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All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> Questions and Answers >> Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads?
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[Poll]

Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads?
Red Loc-Tite
  30% (11)
Blue Loc-Tite
  38% (14)
Other; post name
  30% (11)


Total Votes : 36
(last vote on : 1/30/2013 9:15 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/7/2013 11:47 PM   
dasintex



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Status: offline 		To Stop Exhaust Bolts on DLE55 from Vibrating Loose what is the Best Compound/Product to use on the Exhaust Bolt Threads: Blue Lock-Tite, Red Lock-tite, etc; I will be using Wire Lockable Socket Head Cap Screws, appreciate your suggestions!


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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 12:26 AM   
GaryHarris



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Status: offline 		I voted "Other". Other meaning anti seize, never seize etc. Loctite is never a good idea when used with dissimilar metals with differing thermal coefficients and the possibility of galvanic reaction. Anti seize offers a better lubrication in threaded fasteners when thermal expansion and contraction happens when steel is threaded into cast aluminum. The aluminum will expand and contract much quicker with extreme thermal changes than the steel fasteners adding an extra axial load on the threads in the aluminum not to mention the radial load between the fastener and the host.

Then there is the controversial galvanic/electrolysis argument. But Ill leave that to the Engineers. I'm just a lab tech with 30 years experience.

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 12:46 AM   
badger5964



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Status: offline 		I do not have a gas engine but finding that loctite broke down in the heat and would not hold on some 0.60 glow engine mufflers, I used red silicone on the screw. It held up well and was easily removed. I use it now instead of loctite.

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 12:56 AM   
dasintex



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Status: offline 		It was suggested to use Grey Permatex RTV or the Red Permatex RTV; any opinions or experience with either of these?

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 12:57 AM  1 votes
kwblake


 

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Status: offline 		I am going with Gary on this.  I have also been around the block two or three times.  I am a ticketed Machinist, Tool and Die Maker, and Construction Millwright ( yea I know, I couldn't keep a job ) with 35 years experience.  I worked in an aircraft engine overhaul facility for 12 years, and although I worked as a Tool Maker there,not a  mechanic, I cannot think of an instance where both lockwire and threadlocker was used. It may have been done, I'm not 100% sure. If done correctly, the lockwire is enough.  Also, there are more kinds of Loctite than just 242, and 271.  If you go to the Loctite site, and up at the top of the homepage, you will see industrial products.  There are high temp. products available.  Loctite 242 and 271 will both cure and release with very little heat, so they will not be much use.  Of the high temp. products, I would think that 243 would be the best choice.  You don't want to use anything high strength in aluminium.  The threads will not make it.  But again I would go with what Gary said.  Lockwire and some neversieze.



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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:02 AM   
dasintex



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Status: offline 		Interesting, I never thought to use 'Anti/Never Sieze'; does the high heat of the exhaust affect this stuff, or would the high temp RTV work the same or as good as the 'Anti/Never Sieze'?

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:05 AM   
Gray Beard


 

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Status: offline 		Other, just heat is good. I run the engine up to temp by flying it then land and tighten up the bolts. That does the trick on most any type of engine. Anything that will stand up to the heat could cause a problem when you want to remove the bolts. Stripped threads are always a thrill.

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:10 AM   
GaryHarris



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quote:

ORIGINAL: dasintex

Interesting, I never thought to use 'Anti/Never Sieze'; does the high heat of the exhaust affect this stuff, or would the high temp RTV work the same or as good as the 'Anti/Never Sieze'?


Heat has no effect on anti seize in the temperature ranges were dealing with plane engines.

RTV is just rubber, silicone whatever. I don't even use it for gaskets, I'll use grease.

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:12 AM   
GaryHarris



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quote:

ORIGINAL: kwblake

I am going with Gary on this.  I have also been around the block two or three times.  I am a ticketed Machinist, Tool and Die Maker, and Construction Millwright ( yea I know, I couldn't keep a job ) with 35 years experience.  I worked in an aircraft engine overhaul facility for 12 years, and although I worked as a Tool Maker there,not a  mechanic, I cannot think of an instance where both lockwire and threadlocker was used. It may have been done, I'm not 100% sure. If done correctly, the lockwire is enough.  Also, there are more kinds of Loctite than just 242, and 271.  If you go to the Loctite site, and up at the top of the homepage, you will see industrial products.  There are high temp. products available.  Loctite 242 and 271 will both cure and release with very little heat, so they will not be much use.  Of the high temp. products, I would think that 243 would be the best choice.  You don't want to use anything high strength in aluminium.  The threads will not make it.  But again I would go with what Gary said.  Lockwire and some neversieze.



