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Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 3:53 AM

tenzero1

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First off I am new to owning a true (non-toy) RC vehicle, however I have spent a lot of time researching and getting help from a friend who has many RC's. About a month ago I decided to trade somethings of mine for an OFNA Jammin X1 CR with a ton of extras on craigslist. I figured this would be a decent starting point. I spent a good amount of time looking at manuals and doing my homework yet I think I may have one issue that plaguing me.

I can get the motor running semi decently, however when I give it gas it does not move. After trying several times and spending more time researching I tried a few things. I have rotated the tires and made sure they spin the drive shaft and all gears properly. I have also taken out the engine and inspected the clutch assembly and it looked fine. No broken springs shoes dont look too worn. If i spin the clutch bell with my fingers it moves the tires. The car also moves freely when its pushed.

So my question....Does my engine need to hit a higher rpm in order for the clutch to engage or is there another issue im missing? From what I have read its usually a clutch issue or a problem with the drive/differentials,

I appreciate all help.

-Thor

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 5:00 AM

Ybenjulkay2x

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First do this while engine is off, turned on transmitter and receiver then apply gas on your remote then try to push the car to see if it move freely or not, if car doesn't roll freely then there's binding on your brake.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 6:11 AM

tenzero1

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It moves freely the brake only works when applied.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 6:50 AM

Foxy

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If the wheels turn when you rotate the clutch bell, it is probably not a diff. It really sounds like its the clutch.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 2:58 PM

tenzero1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Foxy

If the wheels turn when you rotate the clutch bell, it is probably not a diff. It really sounds like its the clutch.

Thats what I thought but the clutch seems to be fine all of the shos and springs look good.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 4:08 PM

Foxy

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Really with this kind of stuff, it's so simple (I'm not having a dig, you have correctly performed the basic diagnosis, which is:

1) When I apply throttle do the revs climb? Yes, go to 2. No, start the engine.
2) As the revs climb, does the clutch bell spin faster? Yes, go to 3. No, your clutch is buggered.
3) Does the clutch bell spinning also turn the center diff? Yes, go to blah blah....

This is 100% failsafe.

I feel like I should ask you if you changed anything recently in the clutch area, a new clutch bell? New shoes? Anything changed int he clutch area? In case you didn't realise, I am still 100% sure that its the clutch, no matter what you say. From the point where you said that spinning the cutch bell by hand makes the WHEELS turn, then I knew we are looking between the output shaft of the engine and the clutch bell. There is nowhere else that this problem could manifest itself, and what's the only thing between the output shaft and the clutch bell? The clutch assembly.

I can only imagine that maybe there's some reason the shoes aren't contacting the clutch bell, or some reason the springs won't release the shoes fully, see what I'm getting at.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 5:38 PM

Anthoop

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As above really but also check the flywheel is tight.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 7:55 PM

supertib

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is the engine revving up ?

if it is maybe your flywheel is loose on the crank ?

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/7/2013 11:17 PM

Ttowntoolman

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Clutch shoes facing the wrong direction?

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/8/2013 9:03 PM

tenzero1

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Thanks for all of the help looks like I have some work to do!

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/16/2013 2:55 AM

rccheech

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Foxy

Really with this kind of stuff, it's so simple (I'm not having a dig, you have correctly performed the basic diagnosis, which is:

1) When I apply throttle do the revs climb? Yes, go to 2. No, start the engine.
2) As the revs climb, does the clutch bell spin faster? Yes, go to 3. No, your clutch is buggered.
3) Does the clutch bell spinning also turn the center diff? Yes, go to blah blah....

This is 100% failsafe.

I feel like I should ask you if you changed anything recently in the clutch area, a new clutch bell? New shoes? Anything changed int he clutch area? In case you didn't realise, I am still 100% sure that its the clutch, no matter what you say. From the point where you said that spinning the cutch bell by hand makes the WHEELS turn, then I knew we are looking between the output shaft of the engine and the clutch bell. There is nowhere else that this problem could manifest itself, and what's the only thing between the output shaft and the clutch bell? The clutch assembly.

