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RE: Fuse twist - 1/23/2013 4:02 AM   
52larry52


 

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From: Villa Rica, GA, USA
Status: offline 		bikerbc, It knows your a "biker" and doesn't like you! (insert smiley face here) Just pulling your chain man, I ride a Honda VTX 1300. What were you trying to glue that it didn't work? I started a small cub kit several months ago, got the fuselage partially done with Ambroid, all balsa wood so far, before having to set it aside for another higher ranking project. It seamed to work fine and hasn't fallen apart sitting on the shelf so far. Don't know why it gave you trouble.

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/23/2013 11:51 AM   
bikerbc


 

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Status: online 		I tried it on Balsa to start with..I used to use it a lot for joining wing skins because it sanded so well but they just fell apart so I did a bunch of tests on different joints that I made and every one failed so I got a new tube and same thing...Well I thought I must have gotten old stock because I didnt want to give up..I asked at the hobby shop and they told me they just got a new shipment so I bought 6 tubes thinking I was going to be okay..I did another bunch of test glues and every one failed..They just would not stick for me...The glue joints would pull apart at the joint itself..I left some for 24 hrs before checking...My yellow glue is stuck in 15 to 30 mins..Enough to move on ,or sand off the ooze out..Maybe I should try it on some harder stuff that it cant soak into like this bass wood, but I used to use it on balsa all the time...I just dont know...

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/23/2013 4:44 PM   
JohnBuckner



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Status: offline 		Hmm Ambroid, of the wood cellulose cements that I have used in the past which include as I remember: Ambroid, Testors, UHUHart (europe) and Sigment is definately a classic example of where the so called 'good old days' were not all that good!


Looked around a bit and here is a fasinating history on ambroid.

http://www.ottertooth.com/Canoe_pages/ambroid.htm

Now this artical claims that the formula has never changed and I do not beleve that as most all the brands that I am aware of "were in fact the the "airplane glues" that the kids in the late sixties and early seventies would snort (if thats the proper term) and were getting a form of a high on but one devistating to the brain cells. It turned out it was the solvent 'toulene' was the problem and I think all the manufacturers went to alternative solvents which may or may not have changed the performance of the cements for our construction purposes.

Now as kids in early middle fifties we were doing this unknowningly in our little workshop bedrooms, garages probably just not as bad as putting a bag over your head.

Anyway that bit of trivia aside and even if you dismiss the other problems of this stuff then what irked me the very most was Ambroid would definately become brittle over as little as just a few years and the airplanes could be weakened by this.

So while its fun to joke about it, there is no way I would ever go back to actually seriously using it. I do have, still fly and build a few nostalgia types but do not feel any nostagia about the cellulose cements at all.

John

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/23/2013 4:48 PM   
33willys


 

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From: Alamogordo, NM, USA
Status: offline 		Interesting direction on this thread...all good information.  Regarding the twist, I like what JohnBuckner said about adding gussets to the inside of the braces.  I can drill a hole in the gussets and use them to string the rigging too.  What type of wood is recommended for the gussets?

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/23/2013 11:19 PM   
bikerbc


 

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Status: online 		I usually use plywood Often 1/16" thick and I like Titebond III glue

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/24/2013 3:47 AM   
52larry52


 

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Status: offline 		JohnBuckner and bikerbc, I think you guys are right about the Ambroid glue, something is wrong with it. You got me wondering about my partially built fuselage done with Ambroid, so I went down into the shop, got it off the shelf, out of the plastic storage bag, and pulled lightly on a fuselage side and former joint. Damm, it pulled apart with hardly any effort!! I'am shocked! This kit (it's an old Tidewater Hobbies non scale fun type Cub) uses solid balsa fuselage sides and formers made up of 4 balsa sticks in a box configuration. Real old school, but simple mostly balsa wood construction. If the Ambroid didn't hold this, and it didn't, what will it hold? I take back my recommendation to use it on the Elder 40 open rear framework. I don't know now what would be good. I was thinking about flying my Elder this weekend, weather permitting, but now I'am gun shy with it. I'll look it over and due some "tug testing" of the joints before flying it, and redo all the Cub joints with CA. Thanks guys for the discussion and heads up.

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/24/2013 3:49 AM   
52larry52


 

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Status: offline 		bikerbc, Oh and by the way, I guess the Ambroid knows that I'am a "biker" too and dosen't like me either!!!

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/24/2013 4:57 AM   
JohnBuckner



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Status: offline 		Well maybe there is something afterall to this business of Ambroid not liking bikers. Does the old Salsbury make me a biker too?

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/24/2013 7:23 AM   
bikerbc


 

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Status: online 		Well there is one motorcycle lover up here that is jelous over that one John..I love old scooters of any sort..History..It takes me back to my youth...

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/25/2013 4:25 AM   
52larry52


 

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Status: offline 		JohnBuckner, Yeah, that' cool. Someone spent some time and effort making that one look nice. Now to your question, as far as I'am concerned that scooter makes you a biker but glue something with Ambroid and see if it likes you or not! That will be the true test......I think we have drifted so far off topic on this poor guys thread that we owe him an apology. I think we should all mail him a tube of Ambroid as payment.

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/25/2013 5:41 AM   
33willys


 

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Status: offline 		Naw, no need for an apology, as I said earlier all good info.  I was an avid long distance motorcycler for many years.  Still a street rodder and some of the info I get here may be applied to other hobbies.  Keep ramblin' 

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/25/2013 5:03 PM   
bikerbc


 

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Status: online 		You can drill little holes in your gussets for the glue to seep thru and it will act like rivits if you feel you need the extra purchace.

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RE: Fuse twist - 1/26/2013 4:48 AM   
52larry52


 

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Status: offline 		I did something similar on my Elder gusset plates. I made 3 depressions on each gusset plate in a consistent pattern using an automatic center punch and after the rear wood frame was painted brown, I put a drop of silver paint in each depression to simulate rivets. My fake rivets ended up recessed not protruding but they were easy to do and the finished visual effect is good. I used a round toothpick to put the drop of silver paint into each punch mark.

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