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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/17/2012 7:23 PM   
jnhiller


 

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From: Spokane, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Interesting discussion. I had a slow morning and thought I'd visit CRU.
Flying turnaround with very high performance aircraft compared to 1980's ballistic pattern is a whole different world but every pattern aircraft I've built benefited from a little mix, and I mean little. Any more than about 6% was an unacceptable compromise. I like Alex, use two mixes 2% D-E & about 4% R-R. My best flying airplanes have both R-thrust and R-rudder mix and the bigger the prop the more difficult it is to find an acceptable combination / compromise.
I once put the top half of a one piece wing through the table saw re-glassed it 3 times before I was happy. I now incorporate an adjustable dihedral feature to adjust roll couple and pitch couple can be moved from + to - by changing trimmed horizontal speed / wing incidence and CG within reason without seriously affecting flight qualities, but I don't fly FAI which would present a whole new set of airframe demands.
I've always flown pattern for the challenge and as I age perfection becomes more distant but I can't quit flying a challenging sequence with friends in front of judges.
Jim D-8

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/22/2012 1:35 AM   
mithrandir



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Status: offline 		does one get extra points in IMAC or pattern if they don't use compensation mixing?

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/22/2012 2:42 AM   
jnhiller


 

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Status: offline 		No extra points for thumbing it or using single rates.
Jim

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 2:16 AM   
speedracerntrixie


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mithrandir

does one get extra points in IMAC or pattern if they don't use compensation mixing?



One usually ends up getting fewer points but gets justification for their complaining about going home empty handed. 



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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 2:31 AM   
oliveDrab



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quote:

ORIGINAL: jnhiller

No extra points for thumbing it or using single rates.
Jim

I'd have alot more respect for your comments about "thumbing it" if you had more than 11 posts.

I'm gonna thumb it........so there! NYAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!


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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 3:05 AM   
Bozarth


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: oliveDrab
...if you had more than 11 posts.
\


Really? How many posts are enough? How many posts are too much? Silly way to judge someone's comments.

Kurt


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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 3:40 AM   
oliveDrab



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bozarth


quote:

ORIGINAL: oliveDrab
...if you had more than 11 posts.
\


Really? How many posts are enough? How many posts are too much? Silly way to judge someone's comments.

Kurt


I knew that would get a response from somebody.


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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 3:44 AM   
cmoulder


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: oliveDrab


quote:

ORIGINAL: jnhiller

No extra points for thumbing it or using single rates.
Jim

I'd have alot more respect for your comments about ''thumbing it'' if you had more than 11 posts.

I'm gonna thumb it........so there! NYAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!



I'm also a "thumber" because right from the start it felt more natural to me. But shortly after I started flying RC in late 2005 I thought maybe I was doing something wrong and started looking for videos of some of the top guys to see what they were doing. I was surprised to see that Quique Somenzini is a thumber as well as a couple of the top Japanese pilots, so us thumbers are not alone nor necessarily suffer a disadvantage over the pinchers or the thumb/finger guys. I tried to change just to see if it would help, but it felt so foreign and wierd that I just gave up.

As for single rates, I hate hitting switches during a flight so I am experimenting with adding a bit more expo to to the snap/spin mode and flying it all there. It's working out pretty well so far, though I do need to add a bit more rudder throw.

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 4:19 AM   
Bozarth


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: oliveDrab


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bozarth


quote:

ORIGINAL: oliveDrab
...if you had more than 11 posts.
\


Really? How many posts are enough? How many posts are too much? Silly way to judge someone's comments.

Kurt


I knew that would get a response from somebody.



You got me!

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 5:42 AM   
MTK



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quote:

ORIGINAL: oliveDrab


quote:

ORIGINAL: jnhiller

No extra points for thumbing it or using single rates.
Jim

I'd have alot more respect for your comments about ''thumbing it'' if you had more than 11 posts.

I'm gonna thumb it........so there! NYAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!


If you had any dealings with Jim Hiller you might feel differently....So I have to assume you know him and are just poking fun.


