Posts: 5
Joined: 1/16/2006 From: vienna, VA, USA Status: offline
Hi, mark Well it seems that its too late to try and fly it, i already have completely broken the nose cone off but fixed the whole propeler prop and motor, i was thinking about putting it in the box untill i got used to a more subceptable easy to fly and learn plane. I was looking into the HobbyZone Firebird Freedom Electric RTF with the anti crash technology. Also i was looking into a 4 channel duct fan airplane( most likely the GWS a-10) it seems it is a slow flyer....but is it easy to control? Should it get used to a 3 channel first? Pardon my questions but I would also like to ask your opinion about getting a "realflight" flight simulator?
Posts: 19
Joined: 10/21/2004 From: Eagle Creek, OR, USA Status: offline
Hi I saw no reply to your questions, I hope no one minds me jumping in.
The real flight simulator is a awsome tool in helping people this hobby. It will help you learn control functions and directions and not cost hundreds with every crash. Real life is different than real flight though, and experience can help with that. I recommend an instructor if possible. if not try a real simple aircraft. I mentioned the slo-v earlier in this thread. My dad learned to fly by himself with real flight and the slo-v. his 1rst few flights were a little scary, and he did kill the 1rst carbon fuslage, but it was cheap and easy to replace. He flys it so well now, I bought him a GWS INTERMEDIATE Tiger Moth. He now flys that very well. DO NOT try this as your 1rst plane! My point is, the Slo-V survived long enough to teach him to move on. Planes like A-10 WARTHOGS are not beginer aircraft. Your 1rst plane should be ugly, slow, stable, strong, and easy to repair. !rst planes should be boring looking and flying. The fancy, sexy stuff comes later. Get a Simulator and a Slo- V
I am looking at buying my first plane and want a small, easy to repair, parkflyer...My Question is -Why are all "beginner planes" only three channel...what is it about ailerons that make them so hard to fly...I have been flying a slinger in Real FlightG3 and I like it alot...would it be a good choice for a first plane.
Posts: 19
Joined: 10/21/2004 From: Eagle Creek, OR, USA Status: offline
Sorry, I don't know what a slinger is. My real flight is a older version.
Most trainers made now are three channel to help ease the learning curb. The thought is, you first need to fly RC then after that you will want to upgrade to a higher performance 2nd aircraft that flys with all four channels. I agree mostly. Many experienced pilots can't explain exactly what the rudder and ailerons have to do with each other, or why the rudder banks the aircraft in a turn. When a aircraft is equiped with ailerons the rudder is used to counter act ADVERSE YAW, also called Aileron drag. I don't like to type too much so the skinny is, the aileron that goes down creates more DRAG than the one that goes up. This extra drag pulls (YAWS) that wing back while rolling it in the desired direction (SLIP). Rudder is used to keep the turn coordinated (relative wind striking the airplane straight). too much rudder and you have a SKID, dangerous unless you like spins, and beginers don't do spins, hence no ailerons for beginners, makes things easier. Why the plane banks using rudder only? When the rudder yaws the plane it accelerates the outside wing forcing the relative wind to travel over it faster, thus creating more lift than the inside wing which is de accelerated , less relative wind, less lift. Outside wing up, inside wing down, bank is made. Too much rudder can de accelerate the inside wing so much the wing can stall and snap roll. Bad thing for beginners. Most three channel trainers don't have a big enough rudder to do this, so they are easy to fly with just the rudder, and you still get a nice looking banked turn! Use a model to help visualize this stuff. If anyone wants to learn about relative wind, let me know. Relative wind and wind is some of the most important stuff to understand in flight.
Posts: 20
Joined: 8/11/2005 From: seaside,
CA, USA Status: offline
Matt Kirsch,
is there a form about making the duskstik with ailerons? i have bought one and wanted to have it a 4 channel so i can have a little more maneuverability with it
Posts: 4
Joined: 3/20/2006 From: , UNITED KINGDOM Status: offline
Wow, a lot to read there.
Can anyone give a guy from the UK some tips on what from the above (or equivalent) would be readily available in the UK to start with.
I have Futaba 6EX radio gear to got with my irvine trainer to learn powered flight, but my past RC history has been electric and powered cars and boats with a little bungy launched gliding.
I have recently bought a 3 chan fun fly thingy to play about with but obviously I want to get into the thick of things as soon as poss and try some of the foamy type kits out there for some stunts and prop hagning fun.
Posts: 95
Joined: 2/6/2006 From: , NC, USA Status: offline
Paul, this is a world-wide forum with at least a few Brits. Most of the planes discussed in this thread are 3-channel trainers. It sounds like you already have a 3-channel airplane, so maybe you need a 4-channel trainer as your next one. You should do a search for that. Something like the E-Starter might suit you.
I don't know what is available in the UK, but you could start by checking your local hobby shop or domestic online retailer to see what they are offering, then come back here and do a search on the options to see if they are good or bad airplanes.
And I guess you could have something shipped from anywhere in the world if you had to.
Some of the more popular foam stunt planes are the Shock Flyers, which I think are coming out of Germany, so that is a bit closer for you than for those of us in the US.
Posts: 4
Joined: 3/20/2006 From: , UNITED KINGDOM Status: offline
Thanks Barry, that's what I was looking for, i've tried to steer clear of shops as they only tend to stock what they want to stock, not always what i want to buy, so thought i'd get an idea whats good from people that have flown them first, then find where to buy it after.
I could buy online, but i'm not a fan of credit cards and stuff, I do still like to go somewhere with cash in my pocket, even if that means a bit of a journey.
