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Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/21/2012 4:43 AM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		Have some interest in this jet just looking for info


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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/21/2012 3:35 PM   
David Jackson


 

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Status: offline 		Hey Fenderbean,

Check with Rex Briant (rbxbear44) in Georgia, I know he has built one and possibly two of these big 18s.

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/21/2012 5:53 PM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		Okay maybe he will chime in, i was hoping there was a thread with pics and stuff like that.


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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/21/2012 6:07 PM   
dubd



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Status: online 		I found these threads:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9514302/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9350675/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/22/2012 4:20 AM   
jetspud



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Status: offline 		I have had the same thought about the F-18F.. Hell we have the same jets I have the 1\6 F-16 about a weeks work and it will be done 1\7 F-15E next to be started and I was eye balling that 1\6 F\18F No F-14 though

David

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/22/2012 4:27 AM   
FenderBean



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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 4:20 AM   
rbxbear44


 

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I finished one right before KY Jets in July. Lot's of changes since those older threads were done. Will be glad to share any data and thoughts with you.

In the newer material FEJ is using and vacuum bagging, the airframe is lighter and rock solid for sure. The goal needs to be to go as light as possible on these...keep the bling down to lights and smoke at the most. Also, HIGHLY recommend the Down and Lock conversion/sequencer setup for these large gear parts.

I have a ton of build pics too.

I installed twin EvoJet VX-160's. HIGHLY recommend going twin on this bird...Jet Central Cheetah's would be the best idea.

IMO, no leading edge slats are necessary which would cut out 2 servo's and some other mechanical/electrical weight too.

Great flying plane!

Rex

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 5:21 AM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		Thanks, yeah I would get the twin version just like my f-14/f-15 and I already use the down and locked so know worries there. Like all my jets I plan to run ordinance and I always try and build as light as possible. I plan on using twin k180s on all three of my twins by two at first and then just buy the install kits for the other two and swap as needed till I can get more. Is the weight a performance thing or just trying to keep it the AMA limit? Thanks for posting, missed you at KY jets this time
quote:

ORIGINAL: rbxbear44
FB,
I finished one right before KY Jets in July. Lot's of changes since those older threads were done. Will be glad to share any data and thoughts with you.

In the newer material FEJ is using and vacuum bagging, the airframe is lighter and rock solid for sure. The goal needs to be to go as light as possible on these...keep the bling down to lights and smoke at the most. Also, HIGHLY recommend the Down and Lock conversion/sequencer setup for these large gear parts.

I have a ton of build pics too.

I installed twin EvoJet VX-160's. HIGHLY recommend going twin on this bird...Jet Central Cheetah's would be the best idea.

IMO, no leading edge slats are necessary which would cut out 2 servo's and some other mechanical/electrical weight too.

Great flying plane!

Rex




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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 1:35 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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With the 160s, after takeoff...it was half throttle the whole time! But they sure did come in handy for landing! The F-18, with it's "flying fuse", you need to find the sweet spot for AOA and Power Curve on approach. Most people think full flaps is the key but on this bird it is NOT! 15-20 degrees of flaps, nose level to ground effect and then flare at 1/4 throttle nets a really nice landing!

Twins keep you from some bad stuff if you loose a engine at climb out.

The only real issue was the long trailing door on the nose gear needs to have a better spring slide than what the factory gives you. With the blow back, the DNL Nose gear sensed the load and would not retract the first time. That's a good thing though and grateful it didn't cause an issue on gear down with a door in the way.

Yes, AMA limits will need to be factored in for sure. The 18 I built for a friend had 7 lbs. of working scale cockpits...lights and all! With slats, the cockpits and the 9 batteries it took to run all the systems...it was a 70lb plane! Stay as close as you can to box weight plus basic systems and you will have a winner. The one I built is wonderful and an absolute crowd pleasure too but lighter would be awesome!

