CAI Razor

CAI Razor (Full Version)

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mreinhart -> CAI Razor (12/12/2012 1:10 PM)
Picked up a new jet today, (new to me) it is a CAI Razor... Couldn't pass it up, paid 250 bucks for it with EVERYTHING except engine and reciever. has all the gear, tanks, brakes, exhaust etc.. has a few bumps and bruises (looks like hangar rash to me) .. Anyone know anything about this plane? I haven't found a lot online about it, but I couldn't pass it up for the price!

TCHIEF -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 2:00 PM)
DAMN why cant deals like this show up in my area

kevinthoele -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 2:13 PM)
They are a great airplane. Is it the full composite or built up wings and tail? Or composite wing and built up tail or does it have the bolt on elevator? Anyway I had one and flew for almost 10 years. I used 40 degrees flap for take off and 80 degrees for landing and YES USE 80 DEGREES FOR LANDING. This was an airplane that everyone wanted to find their way of set up and Scotty had it right all along. CG was a little nose heavy. I had mine on the front gear cover (edge facing the leading edge) that tapes to bottom of wing. Flew mine on AMT Mercury Jetcat P80 and P120. Watch the fuel tank size as it is a little low. I added another thin tank on top of the bypass and went into the canopy area for more time in the air. Good luck you will love the airplane. One more thing is I added plywood gear mount plates instead of the molded ones that I thought were too fragile.

rcjetsaok -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 2:29 PM)
Built loke a Tank, go's like hell !!!! Danno

mreinhart -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 3:35 PM)
it is the full composite one, with bolt on tail surfaces. I'm thinking a Kingtech K-80, you think that is enough oomph to fly this pretty well?

mreinhart -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 3:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kevinthoele They are a great airplane. Is it the full composite or built up wings and tail? Or composite wing and built up tail or does it have the bolt on elevator? Anyway I had one and flew for almost 10 years. I used 40 degrees flap for take off and 80 degrees for landing and YES USE 80 DEGREES FOR LANDING. This was an airplane that everyone wanted to find their way of set up and Scotty had it right all along. CG was a little nose heavy. I had mine on the front gear cover (edge facing the leading edge) that tapes to bottom of wing. Flew mine on AMT Mercury Jetcat P80 and P120. Watch the fuel tank size as it is a little low. I added another thin tank on top of the bypass and went into the canopy area for more time in the air. Good luck you will love the airplane. One more thing is I added plywood gear mount plates instead of the molded ones that I thought were too fragile. Youd ont happen to have the original documentation for it do you?

SkyKnight -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 7:27 PM)
I had one that I really liked. My problem was low fuel capacity. Flew very well and fast with a 20# thrust engine. No bad habits. I sold it to a guy who lived in Gay Georgia but I don't remember his name. If you could locate him, I gave him full documentation on the plane. Dan Gill of Details 4 Scale provided me with prints which were key in setting up the plane. You should loads of fun with it!!

SkyKnight -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 7:42 PM)
I just checked my ratings for the buyer of my Razor. His name was Glen Radford. RCU name: glennradford Maybe and hopefully he can help ya out with documentation on the plane. Hope that helps!

mreinhart -> RE: CAI Razor (12/12/2012 8:14 PM)
thanks! I just sent him a PM... When you said Dan Gill sent you "prints" could you elaborate? What "prints" did he have? maybe he migh still have them.... anyway thanks for the info!

SkyKnight -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 11:48 AM)
Yes. He actually sent me 2 or 3 sheets of blue prints or you might call them sketches. I don't remember how many sheets or to what scale they were drawn to. If i remember correctly, he had a hand in the design of the plane. Give him a call. He is a wealth of information!

wojtek -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 1:37 PM)
Lewis Patton will also know quite a bit about these. Great flying planes. I'm still flying the CAI Raptor which is the next size up from the Razor. Some of the best sport jets ever built. and they are FAST !! [8D] They do have to be set up properly with CG to fly properly. and when they are, its a missile on rails. Landings are solid and predictable, however you will have to get as much flap in as possible to slow down and a slight hint of crow for stability. ~V~

kevinthoele -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 2:02 PM)
I will have to check my archives for manual and see if I kept it. The K80 will work fine. Fly short first flight and check fuel consumption. That latest generation razor was the best. Wish I still had one.

