Ringed 2 Stroke Break In    Gallery
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as Guest



Users viewing this topic: none
    Search This Thread  
 
Printable Version


TurboHeader Muffler
Seller:  RC Specialties
Details:   $69.95   |  4/28/2013   |  Classified Ad
We will rotate YOUR AD in this spot if you select "Forum Featured" when placing or editing your ad!

All Forums >> Glow Engines, Gas Engines, Fuel & Mfg Support Forums >> Glow Engines >> Ringed 2 Stroke Break In
Page: [1] 2   next >   >>  

Tower Hobbies Get Coupon Codes Brands  
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/5/2013 4:14 PM   
glowfuel


 

Posts: 171
Score: 100
Joined: 12/28/2002
Last Login: 2/10/2013
From: Moscow, PA, USA
Status: offline 		Ringed 2 Stroke Break-in



What is the best way to break-in an O.S. 95 AX ringed engine? There seems to be a lot of new information out there.

Also, what would be the best fuel brand to use in this particular engine? % of nitro??

Was looking at some of the synthetic fuels, but don't know if they will work, as well as, castor based fuels.

Thanks in advance,

glowfuel

_____________________________

Glowfuel

Hide Signatures
       Post #: 1

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/5/2013 5:11 PM   
jester_s1


 

Posts: 3802
Score: 233
Joined: 12/17/2006
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Fort Worth, TX, USA
Status: offline 		It'll run whatever commercially made fuel you want to use in it between 0-20% nitro. 10% works well for most applications. Buy the cheaper 0% or 5% nitro fuel for break ins since you aren't going to be worried about horsepower or getting a good idle during that first gallon.

Your owners manual tells you how to break the engine in, and there's not much more to it than that. Do let it cool all the way between the initial runs to avoid glazing the cylinder and don't get in a hurry to lean the mix. I'll suggest not using any synthetic oil in your break in runs because its improved lubricity will actually delay seating the ring. You can fly the plane when it will hold a steady rpm at 1k rpm rich and idle reliably at a low enough speed that you are able to land the plane.

_____________________________

For me, an ARF is an airplane that someone else just crashed.

Hide Signatures

(in reply to glowfuel)
       Post #: 2

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/5/2013 6:24 PM   
jeffie8696



Posts: 4428
Score: 120
Joined: 5/10/2007
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Muscatine, IA, USA
Status: offline 		I am sure as with all ringed break in procedures you want to run the engine sloppy rich on the high speed needle, no need to worry about a tapered cylinder.


_____________________________

Club Saito # 677 , Team Boca Bearings and Star Collectibles Muscatine

Hide Signatures

(in reply to jester_s1)
       Post #: 3

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/6/2013 2:20 AM   
downunder



Posts: 4364
Score: 123
Joined: 10/10/2002
Last Login: 5/20/2013
From: Adelaide, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		The break in procedures given in the 95AX manual are reasonable if you're in a hurry but personally I'd extend them a bit. Most ringed engines will take about 2 hours before they're run in enough for brisk flying but are flyable after maybe 30 minutes if kept rich. By rich I mean just into a clean 2 stroke. Personally I run them in on a test stand for at least an hour using 25% all castor fuel starting with the first tank as rich as it can stay running without glow power then slowly leaning out until at the end of an hour it's just beginning to break into a 2 stroke. Strangely, this is where the ring carries the heaviest loads because the 4 stroking firing cycle has much higher pressure than when 2 stroking!

Hide Signatures

(in reply to jeffie8696)
       Post #: 4

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/14/2013 8:36 PM   
JeffH


 

Posts: 1883
Score: 114
Joined: 1/17/2002
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Carrollton, VA, USA
Status: offline 		I would hook it to a gallon jug of 10% and let it run right at the 2-4 stroke break. About every 2-3 minutes lean it to a full two stroke for about 30 seconds, then richen back to the 2-4 break. After 30 min, shut it down, let it cool and do it again until the gallon is gone.

Hide Signatures

(in reply to downunder)
       Post #: 5

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/14/2013 8:42 PM   
BarracudaHockey



Posts: 18371
Score: 280
Joined: 7/13/2003
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Jacksonville, FL, USA
Status: online 		Sounds like a waste of perfectly good fuel to me personally.

Fly it slightly rich.

