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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/24/2012 3:59 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		The smallest I've ever gone was 105 sq inches with a TD .049 on bladder. It was a pusher / flying wing with wingtip fins. I don't remember what it weighed, but this was back in the GWS RX / HS55 / 90 mah nicad days...plus it was covered with red cellophane.
This is the plane that I carved a maple 4x4 prop and kept shaving the blades to see rpm gain. Finally it threw 1 blade in flight and it sounded like someone hit the nitrous switch. After it landed I discovered the missing blade and flew it like that the rest of the day until the other blade broke on a landing.


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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/24/2012 2:14 PM   
forsakenrider


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MJD

I couldn't resist, I ordered one. Winter project (or three winters at my typical pace) is a mini F3Speed type model, SWR I imagine.

I can't wait until the pipe version comes out.. what's next, 22'' span 1/2A RC speed models with 2x5 one blade props?



Lets see if you can go a little faster this time!! I want to see some bench run videos!! I`m glad you ordered one, I`m sure its going to be an awesome engine just like its brothers! Im askign santa for mine...

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/25/2012 2:31 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MJD

I couldn't resist, I ordered one. Winter project (or three winters at my typical pace) is a mini F3Speed type model, SWR I imagine.

I can't wait until the pipe version comes out.. what's next, 22'' span 1/2A RC speed models with 2x5 one blade props?


What was the burn? Are they offering turbo and nelson heads like the earlier CL motor? Are they compatible?

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/25/2012 4:17 AM   
MJD



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Ouch!

The head in the picture seems to have a Nelson style plug. Don't have all the details yet.. but the head details look identical to the .061. I'll hazard a guess it shares some components with the previous .049 but will ask.

Wonder what the tuned pipe version will go for..?

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/26/2012 3:12 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		MJD, do not forget that you could also visit the MACA forum to find plans for a up to date 1/2A combat plane design. On 42 foot lines these planes are within anyone's abilities to fly. With a low pitch prop...most definitely.
I built a C/L combat plane for the Fora .049 [95% the power of a Cyclon] and was mildly disappointed with it on 42 foot lines. It performed OK and had plenty of pull, but it was like flying a sport .40 on 60 foot lines.
"Old rules" 1/2A combat was on 35 foot lines.... a much smaller hemisphere. A Cyclon or Profi on 35 footers is totally bananas. It was what made me "retire" from 1/2A C/L...it was just stupid and it took years to get the rules changed.


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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/26/2012 3:32 AM   
MJD



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Status: offline 		I bought it for a dedicated RC speed design though. While I have the .061 with offset intake and angle exhaust, I liked the idea of a true 1/2A engine for this purpose. Just curious to see how fast an .049 can pull an RC model. To do so I should have a piped pure speed version, but this will do for now.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/27/2012 12:33 AM   
MJD



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Status: offline 		I started sketching out ideas - not that there are that many variations possible on the theme. Once the engine arrives I can draw it up accurately and refine the engine compartment, finalize fuselage width bla bla. There is some thought put to this but I haven't laboured over it so far. I started at 125 square inches, but based on the floaty glide of my .061 design at 125 squares I decided to go hair smaller and ended up scaling down to 108. 20% stab (might skim that down a bit), could go V tail elevator only but think I'll stick with this. Boy do micro servos look big when you have to surface mount them on the center of a small wing. No real effort to figure out the parting line for the cowl yet, just sketching, and I guessed at the pipe dims. If I go the whole 9 yards and make a fuselage plug, I'll design it for a pipe and deal with routing the exhaust for the open version. Figured I'd cut out the rear servo/Rx hatch and make mating tabs from thin ply.

The fuselage is actually supposed to be somewhat oval in cross section but I haven't drawn any end views yet.

Any feedback (other than berating me for my typical slow progress ) would be most welcome. BTW I know swept surfaces - i.e. the vertical fin - have no aerodynamic advantage but I like the looks and it won't hurt.

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Click to see the file in new window.Attachment.pdf


< Message edited by MJD -- 11/27/2012 2:54 AM >

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/27/2012 1:32 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		MJD....is it any trouble to post it as a jpeg..?


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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/27/2012 2:52 AM   
MJD



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Status: offline 		Nope, once I figured out how to save the file where I wanted it.

It's just a beginning.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/27/2012 3:55 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		That should do nicely...!
I would consider a little dihedral. I used some with the old P51 SWR.
What I didn't realize at the time was how much "down thrust" the high thrust line with an inverted engine / low wing combo would effect the launches. The plane will dive for the ground no matter how you try to release it. A .32 powered version acted exactly the same way.
You've got the right idea with keeping the thrust line close to the wing. It also might be good for a couple more MPHs..?
Another idea from the School of Hard Knocks would be to run a lanyard from a wing mount bolt to the engine. Some C/L cable with a slip knot could wrap around the cylinder. Just to confine the debris field a little bit....if that day ever comes.


