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All Forums >> TEAM RCU >> TEAM RCU - Chip Hyde! >> Futaba 9Z Tutorial...
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Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/27/2003 2:00:52 AM   
GalenB



Posts: 2012
Joined: 12/5/2001
From: Issaquah, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Chip,

The 9Z is an impressive and complex radio and I was wondering if this forum would be a good place for question and answer tutorial sessions from an expert like you?

TIA for your help!

< Message edited by GalenB -- 12/26/2003 9:01:34 PM >


_____________________________

Cheers!
       Post #: 1

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/28/2003 6:55:40 AM   
Passport1


 

Posts: 719
Joined: 12/7/2002
From: Sierra Vista, AZ, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GalenB

Hi Chip,

The 9Z is an impressive and complex radio and I was wondering if this forum would be a good place for question and answer tutorial sessions from an expert like you?

TIA for your help!

Sure, I would be glad to answer any Q's you or anyone else might have with any Futaba Radio. I will even try to answer Q's about the other brands, but can't make any promises there.

The 9Z is the most user friendly radio I've seen, once the basics with its programming are understood. It also offers the user so many advantages in the form of options and I feel that to be so important because everyones flying style and ability is different.

Fire away

Chip

(in reply to GalenB)
       Post #: 2

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/28/2003 8:09:00 PM   
GalenB



Posts: 2012
Joined: 12/5/2001
From: Issaquah, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Chip,

First question: How does AFR and expo relate to each other? At first glance they appear to do the same thing...

Second: How are dual/triple rates configured? The dual rate menu in the 9Z doesn't look anything like my 8U Super...

Third: Flight conditions... This topic alone would seem like a lengthy, but useful discussion...

TIA for your help!


_____________________________

Cheers!

(in reply to Passport1)
       Post #: 3

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/29/2003 6:11:30 AM   
Passport1


 

Posts: 719
Joined: 12/7/2002
From: Sierra Vista, AZ, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GalenB

Hi Chip,

First question: How does AFR and expo relate to each other? At first glance they appear to do the same thing...

Second: How are dual/triple rates configured? The dual rate menu in the 9Z doesn't look anything like my 8U Super...

Third: Flight conditions... This topic alone would seem like a lengthy, but useful discussion...

TIA for your help!

1. How does AFR and expo relate to each other? They really do not relate to each other at all, they are just located together in the AFR menu. AFR only affects the amount of servo travel. EXPO only lessens or increases the sensitivity of your servos around neutral. It does not have any effect on how far the servo moves, just the way it gets there.

2. How are dual/triple rates configured? Dual rates are simply activated in the dual rate screen. They come factory assigned to certain switches, and are factory set at 70% of your ATV. In order to get the third rate with our current radios, you need to assign and name a flight condition to whatever triple rate switch you want to use and then copy your current default flight condition to it. When you are done with that you can then check this by looking at the top of your TX screen to see if when you flip the switch, the condition name changes. At this point you can then flip the switch so the condition is on and make what change you want to your AFR menus. Say your original setup only had the elev. AFR at 120%, but you wanted a higher rate on the elev just for the spin entry. All you would do is open your AFR menu Select either A or B on the gragh, hold the elevator stick full up and then hit the + key to increase your percentage. Once you have made the desired change, flip the switch back to the middle position and you will see the surface as well as the #'s return to there previous settings.

Flight conditions... Give me a few days to think about the best ways to word this explanation.

Thanks

Chip

(in reply to GalenB)
       Post #: 4

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/29/2003 6:51:10 AM   
GalenB



Posts: 2012
Joined: 12/5/2001
From: Issaquah, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Chip,

Thanks for the answers to my previous questions, and for pondering the flight condition issue more thoroughly... However, I see that I need to clarify my question about AFR and expo... From reading the explanation of AFR in the 9Z manual it says that it affects the operation curve of the servo. To me this is also what expo does as it also effects the operation curve of the servo... The relationship between the stick position and the servo position doesn't change linearly (I know it's not really linear with a rotational servo) when expo is applied. If you graph the servo position versus the stick position when expo is on you'll get a curve with ever increasing slope the more the stick moves... This is what causes the servo to move little around neutral and a lot at full stick deflection... As I write this it has occurred to me that I am making this too complex... Maybe I'm more confused about the differences between AFR and ATV now that you tell me AFR and expo are not related...


_____________________________

Cheers!

(in reply to Passport1)
       Post #: 5

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/29/2003 11:22:13 AM   
Wild Beat


 

Posts: 71
Joined: 9/8/2003
From: ............,
Status: offline 		Chip, another question. I am still not 100% sure when to use AFR onstead of ATV's. would you be able to break it down another step?
Thanks,
Wild Beat.

< Message edited by Wild Beat -- 12/29/2003 11:25:43 AM >

(in reply to GalenB)
       Post #: 6

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/29/2003 1:23:05 PM   
cbk07


 

Posts: 537
Joined: 12/30/2001
From: farmington, CT, USA
Status: offline 		Check out this link http://www.futaba-rc.com/faq/faq-9z.html

Helped me a ton when learning how to program this radio. Craig

(in reply to GalenB)
       Post #: 7

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/29/2003 7:21:28 PM   
YNOT



Posts: 2063
Joined: 11/29/2001
From: Lake Jackson, TX, USA
Status: offline 		AFR blew my mind for a while too. Still not too sure if I am using it for what it is designed for.

