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Hand-Eye Coordination - 9/26/2003 12:13:03 AM   
zxcv11



Posts: 380
Joined: 9/11/2003
From: Glenshaw, PA, USA
Status: offline 		I have been doing some research lately about traditional club learning vs. self-taught beginners.(In light of the elec. back yard flier trends blowing up as they are.) Here's an interesting thought. Wouldn't one think that a younger generation, brought up on video games in ever complicated schemes, would be in a position to pick up RC flight much easier than those who were a generation behind them. Many grade school children now posses better hand-eye coordination without a thought than a lot of adults without training.
Are there any instructors who have been around for a while, or even RC vets who could comment about this for me?? I think this is a very interesting idea which could also be why many are seeing younger and younger children actually able to fly.(I recently read a post about a mans 6 year old flying!!) And thoughts are welcome.

Brian
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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 9/26/2003 1:11:04 AM   
ZAGNUT



Posts: 2436
Joined: 2/26/2003
From: tel-aviv, ISRAEL
Status: offline 		i'll offer myself as an example for ya.
i'm young (30) and i've allways sucked at video games, that hellfire thingy here on rcu has me totally baffled and rc sims also have me defeated. when i used to go out with friends they'd all play those video games and i'd be on a pinball machine or playing air-hockey.
i've been flying c/l since age 5 and r/c since age 14 and my only "instructor" was my dad who did the driving and hand launching. my very first r/c flight was a success even with the deadstick landing.
i'm a very good bmx rider on a halfpipe, not matt hoffman, but good. this takes major coordination.
in my army service i was an anti-aircraft gunner in an m-163 vulcan, where you basically follow a plane in the gunsite using a joystick. while shooting live rounds at a drone i was excellent but i allways had a low score on the simulator. same with the stinger, i could allways score a "hit" when following a real plane but allways messed up with the sim.

i think that my problem with video games and simulators is the lack of feedback you get in the real world. something about seeing images on a screen just doesn't do it for me.

dave

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 9/26/2003 2:28:30 PM   
SaviCatses



Posts: 245
Joined: 10/11/2002
From: Montreal, QC, CANADA
Status: offline 		I'm from the 'Nintendo Generation'. Played plenty of nintendo when I was a kid, and then 'graduated' to a computer with the complicated setups (how about using a joystick, mouse, and keyboard to control a computer game - all at the same time! )

I learned to fly very quickly, I was landing on my third flight, and now I'm just starting my third gallon of fuel and doing combination eights in the sky. I'm not ready for Imac yet, but I attribute my quick learning to all the training I got playing video games.

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 9/26/2003 7:28:53 PM   
*Crash*Johnson*



Posts: 1089
Joined: 4/12/2003
From: Here, NJ, USA
Status: offline 		I definately agree video games give the younger generations an added advantage. Simple hand eye coordination that is developed during years of video games paid off I guess

And my mom always told me they were no good.... Show'ed her I did

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 9/26/2003 8:00:09 PM   
zxcv11



Posts: 380
Joined: 9/11/2003
From: Glenshaw, PA, USA
Status: offline 		Thanx for the replys so far guys Keep 'em coming.
Dave, sounds like you were pretty coordinated naturaly. I'm sure learning flight from a younger age also helped a lot!! My cousin was an AA gunner in the USNavy....shot those super auto chain-guns. We'd go out on the ship during family weeks when they'd tow a junkr behind a jet and he'd blow that thing to sh**!!!! I hear you about the actual feedback thing.
Savi and Crash....I agree. At the very least it couldn't have hurt!! And I don't think Sims are hurting either. There, we have both a combination of the video-gen., plus now the ability to actually program in real world factors such as wind, use real world existing models, ect. This at least gives a 'bit' of that feedback missing from the true experience and greatly enhances the learning curve. It would be worthy to note that many gamers had some experience with Sims way before they even thought of RC flying. I know I was fling the Longbow sim with FULL real-flight control and characteristics way before any serious RC thoughts
I wonder if this will help some day when I get my 1st heli.... (someday$$$....lol).

Thanx again.

Brian

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 6:46:50 AM   
ballgunner



Posts: 2109
Joined: 2/1/2003
From: Payson, AZ, USA
Status: offline 		I believe the hand/eye coordination thing is more a matter of youth than giving credit to Nintendo. It's of course possible that it could contribute but I don't think it's the complete answer or that it contributes a great deal. Our youngest club member (14) is a natural RC pilot without sims or computer games. the same as trying to get to Carnegie Hall, it's practice, practice, practice.