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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/27/2012 2:13 PM   
MJD



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Status: offline 		I had figured on a little dihedral, that will show once I get to the front view and cross sections. I had considered a shoulder wing too, but haven't got around to sketching out that concept.

I like the lanyard diea, the bits and pieces can travel a longgg way when you smack into something at 150mph..



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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 5:26 AM   
DeviousDave


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MJD

$215.00

Ouch!

The head in the picture seems to have a Nelson style plug. Don't have all the details yet.. but the head details look identical to the .061. I'll hazard a guess it shares some components with the previous .049 but will ask.

Wonder what the tuned pipe version will go for..?



It would be nice to have one, but at that price I'm out. I spend pretty freely on my hobbies even when times are tight, but it ain't 2006-there are a lot of desirable engines to be had for that kind of money.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 7:25 AM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		Dave, it's been at least a year or two since I heard, but Foras were $150ish...but I'm not sure if that includes the spanner wrench that also has a glow socket on a swivel. You could easily make your own spanner for unscrewing the head and backplate.
If you plan on getting a lot of use out of these engines, then I think they're worth it. In the same time frame that I owned my Fora, [about 7 years]...the engine ended up costing me about $20 or so per year and it was still in great shape when I traded it away for an engine that was worth about $70. So it really worked out to more like $10 per year spread out over 7 years.
My 1st Cyclon was a different story...I lost that sucker in a shallow "swamp" only 100-200 feet from where I was standing. It sounded like the shaft seized up and it tore the firewall out while the plane was just cruising along. That happened in the 1st or 2nd year of ownership so that was a bitter pill to swallow.


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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 1:58 PM   
aspeed


 

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Status: online 		It is about the same price as an OS .55 or Saito around here.  I think the profi would be better to get the adrenaline going.  The only thing stopping me besides the price and wife, is our club rules require a muffler (piped?) and a means to cut off the motor.  I think that may be good for me anyway in case it gets ahead of me.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 2:56 PM   
MJD



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Status: offline 		I think the "problem" with the price, is that it is a 0.8cc /.049 ci engine, and we are conditioned to think that smaller displacement means less money. That might be true for "mass" produced Cox or Norvel engines - maybe mainstream engines is a better term - but the fact is that these are top level competition engines, and they require all the same manufacturing and machining steps as any other engine, and probably require more care in terms of fits and tolerances than engines several times their size.

To me, yeah it's a bit pricey, but I am getting a state of the art competition oriented engine that will give me all kinds of sts and giggles. I have engines worth more than this that won't get me anywhere near as excited. The Profi .061 is the most fun I've had with my pants on for a while.

Now if you want to fall out of your chair, get a quote for a state of the art F2A .15... egads.. I thought I wanted one really badly until I found out they were worth about two Moki 2.10's and a fancy dinner out for the wife and I. We're talking $600-$700 per. That's the price of keeping up with the Joneses in F2A though. So I satisfy my high rpm racing engine urges with 1/2A's and 1cc for now. I had a woody to build an RC speed model with a Profi F2A engine, can you imagine? If it can pull a C/L model at 208mph, with lines, it obviously has the ability to pull a clean RC model at higher speeds. Might be a cantankerous b and would take a fair bit of engine savvy to get everything dialed in right, but the F2A guys do it on a regular basis, so why not? Maybe I'll find "last year's model" F2A engine sometime for a relative bargain.


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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 3:40 PM   
MJD



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quote:

ORIGINAL: aspeed

It is about the same price as an OS .55 or Saito around here.  I think the profi would be better to get the adrenaline going.  The only thing stopping me besides the price and wife, is our club rules require a muffler (piped?) and a means to cut off the motor.  I think that may be good for me anyway in case it gets ahead of me.


Then you need the piped version when it comes out in January!

It should be easy to rig inflight cutoff, you'd need an additional micro servo and some trickery with a tee fitting in the fuel line and a dump port with releasable tubing pinch wire. The FF guys do this with flood offs and timers.

I've never heard an IC engine run at 45k except F2A videos on Youtube.. I feel the need to experience it live.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 6:25 PM   
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Status: offline 		well said on every account MJD, I feel the same way. I havent flown my profi 06, but just running it feels amazing. Its so easy to start and so smooth. it really is a joy!

