#3 The United States spent 2.47 trillion dollars on health care in 2009. It is being projected that the U.S. will spend 4.5 trillion dollars on health care in 2019.
#4 One study found that approximately 41 percent of working age Americans either have medical bill problems or are currently paying off medical debt.
#5 According to a report published in The American Journal of Medicine, medical bills are a major factor in more than 60 percent of the personal bankruptcies in the United States. Of those bankruptcies that were caused by medical bills, approximately 75 percent of them involved individuals that actually did have health insurance.
#6 Over the past decade, health insurance premiums have risen three times faster than wages have in the United States.
#7 The chairman of Aetna, the third largest health insurance company in the United States, brought in a staggering $68.7 million during 2010. Ron Williams exercised stock options that were worth approximately $50.3 million and he raked in an additional $18.4 million in wages and other forms of compensation. The funny thing is that he left the company and didn't even work the whole year.
#8 The top executives at the five largest for-profit health insurance companies in the United States combined to receive nearly $200 million in total compensation for 2009.
#9 Even as the rest of the country struggled with a deep recession, U.S. health insurance companies increased their profits by 56 percent during 2009 alone.
#10 According to a report by Health Care for America Now, America's five biggest for-profit health insurance companies ended 2009 with a
combined profit of $12.2 billion.

Please explain the efficiency in paying corporate heads hundreds of millions per year? While you're at it, think of a rationale for having insurance companies siphoning off billions per year.
 I have no problem with capitalism, but do have a problem with greed. Many top business schools and economists propose a ratio of earnings to executive pay as more reasonable.

Nationalized health care isn't my preference, but it's a move in the right direction.  It's what the people want, and the insurance and big pharm execs hate it because it may shed light into their ops.  

Facts. Let's see some. And don't go to a battle of wits unarmed next time.

quote:

ORIGINAL: G4guy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rrragmanliam

Ok Jimmac here we go.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac do you consider yourself a christian[?]

If you mean have I accepted Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior, and do I realize that the only way I can have a relationship with the living God is to accept the sacrifice Jesus made for my sins on the cross, well then yes I am a Christian.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac AS for our health care system is based on the principal of universal health care.

Yea I understand the premise. I meant a nationalized government run health care system. The private sector can and does do it better.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac regardless of your income or background....

Your wrong here, what your system does is create a larger demand on a diminishing supply. It's why you have to wait days and weeks and months for appointments and procedures. Many patients with the means bypass your and Canada’s healthcare system and come to the states for treatment because they know the can get care now not later. Additionally we have a healthcare plan for those who cannot afford private health insurance it’s called Medicade .

quote:

ORIGINAL: jimmac I think any human regardless of their nationality wants to refuse to have universal health care for all the people in their country are no more better than the people who carry out genocide for whatever pitiful reason they do.

Think what you want. What I think is this is a stupid statement the two are in no way analogous.

Darren

Okay, would this happen in the UK or Canada?

I totaly screwed up my knee on vacation and then I went to a jet-fly where it was so bad, I had to get a golf cart to go to and from the Flight line to the set up tents and my RV. (I couldn't miss Kentucky Jets)I called on Wednesday (July 11, 2012 and got an appointment the following Wednesday (July 18, 2012). I saw one of the top orthopedic surgeons in Pittsburgh and am scheduled for a full Knee replacement on August 8th. Excactly 4 weeks from first visit to surgery.
My company Health care plan had no issues, and will cover nearly all of the charges. I am looking forward to being able to being active again with no pain. I will be 53 tomorrow.
What kind of waits would I expect in the Uk or Canada?
Will my company still provide health care as part of my salary package?
Well, as the former speaker of the house said,''We have to pass health care law to know what's in it''
I want no part of it........................

quote:

ORIGINAL: eddieC

quote:

The private sector can and does do it better. 

Laughable. A profit-based system like ours is extremely wasteful. With health-care execs being given half-billion $ pay/benefit packages, would not the money be better spent on patients?

quote:

Many patients with the means bypass your and Canada’s healthcare system and come to the states for treatment because they know the can get care now not later.  

I haven't met one. Got any stats to back that up? Another myth.

quote:

Additionally we have a healthcare plan for those who cannot afford private health insurance it’s called Medicade .  

You can't even spell. 'Medicaid' isn't for those without health care. Check the requirements. If that were true, your provider would drop you in a New York minute.

How is it that the average American is such an expert on health care providers around the world?  Check how the WHO (World Health Organization) ranks our 'great' system:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Health_Organization_ranking_of_health_systems

37th!  Suck that, Slovenia! We are LAST among developed countries. 

You can keep drinking the corporate and Fox Kool-Aid, or you can start educating yourselves and read some world news outlets.

The final insult is referring to being a 'christian', and supporting a system that allows substandard care for almost 1 in 5 of the population.

quote:

If you think its sad to have Mitt  

  He's a joke, some reports are he's worse than Palin for being out-of-touch.

Rant over, sorry for the hijack.

Loving the Olympics, good job UK!

quote:

ORIGINAL: eddieC

rragmanliam,

quote:

  It's what the people want, and the insurance and big pharm execs hate it because it may shed light into their ops.  

Facts. Let's see some. And don't go to a battle of wits unarmed next time.

I'm sure you have poll results that will back this up? Maybe from one of the liberal media outlets noted above? In my world I'm runnin' about 5 to 1 against Obamacare, which pretty much aligns with your 1 out of 5 receiving substandard care. We can assume they receive substandard care because of affordability. If accurate this is of course unacceptable, but far more easily fixed at a state and local level. Name one thing the federal government does efficiently. 1 out of 5 is bad but it’s better than 5 out of 5.


Oh… and I think the Brits are doing a great job with the Olympics! Just wish NBC’s coverage was up to par.

< Message edited by edh13 -- 8/1/2012 9:43 PM >

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