Jeff Foley -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 3:31 PM)
Wonder what happened to the tooling for these airplanes and the Panther. I heard it was for sale at one time (for a hefty price).

kevinthoele -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 3:37 PM)
The guys at US Microjet got them. Don't know what the plans are for them now.

invertmast -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 4:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kevinthoele The guys at US Microjet got them. Don't know what the plans are for them now. I'd love to get my hands on those things! I understand they were a little porky when they were available, with the composites technology now, they could probably get less porky and be even better!

LGM Graphix -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 4:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: invertmast quote: ORIGINAL: kevinthoele The guys at US Microjet got them. Don't know what the plans are for them now. I'd love to get my hands on those things! I understand they were a little porky when they were available, with the composites technology now, they could probably get less porky and be even better! They might be a little porky by today's standards, but they were just about right for the type of jet they are. Many of today's airplanes are too light. They float, they bounce around etc. My cai raptor is easily the best flying and landing jet I have ever had. Landings are mindless, lock it in and let it settle. My firebird is very much the same way. All the other jets I've had will bounce around, float more than you want, balloon etc. Lighter is not always better. Big difference between solid, and to heavy. CAI is also the only company I have seen that used the honeycomb layup correctly and cleanly. My Raptor will stay with me until all the air under her wings is used up. I also had a razor, not quite as nice as the raptor, but still a very nice airplane. I never used the amount of flap being recommended here, nor did I ever use any crow in the razor or raptor. They are easy to slow down just by keeping the nose up on final. Because they have some weight to them, it's easy to control speed with attitude and control altitude with power.

USMicroJet -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 5:58 PM)
At one time years ago, the owner of USMicroJet also owned the CAI "leftovers". As far as I know that man still owns the CAI stuff but has nothing to do with USMJ for the last 3-4 years. He didnt even say goodbye to me when he left. So I have no idea where he is or the condition of the CAI stuff. Where did you find the jet Mr Einhart ?

wojtek -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 7:06 PM)
quote: . They are easy to slow down just by keeping the nose up on final. Because they have some weight to them, it's easy to control speed with attitude and control altitude with power. this does not apply in all cases. I guess it depends on how much power is in it, and what the pilots flying preference is. I have my Raptor powered by a Simjet Nexus, which puts out roughly 3lbs of residual thrust at idle. I make my turn to final with gear dropped, and 1/2 flap ( around 30 deg ) . My speed at this point is just above what would cause this plane to snap out of the turn. On final, i end up having to go full flap ( 80deg ), 3/16" crow, and chop the power. At this point the plane is fairly far out, and when it breaks the runway threshold, i barely feather in power as i hold off elevator more and more to keep the nose up. It lands as slow as a Boomerang when it touches down ( big speed difference from top speed ! lol ) .. without 80deg flap and crow, the plane would glide another 300 feet. Yea, i could settle it down at a faster speed, but it just looks so good getting slow and nose up [8D] its pretty much the same deal with the Razor. They don't bleed speed off well at all .Both these planes were designed to go WELL over 200 back in the day .. this is structurally and aerodynamically. Like Jerremy said, sports planed today are designed to "float" and fly well slowly. Unfortunately this is because of the 200mph restrictions in the US which have in my opinion stifled advancements and development on or side of the hobby [8\|] hey Skyking !! I think still have a video somewhere of you flying that Razor . I will have to go through my old DV tapes ~V~

SkyKnight -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 8:30 PM)
I got thtat plane from you ~V~ remember? Dan Gill and i went over that plane from soup to nuts. It was loads of fun flying it. I liked the look, no problem taking off or landing. I just got tired of running out of fuel. mreinhart , pay close attention to your fuel comsumption as someone else pointed out earlier. In the event of fuel starvation, not too much to worry about cuz it has an excellent glide ratio too. I used 15 degrees takeoff flap and 30 degrees full flap, no crow for landings. Present the wing and you can put it wherever you want it. It is that predictable, As a matter of fact, my flap linkage didn't allow any further flap deployment than that. I was tucked up big time in the beginning flying it until I got used to it and learned to trust it. Plus I had a good wingman, Maaco.

mreinhart -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 8:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: USMicroJet At one time years ago, the owner of USMicroJet also owned the CAI ''leftovers''. As far as I know that man still owns the CAI stuff but has nothing to do with USMJ for the last 3-4 years. He didnt even say goodbye to me when he left. So I have no idea where he is or the condition of the CAI stuff. Where did you find the jet Mr Einhart ? I picked it up at a lhs. Someone came in with it and a few other planes to sell..a guy who goes there knew I was in to jets, and called me..I almost didn't call on it, figured at least a grand or more with all equipment except engine', and with Xmas that wasn't in my budget... when they said 250 bucks, I told them I would be there in 15 minutes lol...