_____________________________

Andy - Helicopter Forum Moderator
AMA 77227 Leader Member- Contest Director
www.JaxRC.com

Hide Signatures

(in reply to JeffH)
       Post #: 6

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 12:58 AM   
jeffie8696



Posts: 4428
Score: 120
Joined: 5/10/2007
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Muscatine, IA, USA
Status: offline 		It might make for a good break in if a bit expensive. If I can get an engine to idle and transition properly after a couple of tanks at the proper break in setting I like to fly it conservatively for the first gallon, more conservative at the beginning of the gallon till I get the feel for it.
After that they have all seemed to transform and run really well, I am always astounded at how different they run after the first gallon.


_____________________________

Club Saito # 677 , Team Boca Bearings and Star Collectibles Muscatine

Hide Signatures

(in reply to BarracudaHockey)
       Post #: 7

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 3:46 AM   
1QwkSport2.5r



Posts: 3741
Score: 155
Joined: 10/15/2006
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Cottage Grove, MN, USA
Status: online 		I probably go overboard, but I spend a lot of time and burn some fuel to get an engine broke in relatively slowly. I mix my own glow fuel pretty cheaply, so I don't care if I burn a gallon on the bench. I still keep the carb a bit rich after the bench runs, but I am more trusting of the engine with some time on it versus just 2-4 tanks of fuel. That's just me though.

Some of my engines I would never even think of flying until they had 2-3 gallons of fuel through them. My SuperTigre S90K was a good example - it throttled pretty poorly and quit on a regular basis until it got a couple gallons on it. I have been running it on one of my airboats and I found myself having to retrieve the boat on numerous occasions because it would randomly quit. It runs like a Swiss watch now.



_____________________________

*Real* glow fuel is made with Methanol, Nitromethane, and Castor oil.

Hide Signatures

(in reply to jeffie8696)
       Post #: 8

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 4:53 AM  1 votes
blw



Posts: 7635
Score: 655
Joined: 3/15/2004
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Opelika, AL, USA
Status: offline 		It's all about enjoyment.

_____________________________

The ultimate responsibility of pilots is to fulfill the dreams of the countless millions who can only stare skyward...and wish.

"It doesn''t take but one Auburn man to be a majority" -
Coach Pat Dye

Hide Signatures

(in reply to 1QwkSport2.5r)
       Post #: 9

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 3:21 PM   
jeffie8696



Posts: 4428
Score: 120
Joined: 5/10/2007
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Muscatine, IA, USA
Status: offline 		I have to agree, if it wouldnt respond properly I would never fly it until it did.


_____________________________

Club Saito # 677 , Team Boca Bearings and Star Collectibles Muscatine

Hide Signatures

(in reply to blw)
       Post #: 10

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 7:47 PM   
Sport_Pilot



Posts: 12484
Score: 233
Joined: 1/22/2002
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Acworth, GA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

avoid glazing the cylinder


Never heard of anyone doing that with a glow engine, other than racers using very high nitro fuel.

_____________________________

“I Saw Elvis at 1000 Feet” John Force

Hide Signatures

(in reply to jester_s1)
       Post #: 11

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 7:49 PM   
Sport_Pilot



Posts: 12484
Score: 233
Joined: 1/22/2002
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Acworth, GA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: downunder

The break in procedures given in the 95AX manual are reasonable if you're in a hurry but personally I'd extend them a bit. Most ringed engines will take about 2 hours before they're run in enough for brisk flying but are flyable after maybe 30 minutes if kept rich. By rich I mean just into a clean 2 stroke. Personally I run them in on a test stand for at least an hour using 25% all castor fuel starting with the first tank as rich as it can stay running without glow power then slowly leaning out until at the end of an hour it's just beginning to break into a 2 stroke. Strangely, this is where the ring carries the heaviest loads because the 4 stroking firing cycle has much higher pressure than when 2 stroking!



Well this is an OS and they break in very quick.  If you break it in as long as a Fox or Enya then they will be worn out before you fly it.

_____________________________

“I Saw Elvis at 1000 Feet” John Force

Hide Signatures

(in reply to downunder)
       Post #: 12

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 9:09 PM   
MJD



Posts: 5680
Score: 125
Joined: 5/28/2003
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		Q: How do I learn every possible method of breaking in an engine and end up wondering how to proceed?

A: Ask how to break in an engine on a public forum.



_____________________________

I try to be pessimistic, but why bother?

Hide Signatures

(in reply to Sport_Pilot)
       Post #: 13

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/15/2013 11:36 PM   
ronwc



Posts: 393
Score: 100
Joined: 1/14/2002
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: LARGO, FL, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BarracudaHockey

Sounds like a waste of perfectly good fuel to me personally.

Fly it slightly rich.


Amen to that.

