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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/19/2012 11:43 PM

JPMacG

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S&W sells 1/2 A fuel. I think a quart can be shipped without the hazardous fee, and a quart is a lot for 1/2 A. Stan at S&W will mix up whatever nitro content you want. I think his standard 1/2A blend is 25%. www.s-whobby.com

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/20/2012 12:59 AM

combatpigg

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A quart for me is 16 flights @ 2 ozs per flight. More than I usually do in a day or two...but not what I'd consider a lot of fuel. If bladders are involved, figure on spillage losses as well.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/20/2012 1:51 AM

ffkiwi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler

Interesting experiences and observations with these Fuji engines, Chris. So Fuji, although a less popular brand was actually an excellent product.

George, Fuji were always an 'economy' brand even on the Japanese market-and as far as I can tell were not widely exported. They were exported into the UK in the mid 60's-but didn't seem to achieve much market penetration, and Hobby Shack seemed to be the main US source in the 70's and 80's. As the pamphlet lineup shows though, the range was quite prolific-though until your posting I'd never seen or heard of an ABC 099 model. All mine are steel, and the biggest I have is a 29, though they did produce a 35 at one stage and a 40.

The 15-IV seems to appear in two models-a baffle piston and the IBS 'Inner bypass schneurle' model. It was the latter that seems to be a 'sleeper' powerhouse and was received very favourable reviews when tested. You can read them here: www.sceptreflight.net/Model%20Engine%20Tests/Index.html (this has quite a compendium of scanned glow and diesel engine tests-the Fuji entry is towards the top of the middle column of the glow engine test index) There you will see that the 15-IV-S topped 0.4BHP at 20,000 on test-not a typical sports 15 performance by any means. Interestingly the test also alludes to a twin BB model shortly to be available (the article was dated Aug 1976)

There is also an on-going series of articles by Adrian Duncan on the history of Fuji engines on Ron Chernich's site: www.modelenginenews.org , which makes very interesting reading-as do all Adrian's articles on the history of various (generally obscure) engine brands. He really does his homework on his chosen subject......................

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/20/2012 2:26 AM

dbacque

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One more source. Great 1/2 A fuel, C/L fuel and even custom blends are available from GCBRCM http://www.gcbmrc.com/shop/category/glowboy-fuel/. I run nothing but their fuels and it's high quality juice.

I've have to admit that I know the man behind this fuel and he believes in American Made, American Proud. I've watched him mixing fuel to order, down to the decimal on a digital scale, with top quality ingredients. By the way, the web site doesn't mention it but gallons are available too. E-mail him and make him fess up! Shoot, I bought 2 gallons of 10% with Klotz synthetic oil from him just yesterday.

Personally, I use his 10% sport fuel (my biggest purchase from this guy), 15% castor blend fuel for my engines that need it, 1/2 A fuel, C/L Fox special fuel (where else will you find this?) and high oil content 4 stroke fuel. He's even blended special break in fuels for me based on high end engine manufacturer's recommendation.

Mike's a good guy and makes great fuel.

Dave

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/20/2012 4:26 AM

GallopingGhostler

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi George, Fuji were always an 'economy' brand even on the Japanese market-and as far as I can tell were not widely exported. They were exported into the UK in the mid 60's-but didn't seem to achieve much market penetration, and Hobby Shack seemed to be the main US source in the 70's and 80's. As the pamphlet lineup shows though, the range was quite prolific-though until your posting I'd never seen or heard of an ABC 099 model. All mine are steel, and the biggest I have is a 29, though they did produce a 35 at one stage and a 40.

Chris, that is an interesting perspective on the Fuji line. My only experience with them are the 2 099's on clearance I purchased from Hobby Shack in Southern California around the mid 1980's. They were phasing out the line then. I did have one Fuji .09 CL, a twin exhaust slug piston in a steel liner one someone gave me that I had mounted on a Midwest 33" span profile P-39 Air Cobra. It's been long since lost.

quote:

The 15-IV seems to appear in two models-a baffle piston and the IBS 'Inner bypass schneurle' model. It was the latter that seems to be a 'sleeper' powerhouse and was received very favourable reviews when tested. You can read them here: http://www.sceptreflight.net/Model%20Engine%20Tests/Index.html (this has quite a compendium of scanned glow and diesel engine tests-the Fuji entry is towards the top of the middle column of the glow engine test index) There you will see that the 15-IV-S topped 0.4BHP at 20,000 on test-not a typical sports 15 performance by any means. Interestingly the test also alludes to a twin BB model shortly to be available (the article was dated Aug 1976)

There is also an on-going series of articles by Adrian Duncan on the history of Fuji engines on Ron Chernich's site: http://www.modelenginenews.org , which makes very interesting reading-as do all Adrian's articles on the history of various (generally obscure) engine brands. He really does his homework on his chosen subject......................

