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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 5:18 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Some Pictures...

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 5:22 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 5:25 AM   
bignasdy



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From: TX
Status: offline 		looks like that bulckhead is inverted...just sayin. .....


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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 5:28 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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Status: offline 		And Even More Pictures!...

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 9:28 AM   
FilPilot



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From: Haymarket, VA, USA
Status: offline 		Very nice! clean work....thanks for posting ....  

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 1:19 PM   
speed lover


 

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From: , UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		Nexus that looks great nice work that engine looks great too like how you have put the exhaust inside that must have took awhile to plan out. You have just made it hard for me now I had dropped te idea of one of these and stated looking at the Kyosho Kelly F1 now I don't know what to do. I was going to use a V twin 4 stroke I've got a 150 and a 200 V twin but I think the 200 would be over the top and would not give me speed anyway and the 150 not enough. What kind of weight does this thing come out at?

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 3:08 PM   
twinbrother


 

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From: Sherman Oaks, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Nexus, I think I'm the one who bought your spare Rare Bear back in December.  I thought you would be done with that thing by now. 

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/23/2011 8:34 PM   
Easystern



Posts: 131
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Last Login: 5/13/2013
From: Bonn/Germany Ft Lauderdale/FL, AB, GERMANY
Status: offline 		uh nice..... some be loved TT rare bears are still around

hey nexusdc5 very nice build rare bear, i like the bvm set up
let us know how fast it flys

think about the engine loves 10x10 carbon fibre props at 22000+ and the bear has a big bally to hide a small prop ,larger props will heat up the engine a lot.
cooling will be eveything , also for the bvm tuned pipe .
if it gets very hot by an 13x8 you risk a dead stick , be carefull.... safe your nice work and the bear

my bear is waiting for a year now to get maiden with 180 saito with all the modding to fuselarge and wings/stab
and i am still nervous !!!!






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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/24/2011 6:12 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Hello Easystern, Thanks, Its been a fun build so far... I will be Breaking in the engine on the ground with a 11x11 Apc... Then I will Fly it with a 12x12 and see how it likes it and start from there... I will be glassing the Pipe to keep the heat down in the fuse. Ill get some special Header wrap and nicely wrap the pipe, it will run cool in the fuse.

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/24/2011 6:18 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Hey Twin Brother... Hows it going? Have you Finished your Bear yet? Yes Its been a wile but I haven't been spending all my time on the bear, I'm not in a hurry, I have another Project going at the same time. I'm building the Carf Models Gee Bee, Just got it back from the Painter and Starting the build on it... I'm installing the Moki 250... Its going to be awesome! Anyways.... I'm in no hurry with the bear. Just want it safe and Fast.... I'm taking my time with it.

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/24/2011 6:45 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Hey SpeedLover... Yes It took a little Planning but I knew what I wanted to do and I stuck with it and made it happen. First I mounted a OS 91 Fan engine but wasnt happy with it... So I took it back and thought ... Why not go Balls out with the Best Fan Engine Available! So I did... This isn't just a standard BVM 91, This Is the BVM 91 speed... It is Faster than the Ordinary Stock Version... With that being said, I know I had alot of work to do to the rest of the Air frame To with stand this engine Combo... Also I could have Drilled the Ventury opening all the way through the firewall but Decided to Build a reverse Cone Creating a Forced Air intake... Almost like a super charger. But cheaper and very affective. I chose this combo because I wanted to go fast and still keep the air frame as light as possible. I though about going with a four stroke Engine but was Hell bent on Speed... So this combo while yes... The 91 has a little weight to it, Isnt Close to what some of the larger Four Strokes are weighing in at... If you will notice in the fuse I have been Strategically installing my components in the fuse so that the Air craft will balance out perfectly with out adding nose or tail weight. So Far its working out Perfectly. This Engine is going to be Very thirsty though, If I had stayed with a single 12 oz tank I would be lucky to get 5 Min flight, So I added Two Sister tanks adding another 12 oz making it 24 oz... This will be just long enough to get my knees shaking! Anyways... As soon as I can I will weigh the Craft and let you know what its coming out at right now... The fuse as is still doesn't feel very heavy. We will see soon enough.

Vince...