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 7:19:10 AM   
BankYank



Posts: 935
Joined: 11/1/2003
From: Kootenai, ID, USA
Status: offline 		Well im 40 and glad i made it this far. Hand eye coordination and knowing how to move the sticks is the key i think. If a person has good coordination AND understands how the plane moves with stick movement or non movement its not hard to fly at all.
I tought myself to fly last september and never had a crash till about 4 months ago showing off thinking i was all big and bad. Was quit humbling actually

< Message edited by ezee38 -- 10/20/2003 7:21:39 AM >

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 9:51:23 AM   
wings



Posts: 1538
Joined: 8/23/2003
From: Carrollton, KY, USA
Status: offline 		A-man brother! There are few in this forum that think one can do anything without an instructor if they havn't done it before. I know it is smart to get help, but these people think that if you don't join a club, you are destined to fail!

Glad to see there are others out there that don't depend on an instructor to wipe...well, you now what I mean, lol.


And I agree that video games have to help. I can't say as they helped me that much, they may have, I play video games now and then, but I'm not a junky. I played them a lot when was younger. By the way, I am 26 to give you an idea of the erra I grew up in.

My cousin on the other hand IS a video game junky. He picked up my uncles electric plane and flew it no problem the very first time. He contributes it to video games. Who knows, but I think it does definetely help.


Wings,

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 12:57:10 PM   
MinnFlyer



Posts: 19644
Joined: 4/22/2002
From: Willmar, MN, USA
Status: offline 		One thing the Nintendo generation tends to forget is that when you smash your airplane to splinters, there's no "RESET" button.

Use an instructor!

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 1:55:46 PM   
hookedonrc



Posts: 2181
Joined: 12/30/2002
From: Broken Arrow, OK, USA
Status: offline 		If you don't think that learning young helps with hand and eye coordination go skiing sometime. I started in the sport in 1967 and still get a little in when I can. I am pretty good, but I marvel at the kids that are skiing well before they even hit 10 years old. This is a sport that is not easy and needs some instruction from someone to do it right. If you don't get it, you WILL crash and burn. Hmmm...sounds familiar. Yes there are plenty of people that learn without instruction, I have to watch out for them every time I go.

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 2:41:38 PM   
greenboot



Posts: 1173
Joined: 1/16/2002
From: St Louis, MO, USA
Status: offline 		I have taught both RC and full scale to the old and young. There are of course lots of factors that effect learning rate, but generally the younger ones are more open minded and pick it up quicker. I think the game machines might help a little bit, especially the realistic flight simulators.

I am also a firm believer in natural talent. Just about anyone can learn to fly and with practice can become pretty good. But certain people are born with the right mix of senses and brain cells, giving them the ability to become the best.

To

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 5:29:18 PM   
FLYBOY



Posts: 8691
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Missoula, MT, USA
Status: offline 		I started when I was 10, picked it up really quickly and was doing everything I wanted in no time. Hand eye coordination was amazing. Didn't have to think about maneuvers and just did them.

Now I am 37, have to think about the difficult maneuvers, not as steady as I used to be and still throw anything I fly through the wringer.

The younger you are, the better you are. Sometimes the games help, sometimes they don't. It depends on the kid.

All in all, get an instructor, you will have a good environment to learn in and crash less. Don't get one, you will get frusterated and quit 9 times out of 10.


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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 6:00:14 PM   
nascarjoe


 

Posts: 287
Joined: 2/25/2003
From: Olcott, NY, USA
Status: offline 		I believe it's more the competance of the instructor much more so than that of the student. As they say, gargage in - garbage out, meaning that it will take a bad student less time to learn with a good instructor than a good student with a bad instructor.

I've seen beginners of all ages not seem to learn much, if anything with an instructor who means well, but really doesn't have a clue on how to teach, then go to another instructor who never seems to have anyone with what is known as bad "hand-eye coordination". In fact, this instructor with his arms folded, as a training drill, has all of his students look down at the transmitter while the plane is in the air (no buddy-box) - and all newbies actually fly the plane better without looking at the plane. He did this with me, let me tell you, it is an interesting experience, to say the least.

Trainers are designed to fly by themselves, therefore, it doesn't take much stick movement to make a circuit around the field. This is why trainers which self-correct are for the most part not as beginner friendly as the type of planes that maintain a constant bank angle. I've seen this instructor teach a sight impaired person fly quite well. Obviously, this sight impaired person couldn't fly totally on his own.

nascarjoe

< Message edited by nascarjoe -- 10/20/2003 6:01:48 PM >

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RE: Hand-Eye Coordination - 10/20/2003 9:30:10 PM   
smokingcrater


 

Posts: 2353
Joined: 9/20/2002
From: Up north, ND, USA
Status: offline 		nintendo generation, and completely self taught. Started with an avistar, was bored after a couple of weeks, moved on to a couple of sig SE's and now a U can do... I have never dumb thumbed a model into the ground, all crashes are due to mechanical failures of some sort. I'm also avid FPS gamer and computer programmer, but also race mountain bikes, someone else mentioned biking helping...

anyway, what I think helped me more is that I've always had some sort of rc model around since age 5. control reversal isn't something that ever crossed my mind, orientation is automatic.

< Message edited by rkramer -- 10/20/2003 9:31:57 PM >

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