Thanks for the links, Chris. I'll take a look when I get a chance. And Mr. Cox, combat pigg and others for their inputs and enlightenment.

If nothing else, and it's a little thing, what started out as a fuel search ended up into a learning lesson on this engine of mine. That little thing is that I can safely run O'Donnell and other's 30% Heli Fuel with 18% synthetic oil content in my Fuji 099S-II ABC, provided I don't run it lean or put it into a hot running condition. I'll limit the O'Donnell to my ABC/ABN engines, and use my Wildcat fuel with Castor oil blend for all my other engines.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/20/2012 5:26 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler

. I did have one Fuji .09 CL, a twin exhaust slug piston in a steel liner one someone gave me that I had mounted on a Midwest 33'' span profile P-39 Air Cobra. It's been long since lost.

quote:

That would have been one of the early models-perhaps dating as early as the early 1950s-but that 'twin stack' model stayed in production a long long time-possibly 15 years-see Adrian Duncan's articles (reference my previous post) for the details.

Most of my Fuji's are very second hand and mainly the R/C versions-many of which are incomplete, some missing rods, pistons and screws The only NIB one I have is a recent ebay acquisition-an 099 S-II R/C
Eventually I'll get around to making std venturis for them. The 099s are generally plastic-green or black, which I can duplicate in black Delrin. NVAs are not such a big problem as the current OS std 15-20 NVA is a good match. Mufflers are my biggest bugbear-originals are very scarce, and about half of my Fuji stock don't have them. I did discover by accident that the Thunder Tiger TT202 muffler (not a current Tt production) is a good fit for the Fuji 19-so if any one has a spare TT202 muffler they have no use for, get in touch (I have one, but need one more).......

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/20/2012 5:42 AM

combatpigg

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Has anyone tried the 8% oil fuel yet...?

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/20/2012 4:59 PM

GallopingGhostler

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi
quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler I did have one Fuji .09 CL, a twin exhaust slug piston in a steel liner one someone gave me that I had mounted on a Midwest 33'' span profile P-39 Air Cobra. It's been long since lost.
That would have been one of the early models-perhaps dating as early as the early 1950s-but that 'twin stack' model stayed in production a long long time-possibly 15 years-see Adrian Duncan's articles (reference my previous post) for the details.

Interesting bit of history I didn't know, thanks for sharing, Chris.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi Most of my Fuji's are very second hand and mainly the R/C versions-many of which are incomplete, some missing rods, pistons and screws The only NIB one I have is a recent ebay acquisition-an 099 S-II R/C

Just curious, is this an ABC one?

quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi Eventually I'll get around to making std venturis for them. The 099s are generally plastic-green or black, which I can duplicate in black Delrin. NVAs are not such a big problem as the current OS std 15-20 NVA is a good match.

Will be making extras? I might be willing to purchase one for my 099S-II, use in a CL such as Midwest 33" span P-40 or Ringmaster Jr.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi Mufflers are my biggest bugbear-originals are very scarce, and about half of my Fuji stock don't have them. I did discover by accident that the Thunder Tiger TT202 muffler (not a current Tt production) is a good fit for the Fuji 19-so if any one has a spare TT202 muffler they have no use for, get in touch (I have one, but need one more).......

That I wouldn't be able to help you on, as I don't have any. BTW, not owning any, but gather that the earlier TT's that resembled the baffle piston running in lapped steel liner OS Max's were decent engines.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 7:03 AM

ffkiwi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler

Interesting bit of history I didn't know, thanks for sharing, Chris.

(1) I'm awaiting the next instalments of the Fuji history

Just curious, is this an ABC one?

(2)......No standard steel P/L technology

Will be making extras? I might be willing to purchase one for my 099S-II, use in a CL such as Midwest 33'' span P-40 or Ringmaster Jr.

(3) Yes I can do a few extras-but it won't be till early next year

quote:

BTW, not owning any, but gather that the earlier TT's that resembled the baffle piston running in lapped steel liner OS Max's were decent engines.

(4) Yes I gather the TT202 goes back to the 90's or so-but still likely to be more available than an original Fuji one. I'm currently looking if I can adapt a bolt on K&B 40 muffler to fit the Fuji 29-looks as though it will work on the 29 (so should also work on the 35).