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/24/2011 10:12 AM   
Easystern



Posts: 131
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From: Bonn/Germany Ft Lauderdale/FL, AB, GERMANY
Status: offline 		Header Wrap !! thats an good idear !!

i have glassed a tuned pipe tunnel for my sundowner ,just round foam from pipe isolation as a mold, couple of glas and epoxy around
and it was done to keep the heat out of the fuse.

some bears did make 150 + with 180 saitos
you must be faster with the bvm

what is done to the bvm to make it the speed version ? special liner/piston from specialtys ?

the 170 YS supercharged 4 stroke is my favorit for the bear
i the meantime , i fly my robbe little fast foamie rare bear .........


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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 6/24/2011 6:28 PM   
twinbrother


 

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From: Sherman Oaks, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Nexus, not done with my Bare yet.  I'm in the process of painting the wings.  Did all the reinforcing, now just need to do the painting.  Will probably be a few months before it's all done.  I'm excited to finish it though. 


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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/7/2011 10:14 PM   
SJN



Posts: 5784
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From: Copenhagen, DENMARK
Status: online 		Hey guys, any updates ?

I just ordered one of these, and would like to know if anyone that has installed the servos in the stabilizer itself, has had any flutter problems ?

I have used a few hours reading this thread, and serching google for info, and my conclusion for the flutter and exploding stabs are the internal metal wire elevator torque rods are not up to the job.

I will deffinatly install 2 mini servos in the stabilzer, and seal the gap between the stab and elevator hinge.
Will have to live with a little more lead in the nose to compensate for the extra weight in the tail.

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/8/2011 2:14 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Hey SJN... Yes, Very good Idea installing your servos in the rear wings. That's what I did and they turned out very nice. with that and sealing the hing gap should take care of the Problem. Also don't forget to beef up your rear Wing tubes. I still wouldn't trust the upgraded tubes they provided in these kits. I haven't flown mine yet but still looking forward to the day. Just not finished with it yet.

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/8/2011 2:27 AM   
SJN



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Status: online 		Your setup is extremly nice nexusdc5, and the servo install you did looks great.

I also thought of removing a few mm of material from the trailing edge of the elevator, to get a nice fat squared off trailing edge.
This also delays flutter, and shortening the cord of the elevator will make it a little less sensitive.


I saw on RCG an electric RB which also had the servos in the stab for many flights before he sold the plane.........so at least he did not lose it due to flutter
Here are the pictures I found of his install:

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/8/2011 2:37 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		hey SJN, Glad to hear he didn't have any problems with his install. That's Encouraging! :-) Ill Post some in depth pictures during my tail section build for you.

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/8/2011 2:44 AM   
SJN



Posts: 5784
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Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Copenhagen, DENMARK
Status: online 		Looking forward to the pictures........cant wait untill mine arrives

Ive got a ASP 120 4 stroke for mine, so it wont be a screamer like yours


Are the mechanical retracts included in the kit ?

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/8/2011 2:46 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Yes They Are... Pictures are on their way...

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/8/2011 2:57 AM   
nexusdc5


 

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From: Orange, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Notice in the last set of Pictures how short the Wing joining tubes were before I replaced then with longer and stronger wing tubes.

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 12/8/2011 3:12 AM   
SJN



Posts: 5784
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Last Login: 5/19/2013
From: Copenhagen, DENMARK
Status: online 		looking good.

I will leave the stabs the way they are, unless I can feel the the skin has not been bonded correctly to the ribs.

Looking at all the info in this thread, I can see the stabs have been beefed up, and someone even made them massive, and used heavy duty arrow shafts.....and even then, flutter just disintegrated the tail.
I saw another on RCG where he first used the stock wooden elevator pushrod, and it snapped during flutter, and luckily he got it repaired after the crash.
He then installed 2 elevator servos, and carbon rods still connected to the stock metal torque rods, and a few flights later it fluttered again, and the whole wooden servo box structure had been torn out.....it take lots of force to rip it all apart.

Im pretty sure installing the servos in the tail with direct short linkages will solve the problem..........in time we shall see

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 1/30/2012 10:34 AM   
marretta87


 

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From: geelongvictoria, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		hay guys i wanna no do i have to balance this modle inverted or upright cheers



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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 1/31/2012 2:01 AM   
52jaws



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From: Tulare, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Low wing....always inverted for pendelum effect....opposite for high wings
Paul

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 2/19/2012 7:41 PM   
Cougar429


 

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From: Tecumseh, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		I have been slowly making my way through this thread for a while and was surprised to see in the last page or so the much more current post dates.

I've been building mine now since early Sept 2011 and wish I would have noticed the bits about the tail tubes earlier. I did pull the lower skins due to water damage, (the previous owner(s) had not stored it in the best location). I Gorilla Glued in the large scale pin style elevator hinges and glass clothed the entire tails with EZCote.