mreinhart -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 8:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kevinthoele I will have to check my archives for manual and see if I kept it. The K80 will work fine. Fly short first flight and check fuel consumption. That latest generation razor was the best. Wish I still had one. Awesome, let me know if you find anything!

invertmast -> RE: CAI Razor (12/13/2012 10:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mreinhart quote: ORIGINAL: USMicroJet At one time years ago, the owner of USMicroJet also owned the CAI ''leftovers''. As far as I know that man still owns the CAI stuff but has nothing to do with USMJ for the last 3-4 years. He didnt even say goodbye to me when he left. So I have no idea where he is or the condition of the CAI stuff. Where did you find the jet Mr Einhart ? I picked it up at a lhs. Someone came in with it and a few other planes to sell..a guy who goes there knew I was in to jets, and called me..I almost didn't call on it, figured at least a grand or more with all equipment except engine', and with Xmas that wasn't in my budget... when they said 250 bucks, I told them I would be there in 15 minutes lol... Wanna double your money :). Lol

mreinhart -> RE: CAI Razor (12/14/2012 12:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: invertmast quote: ORIGINAL: mreinhart quote: ORIGINAL: USMicroJet At one time years ago, the owner of USMicroJet also owned the CAI ''leftovers''. As far as I know that man still owns the CAI stuff but has nothing to do with USMJ for the last 3-4 years. He didnt even say goodbye to me when he left. So I have no idea where he is or the condition of the CAI stuff. Where did you find the jet Mr Einhart ? I picked it up at a lhs. Someone came in with it and a few other planes to sell..a guy who goes there knew I was in to jets, and called me..I almost didn't call on it, figured at least a grand or more with all equipment except engine', and with Xmas that wasn't in my budget... when they said 250 bucks, I told them I would be there in 15 minutes lol... Wanna double your money :). Lol hehe there is one thing I would get rid of it for, a ready to fly"trainer" Turbine, since this is to be my first Turbine jet, been doing EDF (composite, NOT foamy) for about 4 years now..RC for 30+...if i cant get RTF Turbine, then ill pick up a K-80 for this after the holidays :) (I hve no idea if that i even a fair deal for the other party though, as I have no idea the true value of this plane)

LGM Graphix -> RE: CAI Razor (12/14/2012 12:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mreinhart quote: ORIGINAL: invertmast quote: ORIGINAL: mreinhart quote: ORIGINAL: USMicroJet At one time years ago, the owner of USMicroJet also owned the CAI ''leftovers''. As far as I know that man still owns the CAI stuff but has nothing to do with USMJ for the last 3-4 years. He didnt even say goodbye to me when he left. So I have no idea where he is or the condition of the CAI stuff. Where did you find the jet Mr Einhart ? I picked it up at a lhs. Someone came in with it and a few other planes to sell..a guy who goes there knew I was in to jets, and called me..I almost didn't call on it, figured at least a grand or more with all equipment except engine', and with Xmas that wasn't in my budget... when they said 250 bucks, I told them I would be there in 15 minutes lol... Wanna double your money :). Lol hehe there is one thing I would get rid of it for, a ready to fly''trainer'' Turbine, since this is to be my first Turbine jet, been doing EDF (composite, NOT foamy) for about 4 years now..RC for 30+...if i cant get RTF Turbine, then ill pick up a K-80 for this after the holidays :) (I hve no idea if that i even a fair deal for the other party though, as I have no idea the true value of this plane) When I sold my Razor I sold it for $2200 turnkey. That was complete with an AMT Mercury, scuba tank, all the crap needed to make it go. The guy that bought it had never flown a turbine before either. He eventually lost the jet on final when he lost orientation (he just got to far out). If you are used to flying fast models with a higher wing loading you should be fine with the Razor. There was a time that Razors, Raptors, Bandits, etc were considered the "Trainer" jets. When it comes to landing I actually think those jets are easier to deal with than some of todays new floaty airplanes. My old Reaction 54 and my BVM Kingcat were 2 of the hardest jets to land I ever had. They just wanted to keep floating and flying forever!

mreinhart -> RE: CAI Razor (12/14/2012 12:50 AM)
yea, been mainly flying 80mm (Eflite) and up EDFs,, have habu32 on 8s, Eflite F-4 on 8s, 90mm T-45, 70mm F-104, twin 70mm A-10, and a yellow F-16, all EDF.. im ready to burn kerosene instead of electrons now though!

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