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 10:57 AM

GallopingGhostler

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi
quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler Interesting bit of history I didn't know, thanks for sharing, Chris.
(1) I'm awaiting the next instalments of the Fuji history

We'll have to see truth from what others (Mr Cox, combatpigg, anyone else) have to share.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi
quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler Just curious, is this an ABC one?
(2)......No standard steel P/L technology

Now this is interesting, the Fuji 099S-II then came in at least 2 versions, one with steel/iron piston in a steel liner and the other in ABC.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi
quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler Will be making extras? I might be willing to purchase one for my 099S-II, use in a CL such as Midwest 33'' span P-40 or Ringmaster Jr.
(3) Yes I can do a few extras-but it won't be till early next year

Time frame would not a problem.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ffkiwi
quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler BTW, not owning any, but gather that the earlier TT's that resembled the baffle piston running in lapped steel liner OS Max's were decent engines.
(4) Yes I gather the TT202 goes back to the 90's or so-but still likely to be more available than an original Fuji one. I'm currently looking if I can adapt a bolt on K&B 40 muffler to fit the Fuji 29-looks as though it will work on the 29 (so should also work on the 35).

Once in a blue moon I see the older Thunder Tigers on US E-Bay. Most of the ones are more recent Schneurles, very few are baffle piston. I've got an old McCoy .40 Series 21 Black Head CL, will fit that with either DuBro Muffle-Aire or Tatone Peace Pipe.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 3:18 PM

gcb

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When TT came out the engines were "iffy". I saw one baffle .15 that was part of an RC plane/engine combo that the engine broke first time the guy tried to start it. You could spin the prop but the piston did not go up and down. The shop owner was just going to return it so he had not torn it down to see what was broken.

TT greatly improved their quality in a short time. I have some TT's from .10 to .25 in the CL version and they all are excellent quality and run well.

George

Edit: Forgot to mention, all of mine are Schnuerle ABC's from about 15 years ago. Here is a pic of the CL .10, my other .10 is in a SIG Akromaster.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 4:29 PM

GallopingGhostler

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gcb When TT came out the engines were ''iffy''. I saw one baffle .15 that was part of an RC plane/engine combo that the engine broke first time the guy tried to start it. You could spin the prop but the piston did not go up and down. The shop owner was just going to return it so he had not torn it down to see what was broken.

Thanks for the input, George. That may account for why very few are seen on E-Bay.

quote:

ORIGINAL: gcb TT greatly improved their quality in a short time. I have some TT's from .10 to .25 in the CL version and they all are excellent quality and run well.

I remember reading in one of the model magazines some time back, may be 20 years ago that an OS engineer worked for TT, which resulted in solid quality.

quote:

ORIGINAL: gcb Edit: Forgot to mention, all of mine are Schnuerle ABC's from about 15 years ago. Here is a pic of the CL .10, my other .10 is in a SIG Akromaster.

I've got an older Magnum .15 R/C ABC Schneurle on a foam Cessna 150. I think that was made by TT. Don't have any complaints so far.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 7:01 PM

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I just happen to have a few of the TT engines too. The older ones are cross-scavenged and not very high on power per cc, but they are also lighter so per gram they are not all that bad. The picture below shows, from the left, a .25 and then a .15 next to the more modern .10 to the very right. The modern ones are schneurle ported and marked as ABC on the box, but are of coarse just like OS only "ABC-technology" and really ABN engines. The .10 are a little down on power compare to an OS10 FP, it may very well stem from the really tiny boost port that barely opens at all.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 7:48 PM

GallopingGhostler

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr Cox I just happen to have a few of the TT engines too. The older ones are cross-scavenged and not very high on power per cc, but they are also lighter so per gram they are not all that bad. The picture below shows, from the left, a .25 and then a .15 next to the more modern .10 to the very right.

Then I gather these baffle piston engines have moderate compression and probably can swing a larger prop without complaint, no?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr Cox The modern ones are schneurle ported and marked as ABC on the box, but are of coarse just like OS only ''ABC-technology'' and really ABN engines. The .10 are a little down on power compare to an OS10 FP, it may very well stem from the really tiny boost port that barely opens at all.

I gather that this seems typical for Thunder Tiger. For their plain bearing GP series engines, they produce decent power but are a little behind OS; however, still good solid running engines. I was a little disappointed to see Tower Hobbies discontinue the "Green" GP-18 engine. It would be a nice looking engine on a CL profile or exposed on an RC like a Stik model. After looking all over the net, it looks like TT has discontinued production of this engine, I gather the GP-15 produced the same or a little more power than it. I guess it just never caught on.