This is not my first build by a long shot and even before reading of the control failures had tossed the stock hardware in favor of stuff that fit my comfort and reliability scale a lot better. I have a penchant for modding and have to say this plane is custom made for that.

Working back to front, basically the same as the build, here is a list of some of the changes. Many were made before I found this thread, so I feel I was at least partially on the right track.

1) Elevator servo moved to a new plate aft of the rear bulkhead with dual 4/40 ball links and rods. There is virtually no play in the elevators, but I plan to seal the hinge gap before flying.

2) Made an entirely new rudder Pull/Pull system with the adjusters up front near the servo wheel. The setup has a ball link tension setup to relieve the servo output bearings. I threw out the brass lower rudder pivot and installed one from composite. I try to avoid any metal/metal contact if it can be avoided.

3) Completely custom receiver and power distribution mount with isolators to help dampen the vibrations. Need to run the plane to check to see if the solid engine mount will cause problems, (more on that in a bit)

4) Custom power distribution center with a separate switch and charge port for the 2S LiFE system supply and the 4 cell NiMH pack stuffed above the engine is exclusive to the Rx.

5) I never did go with the mechanical retracts as the mere thought of connecting and disconnecting linkages every session was ridiculous. I originally had RCLANDER electrics mounted, but am waiting for a pair of EFlite 60-120's and will rebuild the mounts again once I have dimensions. The R/L could not tuck the wheels far enough into the wells.

With no central servo I was able to fit the 2S LiFE pack in the tank location and lift the tank in line with the carb. I had the option of adding a pump. Hate the idea of more connections, etc. unless the advantage outweighs the complexity. It was easier to keep it simple. I dropped the tank capacity to 12oz. I run this size in the Skybolt and at the end of my normal 9-10 minutes of honking I still have 1/2 tank or more on landing. I will start conservatively in any event to check battery capacity so will be able to gauge fuel consumption as well.

6) On that note I have a pair of modded Robart struts and since I predominantly fly off grass opted to go away from scale and move the scissors to the trailing edge.

7) The cockpit and canopy are self contained and quick release to allow access to the switches, battery status indicators and remote glow. It was a **** to build and work through the rather small cockpit and firewall openings. The leading edge of the canopy frame are fitted with 3 C/F rods and the back locks down with a pair of homemade spring latches. I wish I could take credit for the idea itself, but I use whatever I can and my friends turbine jets use a similar setup. I hope that works just as well on my Nitro Planes Seawind as the canopy on that one is very thin plastic and held down with a plethora of screws.

8) I originally tried to fit the Saito 125a into the stock isolator mount, but it just would not work very well. I opted for a composite mount that I hope has enough damping. I have a Graupner 14/8 3-blade. Unfortunately it did not fit the spinner at all and after some hacking I though it looked a bit ugly. For now I have a 2 blade wood prop for first run and break in to be replaced with a composite prop for first flights.

9) The cowl is fit with a sim radial with my stock custom ducting to direct cooling air over the motor. Learned the hard way on my Saito powered Skybolt that I need to follow the exact same rules and methods we do with full size aircraft. After a dozen or so setup and test flights the 'Bolt did not finish the first run with the cowl on before the motor seized from overheating. The ducting has worked perfectly now for close to 250 flights on that one and worked just as well on my OS FS91S powered Harvard.

I will post some pics shortly, but for now I will agree with many in that this plane fell well short in design, materials and construction, to the point nearly ALL my kits required less effort to get to where I could feel I trust them. The first sign of trouble was when I removed the wing servo pods. The wood simply fell to pieces in my hands, none of the glue joints holding at all. At least they use UltraCote White. That is one of my standards, so have lots in stock.

I had quite a bit of trouble with Slimline. Getting the rather unique adapter for the 125a proved to be a **** with 4 tries and 4 months timespan to finally arrive. The muffler is finally mounted and cowl cut to fit. Oh yeah, I don't know if they had a different supplier for the fuselage and canopy, but the paint simply pulls off the cowl even removing high grade masking tape.

_____________________________

Club Saito Member # 787
FA91, 100, 2 X 125a, 150

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RE: ThunderTiger Rare Bear - 2/20/2012 2:29 AM   
Cougar429


 

Posts: 675
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Last Login: 5/17/2013
From: Tecumseh, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		As promised, here are some pics. I don't have any really detailed of the tail servo installation. That will have to wait till the tailwheel cover is off again.

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Club Saito Member # 787
FA91, 100, 2 X 125a, 150

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