Thank you.

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:19 AM   
GaryHarris



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gray Beard

Other, just heat is good. I run the engine up to temp by flying it then land and tighten up the bolts. That does the trick on most any type of engine. Anything that will stand up to the heat could cause a problem when you want to remove the bolts. Stripped threads are always a thrill.



Seems like we were talking about this the other day Gene.

Always re-check your torque values after your first, and several thermal cycles when using dissimilar materials when it comes to threaded fasteners.

I gotta go though. Some dude want's to mix Nitro and Gasoline.



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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:20 AM   
kwblake


 

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Status: offline 		The neverseez  will stop the bolt from "sticking" in the threaded hole.  It wil not stop the bolt from becoming loose. The regular grade is good for 1800 deg. F, while the nickel based is good to 2400 deg. F.  I kind of think you would be good with either. 
The lockwire will be more than enough to stop  the bolts from coming loose, and the threads will thank-you for the neverseez.  Do some research on the lockwire though.  It should be done so that it is stopping both bolts from becoming loose.  Like anything else, there is a right, and a wrong way to do this.



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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:22 AM   
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Status: offline 		You are welcome Gary.   



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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:32 AM   
GaryHarris



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quote:

ORIGINAL: kwblake

You are welcome Gary.   



I like to share songs in celebration. You in?




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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:32 AM   
dasintex



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Status: offline 		I've used Lock Wire Bolts and Nuts before, when I used to Race Snomobiles; seemed like the thing to use on these exhaust bolts that want to vibrate loose, just wanted to see what product/compound everyone used on the threads, from what I have read here so far, Thread Sealant/Anti Seize Products and the Lock Wire is the way to go.

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 1:40 AM   
kwblake


 

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Status: offline 		Gary I'm in.  Dasintex, guess you don't do much snowmobile racing in Texas. 



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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 2:21 AM   
Gray Beard


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kwblake

The neverseez  will stop the bolt from ''sticking'' in the threaded hole.  It wil not stop the bolt from becoming loose. The regular grade is good for 1800 deg. F, while the nickel based is good to 2400 deg. F.  I kind of think you would be good with either. 
The lockwire will be more than enough to stop  the bolts from coming loose, and the threads will thank-you for the neverseez.  Do some research on the lockwire though.  It should be done so that it is stopping both bolts from becoming loose.  Like anything else, there is a right, and a wrong way to do this.


I use it on every bolt when I do a engine rebuild, good stuff but I have never thought of it to keep anything tight. I was given a used bottle of it about 20 years ago from a ship fitter friend and it seems to last forever. Bet my grand kids will be using it long after I'm gone. Good stuff.
I think Gary is stuck on the same song, he has shared this one a bunch. Or maybe it's just the band?

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 2:23 AM   
dasintex



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Status: offline 		Kevin;

LOL...Nope, not since I moved from Ontario to Texas in 1992, can't say I miss the Cold Winters!

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 2:31 AM   
Gray Beard


 

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Status: offline 		Snow??????????????

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 2:53 AM   
kwblake


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gray Beard

Snow??????????????


Yea. We do get a little here.  But only about 2 or 3 feet.  And it's a dry cold. 




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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 3:06 AM   
speedracerntrixie


 

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Status: online 		IMO if you have tried several solutions and still having the muffler bolts coming loose you may want to investigate the operating temp of your engine.


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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 3:34 AM   
oil_can_harry


 

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Status: offline 		Take the muffler holes and the bolts and wash them with plain ole gasoline. Put it back together while it is still wet. Tighten well and let it sit overnight.

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 4:26 AM   
Gray Beard


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kwblake


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gray Beard

Snow??????????????


Yea. We do get a little here.  But only about 2 or 3 feet.  And it's a dry cold. 



We use the same line when speaking of the heat, it's a dry heat but so is fire!!

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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 12:42 PM   
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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 12:44 PM   
kwblake


 

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Status: offline 		Hey dasintex.  One thing I forgot to mention is, do not overtighten your bolts. If you torque a dry bolt and a lubricated bolt to the same torque value, the lubricated bolt will have more tension on it than the dry. 



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RE: Best Compound/Product for Exhaust Bolt Threads? - 1/8/2013 12:58 PM   
iflyg450


 

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