Hobby People and Hobby Lobby have discontinued much of their nitro engines; On the up to .21 ci (3.4 cc) sized engines, Tower and Hobby King have scaled back their line; NitroPlanes has them in continuous "Out of Stock" status. I gather the small engine market except for specialty engines for competition, CL and Cox's, is basically giving way to electric power.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 8:01 PM

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Not OS Green Power but TT 18 here..

http://www.selecthobbies.com/eginesdata.htm (Bottom of the page)

Not a screamer but a grunt. On certain props outperforms a PAW 19'

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/21/2012 9:27 PM

Mr Cox

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler

Then I gather these baffle piston engines have moderate compression and probably can swing a larger prop without complaint, no?

Yes, they are happy around 13-14000rpm. I've only lately got myself a tach, we used to tune everything by ear. It is funny how things change with time. Compared to our diesel engines, anything on glow where real screamers on tooth-pick props. When I first got a tach a few years ago I fired up an old Veco .19, twin BB and with a fancy Perry carb, that always had been a really strong runner on a 9x4 prop. It used to pull a 1.2kg Graupner Taxi around with authority. Turns out it made a whopping 12500rpm on that prop...

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/22/2012 6:57 AM

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Additional thought...on the CL versions TT uses a true "sprinkler" venturi compared to the spraybar going through center of the venturi.

George

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/22/2012 1:47 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr Cox When I first got a tach a few years ago I fired up an old Veco .19, twin BB and with a fancy Perry carb, that always had been a really strong runner on a 9x4 prop. It used to pull a 1.2kg Graupner Taxi around with authority. Turns out it made a whopping 12500rpm on that prop...

I thought that was a definition of a "torque" engine. It was able to swing a larger prop at a moderate RPM. The late Bill Winter was disappointed when when manufacturers were discontinuing the baffle piston engine technology for Schneurle. He was stating they could have continued selling the others, billing them as "torque" engines. He loved to fly the older, slower planes and these older technology engines could pull the planes with authority but also were economic on fuel.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/22/2012 3:03 PM

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Yes, by todays standards it is a torque engine. But when we where use to diesels and plain bearing engines, the ballraced Veco seemed like a sceamer.
It still makes for a very good engine in something like a J3 Cub.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/23/2012 6:01 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: combatpigg Has anyone tried the 8% oil fuel yet...?

I haven't. Seems oil content is too low, I guess the RC car guys make do. But they don't run those engines wide open throughout the track IMO. There is a lot of both high and low RPM's. They have to slow down around corners, watch the hill jumping. OTOH, an airplane engine often runs at peak RPM for an extended amount of time.

If I were born with a spoon in my mouth I might be willing to try by purchasing new "disposable" engines (the pauper's buy). I don't like rough housing my engines unnecessarily. I don't have that kind of cash flow to be buying engines constantly.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/23/2012 7:28 AM

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It's not the 1st time a, "cAR gUY" came around the airplane forums to spread the gospel about how too much oil "gunks them up".....

I had a car with a Picco .21 and never could find a place big enough and smooth enough to keep it floored for even 2 seconds. I sold the car just because of that.
Awesome engine built like it belonged in a tank. It was pretty obvious that it ran with almost no load. It smoked like a locomotive with the airplane fuel I fed it.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/23/2012 4:13 PM

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Just think, with a reduction gear, I bet that Picco could turn a good oversized prop to fly a normally .40 powered "slow flyer" airplane (biplane, triplane, slo-combat, etc.). Then that "smoke like a locomotive" would feel welcomed.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/23/2012 5:24 PM

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I always got the impression that the "car guys" figured the airplane crowd had no idea what they were doing and were married to ancient wisdom about oil content, and that switching to car fuel would be like suddenly realizing you've been mounting props backwards all your life, a"eureka!" moment. Mind you, these are the same knuckle-draggers that coined the abhorrent phrase "nitro" for glow engines. I guess if you see it in magazine ad copy it must be the gospel. Now, taking a car fuel and intelligently modifying the oil content to suit a different application is another matter.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/23/2012 5:46 PM

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Yes, plus there was a claim about a magic synthetic that made castor oil obsolete in their engines.

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RE: 1/2 A Fuel - 11/23/2012 9:39 PM

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Sounds like the emperor's new clothes.

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