I can only imagine that maybe there's some reason the shoes aren't contacting the clutch bell, or some reason the springs won't release the shoes fully, see what I'm getting at.

I agree here, there is more than enough evidence to condemn the clutch, peices could be frozen to not let the shoes tohit the bell. Swap out the sboes amd springs and clean the inside of the clutchbell, a fine grit sandpaper will work on the clutchbell, its probably glazed.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/16/2013 3:23 AM

nitroexpress

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Can you turn the engine over by rotating the flywheel? If not, your flywheel is slipping on the crankshaft.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/20/2013 11:02 PM

tenzero1

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Sorry I haven't responded lately, been busy. But I finally broke down and took my car in to a shop to see if they could help. We spent a while messing with the car and got it to run a tad and got the wheels to move although not very fast but they were not sure what was wrong either. I decided to leave the car for their mechanic to take apart and look at and tune up. Hopefully it doesn't cost me a ton but I am out of ideas and the shop employees were very helpful in trying to get it going without having to use a mechanic. I appreciate everyone here trying to give me ideas its nice to have such a solid support group!

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/21/2013 3:41 AM

JohnP2

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Thanks for the follow up. A lot of folks find them problem or give up, and never are heard from again.

I agree with the others, it does sound like something in the clutch system. I hope too, that they don't charge you much at all. I cringe when I hear of people paying to get their RC's "fixed"....but the important part is you've not given up!

Just make sure that the 'mechanic' at your LHS is explicit on what he did to fix it when you talk with him. I'd go as far as asking him to call once he finds out what the problem is, go and pick it up and ask him what you need to do to fix it. As noted, at a minimum, be sure to fully understand what the fix is and simply add that to your knowledge base. ;-)

Let us know the results!

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/21/2013 1:37 PM

mattster1971

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnP2

Thanks for the follow up. A lot of folks find them problem or give up, and never are heard from again.

I agree with the others, it does sound like something in the clutch system. I hope too, that they don't charge you much at all. I cringe when I hear of people paying to get their RC's ''fixed''....but the important part is you've not given up!

Just make sure that the 'mechanic' at your LHS is explicit on what he did to fix it when you talk with him. I'd go as far as asking him to call once he finds out what the problem is, go and pick it up and ask him what you need to do to fix it. As noted, at a minimum, be sure to fully understand what the fix is and simply add that to your knowledge base. ;-)

Let us know the results!

Agreed. The only way this becomes a hobby to you is learning how to deal with these issues and diagnosing them through inspection and trial. I think that you would have ended up spending less if you had purchased a clutch yourself and installed. These cars require tons of maintenance and tlc and if you would prefer someone else do those things for you I think you are missing out on one major area of this hobby. You gotta put in the wrench time!

< Message edited by mattster1971 -- 1/21/2013 4:35 PM >

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/21/2013 7:03 PM

tenzero1

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John- I dont want to be the person who just joins until they have what they need. I would like to become a member of the community here. I also intend to speak with the mechanic and figure out what is the issue. He should be calling me to let me know what he will need to do if it does need a major fix. Hopefully its not a huge issue but none of the other employees at the store could get it to stay running right.

Matt- Im 23, married, going to grad school, teaching college, doing my own thesis, and taking graduate level classes so in my free time I would rather enjoy my hobby vs. continuously tear it apart and get no where. I have spent the "wrench time" on it already and have 0 hours of driving time. I am fine with learning the ins and out and I have already done a ton but at some point I have to draw the line before I just give up entirely. There is a difference between laziness and last resort.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/22/2013 12:55 AM

JohnP2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tenzero1

Matt- Im 23, married, going to grad school, teaching college, doing my own thesis, and taking graduate level classes so in my free time I would rather enjoy my hobby vs. continuously tear it apart and get no where. I have spent the "wrench time" on it already and have 0 hours of driving time. I am fine with learning the ins and out and I have already done a ton but at some point I have to draw the line before I just give up entirely. There is a difference between laziness and last resort.