Im holding out for the piped version of the 049 though. Unless I can find soem guys to fly control line proto speed with.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 6:37 PM   
MJD



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Status: offline 		The .049 is on the way now. I asked for pricing - if known yet - on the piped .049 but haven't heard back yet. Might have to sell a Moki to finance that..

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 8:37 PM   
aspeed


 

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Status: online 		OK lets go flying, Forsaken rider.  I have nowhere to fly here, near Windsor, Toronto is out, the park seems to be just for minority picnics now and isn't safe to fly.  Niagara Falls circle is out too.  You are what, about 12 hours from here :-)  Proto 1/2A isn't an event any more, and i am not sure, but 1/2A profile proto only allows a mini pipe.  It would have to be 1/2A speed.  I had the senior Canadian record in proto and speed with the same plane, way back, with the black plane in the picture if I can send it.  I was kind of thinking of an F2D combat motor on a profile proto kind of thing myself.  There is still nowhere to fly it that is paved, so I haven't made one yet.  I got the motor though.  I think the piped .049 will have to be another $50 more than the normal one.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 8:51 PM   
forsakenrider


 

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Status: offline 		yeah, for profile I have seen more guys in the west into it. seems to be a crew in BC and the states that get together and fly. There`s a few big parking lots around where I am and also a field with a hard packed dirt `runway`. If there were people near to fly proto speed I would order the non piped version. but I already have a DG tuned picco P-0 for that.

so, aspeed, cp, and I lets get some profile proto comp going on. set a video up with the pilot and a pole in the screen to count the laps vs. time. I believe its 10 laps?

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 8:53 PM   
forsakenrider


 

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Status: offline 		ps, that black plane is great! love the paint job!

But I thought for profile proto you couldnt have a cowled engine?

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 9:10 PM   
combatpigg



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Status: offline 		Love those photos aspeed..!
FSR, that sounds like a fun project..to build 1/2A protos and film them. I would probably need to take off from some sort of portable runway and then just take my chances with the landing on really short grass. I've got no idea how much speed/distance they need to break ground...?


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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 9:31 PM   
aspeed


 

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Status: online 		They take off in about 5 feet if they are light. Landings would likely break them. I have been thinking of a B speed plane made like a proto with big wheels for the grass, but am afraid of tipping over on landings and breaking the pipe and stuff. There are lots of dune buggy .28 motors around cheap, used, to convert. A Novarossi is on my shopping list but I can't sneak it into the house.           The black one is from about 1975 before the proto rules changed to profile proto. They were about 80 mph then  I would imagine the Profi and Fora would do over 100? Most of the guys now with the profile proto's are in the mid 80 mph range. Some are better, the speed planes are way better, maybe 140 with a pipe.  The rules are different than before.  I think it is 10% nitro and who knows what else.  I think the lines are still .010" x 42'  for the profile proto.

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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/28/2012 9:49 PM   
ffkiwi


 

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I would probably need to take off from some sort of portable runway and then just take my chances with the landing on really short grass. I've got no idea how much speed/distance they need to break ground...?



CP I have similar issues when it comes to flying FF Payload (now a dying class in NZ-generally only flown at the Nats-and even then only if they can get enough entries!) the need for a smooth takeoff area-I solved this by making a portable runway out of Coreflute 'fluteboard' that was about 20-ft long and folded up 'zig-zag' style to fit comfortably in the car along with all the gear. I just used brown packaging tape to attach each piece to the next one, putting the tape on alternate sides to allow for the zig zag fold.
Obviously for C/L use you would need to bevel the ends of adjacent sheets to create a curvature appropriate to your line length radius. I used 'weedmat' pegs to hold the thing down-these are like plastic tent pegs with about a 1/4" shank and a broad flat thin head (like a giant plastic flathead nail)-their normal use is for holding down weedmat in your low maintenance flower or shrub garden-the sort with bark or chips instead of bare soil. [I've also used cheap plastic tarpaulins such as you would get at Walmart and held then down the same way-these are OK if the underlying grass surface is fairly short-but not as smooth as the Coreflute approach-they did have the advantage-from my perspective-of not needing to be relocated if the wind direction changed-in that case the weedmat pegs went through the brass eyelet holes]
Even in a heavy Payload model, the takeoff run was only 5-10 feet.

ChrisM
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RE: PROFI RAMBLER .049 - 11/29/2012 12:36 AM   
vertical grimmace



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They fly with .012'' x 42 foot lines IIRC. That's a lot of steel to be hauling around. Notice the size of the tiny little tank.......bunch of ''sissies''..!!
I say strap on a 2 oz tank and then hang on for a couple minutes.

The small tank forces pit stops. Where it is won or lost. Gotta have a good engine/pit guy to win.

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