Posts: 19
Joined: 4/4/2006 From: Hamilton, ON, CANADA Status: offline
Some of their newer products (IE the freedom) are now 3 channel, so you get Throttle, Rudder, Elevator, which is mixed because it's a v-tail, haven't flown mine yet, but it seemed to be the best choice, was the same price as the RTF Slo-V, but has a few more features (just as ugly though!!! ;-) )
Posts: 196
Joined: 12/24/2005 From: Tacoma, WA, USA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: djpaul69
Thanks Barry, that's what I was looking for, i've tried to steer clear of shops as they only tend to stock what they want to stock, not always what i want to buy, so thought i'd get an idea whats good from people that have flown them first, then find where to buy it after.
I could buy online, but i'm not a fan of credit cards and stuff, I do still like to go somewhere with cash in my pocket, even if that means a bit of a journey.
Too true in some shops, but not all, at least in my neck of the woods. There is always going to be a factor of these shop owners wanting to stock only items that make the most profits for them, that is a factor involved with paying for the inventory and overhead, the costs to run one are tremendous, but if you are only selling obscure, or inferior wares just to make a buck, patrons will eventually find another suppleir. I have 3 close by, only one took any time out to help me with my RC venture. My quest was just to get a decent set up and start flying, all too often potential RCers are dismayed with the field out of the start up expense only to have something that is incompatable with the mainstream down the road, we feel we've invested x amount of dollars, we expect something that is not an island unto itself.
I also finally got paired up with a quality plane, it's normally flown at 1/4 to 1/2 throttle and have gone even slower then that, I'm amazed it doesn't stall, yet can crank up the power to do some acrobatics, 3rd maiden flight I was doing double loops, hehe. 2 years before, I had the ParkzoneJ3 cub as my first RC plane, if you go that route, you need to insure you have plenty of space, it just didn't last long with what I had, I did mess with the thrust vector planes as well, but my background is more into building free flight versions, both from kits to scratch so it gave me a good understanding as to how it's going to react. Getting a good bird up in the air in reality is different then the sims entirely due to perspective, so the idea here is that even though you can do inverted knife edge loops cutting the grass on the landing pad at your feet in the sim's, you will be thankful for starting out with a slow, 3 channel bird. What the sims do not duplicate are the flaw's of the design, humidity, temperature, wind "gusts" wind currents, prop size, weight distribution, etc. etc. on down toe Murphy's laws which reign absolutely supream on the field at all times. So, use them as a training tool to get used to the interface, but do not think you are going to be able to just go out in the field and duplicate any form of it "without destroying your plane" without it, "mensa people are ommitted, hehe".
Radio, equipment, etc. the moderator guys covered that, I'm liking the compatibility of the GWS flight pack system, sticking with 6 channel receivers in it, but the idea is that everything is there your ARF will be asking for to complete the plane and have it ready to fly. You may only use 2 servo's when you start, you'll be able to use it for more afterwards on another plane. I have a Futaba 4 channel radio, was 135 including receiver, 2 servo's, and charger. It even has the interface I'll be hooking up to my PC eventually for, GWS makes a very good one as well, the idea here, you want something everybody else is familiar with, this gives the manufacturer reason to stock replacement parts as well as focusing upon compatability. I literally took this 135.00 set up, cut up $3.00 worth of foam, added a motor and battery, hot glued it all together and was out flying, be it not well, at least it was a start, and foam is cheap to crash, the radio, receiver and servo's are your main purchase, those can be switched around into a whole fleet of planes.
This is a photo of my butterfly, it required no trim after it was assembled with no modifications necessary so I didn't have to worry about it doing weird things as I launched it, take note, it's a high wing, large wingspan area plane with plenty of "dihedral", the dihedral is that V, or angle the wings are opposed to each other if you look at them from the front, the more there is, the more stable the plane, thus making it easier to handle, so if you turn to hard, letting off on the controls, the dihedral design will balance the plane to a level flight pattern eventually.
Posts: 4
Joined: 3/20/2006 From: , UNITED KINGDOM Status: offline
Hi, just popped back for a look, thanks for the reply, a lot of what you said makes sense. And I like your hi wing plane, especially the see through covering showing all the detail, the ribs in the wings and such, very nice.
I'm going to take a trip to a few shops that have been recommended to me, a small trip but not too far, just to see whats on offer.
I reckon i'm gonna end up with a shock flyer or two out of sheer simplicity, and ease of use, then work my way up to more complicated and detailed models as time and money allow.
I have got my first real trainer now (not electric) and have joined a local club so I can start to learn to fly with an instructor, not just having a go by myself in a quite field.
The only shame is the club, although local for me with a choice of two fields to fly from, hasn't got it's own web forums or anything and has not got a lot of members into electric flight.
But membership allows me to fly locally and includes insurance and license so is a must as I won't be limiting myself to only electric flight.
Electric though, for the sheer simplicity, ease of use and lack of noise pollution will be a far more available option to me most of the time.
Hi All, Well, besides gas aircraft I decided to start into electric flight. The aircraft I bought was the E-flite mini funtana 3D. Also got a motor which is the Himax HA2025, Castle Creations Thunderbird 18 brushless controller, a Poly-Quest 11.1 V 1200m AH battery, the Poly Charge 4 by Great Planes and finally a Spektrim DX6 2.4 GHz DSM radio. Just a question, is all of this stuff a good combination to start flying electric ? What do you all think ? Thanks in advance. Wayne
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All Forums >> Electric Aircraft Universe >> Electric Training >> RE: Good First Planes 
RE: Good First Planes - 
RE: Good First Planes - 
So, use them as a training tool to get used to the interface, but do not think you are going to be able to just go out in the field and duplicate any form of it "without destroying your plane" without it, "mensa people are ommitted, hehe". 