Rex



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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 5:10 PM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		Cool deal thanks for all the info. The great thing about dnl gear is if they amp out on the up they still work on the down. Im doing sbus on all my future builds so that saves weight and i use the smaller packs. I may only get four flights but thats what i shoot for.
Thanks for the info


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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 5:32 PM   
dubd



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Status: online 		Rex, any video of the F-18 that you built? Will the gear work without having them modified to DNL? I assume you're recommending the Cheetah's because they are light. Did you have to add a lot of lead to the nose with the 160vx engines?

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 5:34 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Let me know if and when you need pics of any of the build. The Factory CG was 15-20mm tail heavy of where it should be...with 240oz. of the fuel cells forward (2 of the 4) of CG...the more you burn the more the weight goes to the tail!!! Don't know if they adjusted that yet but if/when you get the bird, I'll talk with them and see if they made the adjustment on their sheets and confirm CG mark with you.

After 8 min. of flight, the plane had both saddles empty (installed right at CG point) and 2/3 of top forward tank gone(Forward tanks hold 138oz top tank and 108oz bottom tank). You could really eliminate the 108oz forward tank. That would still give you 2 saddles over CG at 58oz each...116oz and the 138oz tank forward and you still have plenty of burn for a good flight with 254oz!!! (1.9Gal and 13.5lbs of on board fuel). That config would get rid of almost 6 lbs. of takeoff weight...forward weight!!!

With slats, this bird had 17 servos with flying surfaces and air systems for doors, canopy, brakes and speed brakes, plus turbine channel!!! I used a PowerBox Royal 12 Channel Spektrum version..and still had to matchbox the Slats to get all switches configured to "normal setup" on a 12x! Getting rid of slats, two Blue Box cockpits and lights we used from D4S, working canopy would probably shave off another 8-9lbs!!!

Just giving you some ideas on how to get this bird to a easier weight to mess with as you think through things.

Rex

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 5:55 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: dubd

Rex, any video of the F-18 that you built? Will the gear work without having them modified to DNL? I assume you're recommending the Cheetah's because they are light. Did you have to add a lot of lead to the nose with the 160vx engines?


Nose Weight:
With 9 batteries to run the flight system and then all the bling...I had a bunch of ballast forward, stuffing batteries in the Strake interior shells that run along the sides of the cockpit area. With the CG needing more Nose weight, most of the batteries had to go to the nose to compensate....since we were dealing with a airframe 70 lbs. wet!!! Battery access at that point became through the Nose Gear Door openings to keep from having to remove chunks of the forward cockpit to get to batteries! Going with P-120's, 140's or K-170's...you are fine too. The only thing to remember is the AMA 1:1 rule on thrust to weight. You could get this bird to 56-60 lbs wet and have a whole new ballgame as far as flying time, fun and power.

Video:
Check some of the footage from the Jets Over KY 2012 segments, I think they got the maiden on video. Pablo Fernandez did the maiden for us. Yes, the Cheetah's because of power and weight for sure! The EvoJet turbines...I love them too. It would just be a great way to reduce some weight, keep the power on board and actually have a less crowded install on side by side rails.

Factory Gear:
I could not get the stock factory gear to operate freely and strong ALL THE TIME. Any air loss and we would have been in trouble. I had plenty of volume with 2 LARGE and one Medium Robart Air tanks just on the gear and doors!!! I know FEJ has been working on this gear though. A more scale ad wider stance plus stronger function. With my discussions and time with James, James' brother from the FEJ Factory and Lowell Wexler at KY on this bird, I was told they are moving all the larger gears to electric at some point. This is just a HUGE gear set and with the loooooong forward sweep of the Nose Gear, the air just didn't seem to be bullet proof enough for me to feel good about it.



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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/23/2012 7:00 PM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		Im having to be weight restrictive since im going to run ordinance. I was thinking i might have to drop down in turbine size, but with kingtech the 140/170/180 are the same diameter and with the new design they seem to be close in weight. The gear conversion saves weight and the best part the dnl only use like 80 mah per cycle which is why i use a small 2cell lipo. I think mines only 1100 mah to save weight plus the air to electric swap saved weight and the use of button valves. I was thinking i wouldn't use all the fuel tanks as well.