I can appreciate that, Tyler....I completed my thesis when I was 23 as well, and that was pretty much eight months of my life. ;-) I'm 42 now and that was still one of the most intense periods of my life.

Matt was simply indicating that the nitro side of "the hobby" lends itself to being a little more hands-on vs the electric side. Some people (i.e. "nitroheads") actually prefer that...it's the reason they are engaged with it....simply to maintain/upgrade what they have purchased. This is simply to help set expectation there is a greater than zero chance 5-10 tanks down the road there will be another issue that requires "wrenching". It can be something as simple as a bad gear mesh or something as frustrating as a broken pull-start. Just keep at it like you have, and as noted add to your knowledge base as things occur (as they will occur, because they do with everyone).

If you think you have it bad, look to the picture to your left...that is what happened to me after the first time I started my nitro engine (which took me six hours to get is started). Regardless, I got it all worked out and sometimes WANT to break things so I can fix them now. ha ha!

Thanks!

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/22/2013 2:55 PM

tenzero1

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Its Thor haha. But how on earth did you complete a Masters thesis in 8 months? On average it takes 2 years or more let alone the classes required would take two years. You must be a savant!

And I felt that matt was insinuating that I was not attempting to do everything that I could in order to learn the hobby. I just don't think he understood how much time i have invested into something to which i have seen no return. I am fully committed to becoming proficient at working on these things but it will have to come with time.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/22/2013 3:07 PM

mattster1971

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tenzero1

Its Thor haha. But how on earth did you complete a Masters thesis in 8 months? On average it takes 2 years or more let alone the classes required would take two years. You must be a savant!

And I felt that matt was insinuating that I was not attempting to do everything that I could in order to learn the hobby. I just don't think he understood how much time i have invested into something to which i have seen no return. I am fully committed to becoming proficient at working on these things but it will have to come with time.

I wasn't implying you were lazy or disinterested in putting in the wrench time, just saying it is essential to learning your vehicle and being able to diagnose issues down the road. You have quite a lot going on in your life, more than I think I could ever handle so do what you can. Once its running well I feel sure you will enjoy this hobby. I am an individual that will try to help and don't tend to be antagonistic or argumentative so feel free to bounce questions off us anytime. From what you described It could be as simple as the clutch installed incorrectly or not engaging or something with the flywheel or collet. I look forward to hearing what was the culprit of the problem. Btw.. I think running is delayed for me for a while, todays high temp is 25F lows in the single digits, suppose to last for the next 7- 10 days. Mother nature she is a wicked shrew.

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RE: Need some help troubleshooting first Nitro - 1/22/2013 8:39 PM

tenzero1

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Thank you for that Matt. And I found out today that the mechanic found a small hole that was perfectly blocked my an engine mount. He basically said there was no way I would have seen it. So Im not getting enough compression and I need a new engine.

So I guess my start to this hobby will be very delayed as I have no money. But I now know more than I did so its some type of progress. Thanks to everyone for thier help.

quote:

ORIGINAL: mattster1971

quote:

ORIGINAL: tenzero1

Its Thor haha. But how on earth did you complete a Masters thesis in 8 months? On average it takes 2 years or more let alone the classes required would take two years. You must be a savant!

And I felt that matt was insinuating that I was not attempting to do everything that I could in order to learn the hobby. I just don't think he understood how much time i have invested into something to which i have seen no return. I am fully committed to becoming proficient at working on these things but it will have to come with time.

I wasn't implying you were lazy or disinterested in putting in the wrench time, just saying it is essential to learning your vehicle and being able to diagnose issues down the road. You have quite a lot going on in your life, more than I think I could ever handle so do what you can. Once its running well I feel sure you will enjoy this hobby. I am an individual that will try to help and don't tend to be antagonistic or argumentative so feel free to bounce questions off us anytime. From what you described It could be as simple as the clutch installed incorrectly or not engaging or something with the flywheel or collet. I look forward to hearing what was the culprit of the problem. Btw.. I think running is delayed for me for a while, todays high temp is 25F lows in the single digits, suppose to last for the next 7- 10 days. Mother nature she is a wicked shrew.

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