I use AFR to set up the exact same amount travel on ailerons and elevators when dual servos are used in two seperate channels. You want them both to move the same amount, in relation to the stick. Not the point of 100 % stick, that is ATV, but at 50% or 30% stick, do you have equal amounts of thown on the surface? It should help make the plane roll at the same speed, left or right. It may only be needed in this type of application. I donno. I can't remeber how sub-trims effects the AFR. (Dual elevator servos, that took many many hours to work out, drove me freakn nuts!)


ATV is the travel limit.

I set up in this order. ATV, AFR, Flaps/Spoilers, D/R, Expo. Or is there a better sequence?

I still need help with conditions. I screwed up an entire model on mine, never did figure it out. Just one model that could not be used.


Question: Anything special to know about a CAMPAC? Or is just plug and play?

_____________________________

YNOT, Snap, Flip & Hover,
Tony D

(in reply to cbk07)
       Post #: 8

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/29/2003 8:52:10 PM   
Sprink



Posts: 2236
Joined: 4/23/2003
From: London, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: YNOT

Question: Anything special to know about a CAMPAC? Or is just plug and play?


Basically plug and play.

However remember that each flight condition effectively uses a model memory in the Campac, so reduces the memory available (eg 16 models with no flight conditions, 2 models with 8 flight conditions on each).

Therefore it is a good idea not to use flight conditions on models stored on the Campac. Put your main models on the 10 transmitter model memories, and use the Campac for everything else (for me it it is used for my simulator models, I don't have that many real models that I need to use it for them.)

_____________________________

"If it doesn't break, it is probably too heavy"

(in reply to YNOT)
       Post #: 9

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/30/2003 2:23:25 AM   
quist



Posts: 1630
Joined: 1/8/2002
From: Glendale, AZ, USA
Status: offline 		One other thing, ATV only changes the servo on that channel. AFR will change also change the servo that is linked to it. Like with dual ailerons or elevators.

Also I have noticed in the past when I change ATV it also changes the center of the servo, AFR does not.

(in reply to Sprink)
       Post #: 10

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/30/2003 4:33:47 AM   
Passport1


 

Posts: 719
Joined: 12/7/2002
From: Sierra Vista, AZ, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: quist

One other thing, ATV only changes the servo on that channel. AFR will change also change the servo that is linked to it. Like with dual ailerons or elevators.

Also I have noticed in the past when I change ATV it also changes the center of the servo, AFR does not.

CORRECT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Chip

(in reply to quist)
       Post #: 11

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/30/2003 4:50:31 AM   
Passport1


 

Posts: 719
Joined: 12/7/2002
From: Sierra Vista, AZ, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wild Beat

Chip, another question. I am still not 100% sure when to use AFR onstead of ATV's. would you be able to break it down another step?
Thanks,
Wild Beat.

ONLY use the ATV to set up even throws in the begining. After you ACT ALV and FLPR use the ATV to make sure you are getting equal travel on those surfaces at that time. It should be no more than a few percent different from channel to channel ie. Elev. CH-2 Gear CH-5 CH-2 should ALWAYS be the right elevator and CH-5 the left. At the most when you command full up with the stick those two seperate ATV's should not vary from 100 % by more then 3 or 4 Percent. If they do you have something wrong mechanically and this is when it needs to be corrected.

Anytime you want to make any changes to your travel on High rate use AFR, not ATV. ATV will effect everything. YOU DO NOT WANT THAT.

Also make sure you ALWAYS plug the RIGHT ail. into channel 2 and the LEFT one into 6 or 7. This is the way it has to be for everything to work as designed in the TX. Trust me.

If you are still unclear, email me through my site and I will give you my #. Just start fresh with a new model, it will take 5 minutes over the phone and we'll run through together.

Chip

(in reply to Wild Beat)
       Post #: 12

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/30/2003 5:06:16 AM   
Passport1


 

Posts: 719
Joined: 12/7/2002
From: Sierra Vista, AZ, USA
Status: offline 		As I write this it has occurred to me that I am making this too complex... Maybe I'm more confused about the differences between AFR and ATV now that you tell me AFR and expo are not related...
[/quote]
Stop reading the manuel for a couple of days, would ya. <lol> Just kidding.


Lets say for example, you have your new plane all set up in your P-MIX menus to do a perfect knife edge as well as
your dual rates set just right.That took 5% up elevator with left rudder and 60% on your Dual Rate toaccomplish

Alright, now you need to get some more rate on your High rate Elev. to get the proper spin entry. There's 2 ways to do this 1 being ATV. So you change the Elev. ATV from 100 to 140and that gives you the Elevator throw you are looking for. What else just happened? Let me know.

(in reply to GalenB)
       Post #: 13

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/31/2003 6:25:27 AM   
GalenB



Posts: 2012
Joined: 12/5/2001
From: Issaquah, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Next question...

I've been flying my 29% Edge with my new 9Z. It is all trimmed out and flying well. Tonight I pressed the TRM button and saw that I could save the trim. Do I need to do this? On my 8U Super the trims were always where I left them -- is this not the case with the 9Z? I don't want to switch model memories in my 9Z as I am afraid I will lose my trims settings...

TIA for your help!


_____________________________

Cheers!

(in reply to Passport1)
       Post #: 14

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/31/2003 12:55:22 PM   
Wild Beat


 

Posts: 71
Joined: 9/8/2003
From: ............,
Status: offline 		Thanks For the offer chip. I'll spend some time with the radio and the plane and see if I get it. If not I might take you up on your offer.
Thanks!
Wild beat.

(in reply to GalenB)
       Post #: 15

RE: Futaba 9Z Tutorial... - 12/31/2003 3:46:20 PM