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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 2:01 AM   
dubd



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Status: online 		Fender, I had the same dilemma with my Skymaster A-10. It was either Cheetahs/Merlin 140s or Jetcat P-140s. In the end, the Jetcats were out of stock and I had a K-180 sitting around, so I bought a second K-180 to use in the A-10. Hopefully the additional weight won't require much more lead than the other A-10s that are flying.

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 2:19 AM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		for the power u gain and there isnt much weight difference hopefully it works out, the full burn I hope will be less with the larger turbine since I want need to run as high throttle setting but I think this model with full ordinance will benefit from the power
quote:

ORIGINAL: dubd

Fender, I had the same dilemma with my Skymaster A-10. It was either Cheetahs/Merlin 140s or Jetcat P-140s. In the end, the Jetcats were out of stock and I had a K-180 sitting around, so I bought a second K-180 to use in the A-10. Hopefully the additional weight won't require much more lead than the other A-10s that are flying.




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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 3:24 AM   
rbxbear44


 

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You will need to really beef up the Ordnance rails for those stores. They put a ton of stress on the wing structure too. I dumped a whole right wing of missiles, rails and some chunks of wing skin on a mid field break a few years ago. Got it back...limping but it made it! The Stores are HUUGE and only skin with no structure. The same with the rails. Probably a good 1" dowel skin to skin on the inside of the Stores and likewise for the rails with a 3/4" dowel skin to skin. I set this last one up for static display only on the Stores and did go ahead and mount the missiles and rails for flight.

Rex

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 4:03 AM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		Yeah I am going to do that on my f-15 and this one, joining the bottom to the top with with a dowel or block. I will probably get Dan to make me a set of ordinance since the fly eagles are still a little heavy. Been on FEJ about the ordinance so I hope some day they listen and make better ones.
Like you said they only put some ply on the bottom of the wing for the screw to bite on, this is fine for static but will rip out on high Gs like you said.
my email is fenderbean1979@yahoo.com when you get some time send me some pics if you can
Oh I ment to ask have u built this model in the honeycomb is so how much weight did it save over the old style?


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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 1:58 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		I have had both the Gen 1 and the newer Honeycomb....BIIIIIG difference...almost 20 lbs! The wings are still heavy with the Flap system they use...which is good since it is a very large flying surface. They now use the CF Fowler type hinge which is extremely strong design, taking the hinge line from the trailing edge to a cantilever design...very nice. with this design, one 8711 will do well, cutting down the old two servo setup. It's a bit tricky to get the geometry right on the setup but I can take you through that.

I'll send some pics directly to your email.

Merry Christmas! Thanks for serving and fighting for our Nation FB!

Rex

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 2:05 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		Here are some Flap setup pics:




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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 4:27 PM   
FenderBean



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Status: offline 		that is a perk for sure, being able to use one servo per flap, I am trying to come up with a way to use linear actuators on my f-14 to prevent 5 servos per wing as it sits if I use servos I will require 24 channels to operated everything lol

Merry X-mas to you as well and Thanks for the comment its my job. I will fly an American flag for you when I deploy to Afghanistan and send it to you.


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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 4:47 PM   
dubd



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Status: online 		Rex, thanks for the thorough explanation. This plane sounds like a bigger PITA than I am willing to deal with. The 1/7 F-18 might be better suited for what I'm looking for, which is essentially a Sunday flyer.

Merry Christmas!

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 6:31 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		Dub,
Glad to help. The 1/7th is a great airframe too. I have built two of those...really great flyer. I had the Gen 1's so in the lighter materials...these will rock!

Merry Christmas to you too!

Rex

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/24/2012 9:21 PM   
DiscoWings



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dual 170G kingtechs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHyuIbM5wD8&feature=youtu.be

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RE: Any builds on the FEJ 1/6 F-18 twin? - 12/25/2012 2:36 AM   
rbxbear44


 

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What an honor...thank you! This home and family deeply loves our warriors.

Rex

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