I crank a new engine, open it up, adjust rich, take off and fly. I usually don't speed more than a minute on the ground - waste of fuel, less cooling and more dirt. If it happens to cut off, which is rare, I land.

Attachments
Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize



_____________________________

Ron - AMA 1025 - Largo, FL


Hide Signatures

(in reply to BarracudaHockey)
       Post #: 14

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 2:55 AM  1 votes
blw



Posts: 7635
Score: 655
Joined: 3/15/2004
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Opelika, AL, USA
Status: offline
quote:

Sport Pilot

Well this is an OS and they break in very quick.  If you break it in as long as a Fox or Enya then they will be worn out before you fly it.


Every engine model breaks in differently. You can treat every engine individually, imo.

I don't know the 'correct' way to break in engines. I know how I do it.

< Message edited by blw -- 1/16/2013 5:42 PM >

_____________________________

The ultimate responsibility of pilots is to fulfill the dreams of the countless millions who can only stare skyward...and wish.

"It doesn''t take but one Auburn man to be a majority" -
Coach Pat Dye

Hide Signatures

(in reply to Sport_Pilot)
       Post #: 15

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 9:54 AM   
asmund


 

Posts: 2824
Score: 111
Joined: 11/20/2005
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Floroe, NORWAY
Status: offline 		I used to believe in a fairly long running-in on the ground when I was less experienced. Over the years I do as the above, adjust the carb a little rich on the low end so it throttles ok, then good and rich on the high speed needle (not so rich it quits or have too little power to fly safely) and fly. Gradually leaning to full power after a few tanks. This goes for ABC type engines

Ringed engines I give the standard sloppy rich running of about one tankfull, then I do as above.

It is that easy really.

Let me add that I do not own Fox, Super Tiger or lapped steel piston engines and such, that require gallons of fuel to grind all mating surfaces to seal to compensate for rough and inaccurate tolerances.

Hide Signatures

(in reply to blw)
       Post #: 16

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 2:03 PM   
BarracudaHockey



Posts: 18371
Score: 280
Joined: 7/13/2003
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Jacksonville, FL, USA
Status: online 		I'm curious, what do you believe sloppy rich running does for a ringed engine?

_____________________________

Andy - Helicopter Forum Moderator
AMA 77227 Leader Member- Contest Director
www.JaxRC.com

Hide Signatures

(in reply to asmund)
       Post #: 17

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 2:23 PM   
jaka


 

Posts: 7183
Score: 158
Joined: 12/11/2001
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Upplands Vasby, SWEDEN
Status: offline 		Hi!
It makes the ring seat in the cylinder without rubbing against the cylinder walls too much, producing excessive heat and friction!
That easy!

But...All modern ringed engines can just as well be run a little rich and flown right away just from the start! No long running in periods are needed.

_____________________________

Jan Karlsson - Supplier MVVS Products

Hide Signatures

(in reply to BarracudaHockey)
       Post #: 18

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 3:12 PM   
asmund


 

Posts: 2824
Score: 111
Joined: 11/20/2005
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Floroe, NORWAY
Status: offline 		Yepp, but I like to be safe than sorry, so I give the ringed ones this first sloppy rich tankfull, it only takes 6-7 minutes anyway

Hide Signatures

(in reply to jaka)
       Post #: 19

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 3:47 PM   
BarracudaHockey



Posts: 18371
Score: 280
Joined: 7/13/2003
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Jacksonville, FL, USA
Status: online 		Gotcha, I was always under the impression that over lubricating when breaking in just meant that the ring/sleeve wouldn't reach operating temp which would just prolong the break in period.

_____________________________

Andy - Helicopter Forum Moderator
AMA 77227 Leader Member- Contest Director
www.JaxRC.com

Hide Signatures

(in reply to asmund)
       Post #: 20

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 5:42 PM   
Turk1



Posts: 1023
Score: 108
Joined: 10/8/2004
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Istanbul, TURKEY
Status: offline 		All kind of ringed engines should run under load and cooling phases periodically for break in. This is the trick. Run short  under load to make ring (s) press onto liner wall then give it cooling(rich idling).To run a ringed engine under a fixed speed is the worst thing to make during break in .


Hide Signatures

(in reply to BarracudaHockey)
       Post #: 21

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 5:47 PM  1 votes
blw



Posts: 7635
Score: 655
Joined: 3/15/2004
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Opelika, AL, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BarracudaHockey

Gotcha, I was always under the impression that over lubricating when breaking in just meant that the ring/sleeve wouldn't reach operating temp which would just prolong the break in period.