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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 8:10 AM   
jnhiller


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Matt, How are you? 11 posts, golly gee I guess I've been too talkative.
I should have been more specific about thumbing it. In the previous post it was to infer no mixing, flying with sticks only not the method used to manipulate the sticks. I'm also a thumb flier as opposed to the pinch method and I'm too old to change.
In addition to using a couple mixes I use TX snap functions to tweak control throws without resorting to using dual rates. Differential aileron makes a non stalled 45 down 1 1/2 positive snap look pretty good. If you haven't already tried it, try it you'll like it. R-Snap = 90% R-ail, 35% L-ail, 130% elv, 85% rud. Can't thumb differential aileron! Ill probably tweak these settings some more before my flying season ends.
I like the new sequence!
Didn't mean to get off subject but thought you'd be interested.
For what its worth!
Jim

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 12:46 PM   
oliveDrab



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quote:

ORIGINAL: MTK


quote:

ORIGINAL: oliveDrab


quote:

ORIGINAL: jnhiller

No extra points for thumbing it or using single rates.
Jim

I'd have alot more respect for your comments about ''thumbing it'' if you had more than 11 posts.

I'm gonna thumb it........so there! NYAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!


If you had any dealings with Jim Hiller you might feel differently....So I have to assume you know him and are just poking fun.

Yes, I was just poking fun. However, I must apologize for my careless mention of "11 posts". As Bozarth pointed out, the number of posts a guy has, has nothing to do with the validity of his posts.........so once again.........I apologize for being thoughtless and silly.

I've gotta say, this thread has a ton of very useful technical information. Many thanks to all involved. I'm gonna use my thumbs alot differently now, lol.

And now I'm retreating off the internet with my tail between my legs after making that stoooopid remark about the number of posts. Sorry.





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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/27/2012 5:20 PM   
jnhiller


 

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Status: offline 		No problem, apology accepted. I've done and said things I've regretted for at least 60 years.
Jim

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/28/2012 3:40 AM   
Don Szczur



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Status: offline 		2004 NATS, FOCUS II, one mix- throttle to down elevator on the down line. I was flying later that fall on a calm evening and realized it needed a little mix adjustment (rudder to aileron and elevator), which I put in at that time. I still ended up about 4th, but wonder if I had all the detailed mixes in if it would have made a difference in higher placement.

Regards,
Don

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/28/2012 1:43 PM   
danamania


 

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Status: online 		I am getting that, if the question one tends to ask oneself (or peers) is how could I have placed higher flying this model, etc., then the matter of mixing (or not) is secondary to improving one's chances of winning the next contest. This may not matter to those who are not competing and so set-up and trim priorities likely differ depending on the goals for the model, or what problem the pilot is trying to solve?

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/29/2012 2:55 AM   
MTK



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Szczur

2004 NATS, FOCUS II, one mix- throttle to down elevator on the down line. I was flying later that fall on a calm evening and realized it needed a little mix adjustment (rudder to aileron and elevator), which I put in at that time. I still ended up about 4th, but wonder if I had all the detailed mixes in if it would have made a difference in higher placement.

Regards,
Don

Hey that reminds me, I need a couple ounces of nose weight in Aesthesis. She takes zero throttle to ele mix meaning she's too danged tail heavy. I'm goona do it right now b4 I foget...LOL! But man, do I hate adding weight

BTW Don, if I recall, you won the nats with one of those....


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MattK

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 9/29/2012 2:58 AM   
MTK



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quote:

ORIGINAL: jnhiller

Hi Matt, How are you? 11 posts, golly gee I guess I've been too talkative.
I should have been more specific about thumbing it. In the previous post it was to infer no mixing, flying with sticks only not the method used to manipulate the sticks. I'm also a thumb flier as opposed to the pinch method and I'm too old to change.
In addition to using a couple mixes I use TX snap functions to tweak control throws without resorting to using dual rates. Differential aileron makes a non stalled 45 down 1 1/2 positive snap look pretty good. If you haven't already tried it, try it you'll like it. R-Snap = 90% R-ail, 35% L-ail, 130% elv, 85% rud. Can't thumb differential aileron! Ill probably tweak these settings some more before my flying season ends.
I like the new sequence!
Didn't mean to get off subject but thought you'd be interested.
For what its worth!
Jim

Jim,

I'm back flying again, thanks for asking. Had to take the whole Summer off due to health but I'm back in the saddle and its great!


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MattK

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 10/2/2012 3:34 PM   
vbortone


 

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Status: offline 		I am not only using mixing but also 5 flight modes. It would be very interesting to hear other pilots opinion. I use the following flight modes: normal, snap, spin, low rudder and high rudder. High rudder for stall turns and ground handling.

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RE: Am I the only one who flies pattern with no mixes i... - 10/3/2012 1:12 AM   
speedracerntrixie


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vbortone

I am not only using mixing but also 5 flight modes. It would be very interesting to hear other pilots opinion. I use the following flight modes: normal, snap, spin, low rudder and high rudder. High rudder for stall turns and ground handling.


Very close to my setup. I have normal, snap, spin and roller flight modes.



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