Saitos break in well following the instructions to run them sloppy rich the first 10 minutes. I think it's clear that Saito uses a very hard chrome process on the cylinder walls.

_____________________________

The ultimate responsibility of pilots is to fulfill the dreams of the countless millions who can only stare skyward...and wish.

"It doesn''t take but one Auburn man to be a majority" -
Coach Pat Dye

Hide Signatures

(in reply to BarracudaHockey)
       Post #: 22

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 9:07 PM   
MJD



Posts: 5680
Score: 125
Joined: 5/28/2003
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Turk1

All kind of ringed engines should run under load and cooling phases periodically for break in. This is the trick. Run short  under load to make ring (s) press onto liner wall then give it cooling(rich idling).To run a ringed engine under a fixed speed is the worst thing to make during break in .



The advice I lived by for ages is to prop the engine very lightly (as in underprop) and start with a very rich setting, heat on if required, for the first few minutes. Then repeated runs smoky 4c rich, extra oil a good thing, allowing the engine to operate under lighter shaft load but near operating rpm with lots of lubrication and cooling. And to heat cycle the engine via shorter runs, 3-5 minutes or so, allowing it to cool between runs.

But.. truth is I have not purchased a ringed engine in 2 decades + .. except for a Moki 2.10 I just snagged but have not run yet.

Does this procedure make any sense with modern ringed engines with a plated bore?


_____________________________

I try to be pessimistic, but why bother?

Hide Signatures

(in reply to Turk1)
       Post #: 23

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 10:10 PM   
1QwkSport2.5r



Posts: 3741
Score: 155
Joined: 10/15/2006
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Cottage Grove, MN, USA
Status: online 		I don't think prop load matters too much on ringed engines since most ringed engines don't have much of a tapered liner if at all. I run mine as rich as they will run without the glow driver on for one tank. Subsequent tanks leaning down in small increments. By tank 4 I'm at the 2/4 break and at that point I run 15-20 seconds in a 2-stroke run and back to 4-cycle run for 30 seconds. Doing this over 1-2 tanks. After this I run it in a rich 2-stroke gradually leaning down over 2-3 more tanks. At this point I will run it about 500-600rpm rich of peak. I've only had one engine that needed to be ran 800-1000rich to not sag and quit.

I like to get an hour to hour and a half of run time before I trust the engine to not quit; this goes for ringed and lapped engines only. Overkill? Probably. I am a patient guy and would rather take it slow and not rush it.

_____________________________

*Real* glow fuel is made with Methanol, Nitromethane, and Castor oil.

Hide Signatures

(in reply to MJD)
       Post #: 24

RE: Ringed 2 Stroke Break In - 1/16/2013 10:41 PM   
Sport_Pilot



Posts: 12484
Score: 233
Joined: 1/22/2002
Last Login: 5/24/2013
From: Acworth, GA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: asmund

I used to believe in a fairly long running-in on the ground when I was less experienced. Over the years I do as the above, adjust the carb a little rich on the low end so it throttles ok, then good and rich on the high speed needle (not so rich it quits or have too little power to fly safely) and fly. Gradually leaning to full power after a few tanks. This goes for ABC type engines

Ringed engines I give the standard sloppy rich running of about one tankfull, then I do as above.

It is that easy really.

Let me add that I do not own Fox, Super Tiger or lapped steel piston engines and such, that require gallons of fuel to grind all mating surfaces to seal to compensate for rough and inaccurate tolerances.



Since when did Fox, Super Tiger or lapped steel engines require gallons to break in?  The Fox takes a little longer than most other ringed engines but run good after several tanks though some older engines took longer.  A lapped steel engine brakes in after about 3 tanks or so.

_____________________________

“I Saw Elvis at 1000 Feet” John Force

Hide Signatures

(in reply to asmund)
       Post #: 25

Page:   [1] 2   next >   >>  
All Forums >> Glow Engines, Gas Engines, Fuel &amp; Mfg Support Forums >> Glow Engines >> Ringed 2 Stroke Break In
Page: [1] 2   next >   >>  




Jump to:


 
Google 



Search | Marketplace | Event Calendar | Local Clubs | Magazine | Product Ratings | New Products | Discussion Forums

Photo Gallery | Instructor Search | Field|Track|Marina Search

Advertisers | Hobby Vendor Resources | Rate Manufacturers | Sign In/Sign Up

SITE MAP!   : :   FORUM RULES

RC Universe is a service of Internet Brands, Inc. Copyright © 2001-2013.

Charities we support that also need your help
Yorkie Rescue | Humane Society | ASPCA | Crohn's-Colitis America


0.797RCU1