Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin!  
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    • All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> RC Jets >> Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin!
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    Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/15/2004 5:48:45 PM   
    YellowAircraft



    Posts: 3125
    Joined: 1/5/2002
    From: San Diego, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		So......

    I just called Yellow Freight to track my package, and they say that my new kit is gonna be delivered on Tuesday! At the same time, I had one shipped out to a customer (he'll get his on Thursday) who's gonna do a simultaneous build. Since the last time I built one of these beasts, a lot has changed in terms of the kit and in terms of my supplies and techniques (thank God for Hysol). My first one was put together with nothing but Stabilit (lotta work....), but this one will go together with AUW in mind. Unlike the first one, this one will be for twin turbine installation. Thanks for the inspiration Joe and Buck!

    _____________________________

    Yellow Aircraft, JetCat Engines, Skymaster ARF+ and Turn Key Jets
    www.cyctheatre.com
           Post #: 1

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/15/2004 5:57:04 PM   
    grbaker



    Posts: 2440
    Joined: 12/12/2001
    From: La Porte (near Houston), TX, USA
    Status: online     		Good luck with the build Shaun. The new kit is really nice. See if you can come out as light as Bucks bug.

    _____________________________

    Gary Baker

    (in reply to YellowAircraft)
           Post #: 2

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/15/2004 6:57:02 PM   
    YellowAircraft



    Posts: 3125
    Joined: 1/5/2002
    From: San Diego, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		Gary,

    I'm sure I'll be able to get the airframe wieght down that low, but I'm not sure if the twin installation is gonna be much heavier or not than the single Olympus. We'll see! I'm really excited about it. I'm looking forward to installing the hydraulics on the main gear. We'll see if I can get away with it leak-proof or not.

    _____________________________

    Yellow Aircraft, JetCat Engines, Skymaster ARF+ and Turn Key Jets
    www.cyctheatre.com

    (in reply to grbaker)
           Post #: 3

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 1:24:13 AM   
    yeahbaby



    Posts: 2506
    Joined: 12/7/2001
    From: FT Worth, TX, USA
    Status: offline     		Shaun

    I have no doubt that with the sole use of Aeropoxy as a bonding agent the bird will be light. should be a fantastic flyer with twin 120s or 160s.

    if you want documentation just give a heads up and we can do a walk around over a weekend.

    good luck

    buck

    (in reply to YellowAircraft)
           Post #: 4

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 2:38:55 AM   
    KFalcon



    Posts: 3267
    Joined: 11/9/2002
    From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		I'm just wondering why mine is going to be here two days after yours!?

    I have waited by the door patiently for a few planes... (Except the time I paid almost $400 for express delivery on my Yellow F-18 single) But I am having a real hard time waiting for the Twin to get here! I asked and express was not an option on it because it is so big, it has to come by Diesel Truck!

    I have always loved the Hornet and always wanted to build a twin. I bought a bigger work bench for the shop because from what I here the plane is HUGE! Yes that is right, the first time I will ever see the twin Hornet will be when I open the box on my new kit!

    Thanks Shaun for being a bro, and for being so patient with all of the calls. Can't wait to start!

    Buck, I will be strapping the hornet to the top of the Piper and heading your way for some fun soon!

    _____________________________

    Kenny Falconer - California Jets - April 3-6, 2008
    www.ca-jets.com

    (in reply to yeahbaby)
           Post #: 5

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 3:06:52 AM   
    YellowAircraft



    Posts: 3125
    Joined: 1/5/2002
    From: San Diego, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		Well,

    The new kit has some refinements that will help ease up the workload a bit. The one I'm most excited about is the use of carbon under the wing and tail skins. Not because the wings and tails weren't strong enough before, but because now I'm not gonna have to carve-and-sand-to-shape the balsa blocks that capture the stabilator shafts to mate up with the balsa stab sheeting. It was a pain because those balsa blocks are pretty hard balsa while the sheeting is just sheeting. On the new stabs, one has only to get the block good enough to fit in there pretty well, then glue it.

    It's possible that this bird may end up being powered by two P-80+ engines. My thought is that with the omission of that windsock (oops, I mean single inlet) up front, the frontal airframe drag will be reduced substantially. Also, my understanding is that losses are much less with straight pipes than with split pipes.


    Thoughts?

    _____________________________

    Yellow Aircraft, JetCat Engines, Skymaster ARF+ and Turn Key Jets
    www.cyctheatre.com

    (in reply to KFalcon)
           Post #: 6

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 3:56:28 AM   
    KFalcon



    Posts: 3267
    Joined: 11/9/2002
    From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		I looked at the different turbine manufactures websites, this is what they say:

    Olympus 42.7 lb thrust
    5.3 lbs engine
    6.9lbs complete setup


    P200 45 lb thrust
    5 lbs engine only????

    P120 27 lb thrust 2 P120s= 54 lb thrust
    3.1 lbs engine only???? 2 P120s= 6.2lbs

    P-80 19 lb thrust 2 P80s= 38 lb thrust
    2.9 lbs engine only???? 2 P80s= 5.8 lbs


    I don't know what the P80+ puts out for thrust or if the weight cahanges any. Does anyone else know?

    I will probably go with 2 P120s. It will be a pound or so heavier than the single, but I should make that up with the 14 extra lbs of thrust. Does anyone know how much thrust is lost in a split pipe compared to a split pipe? I normally don't fly from an AMA field so I will leave the turbines turned up until I fly at one.

    What do you guys think?

    _____________________________

    Kenny Falconer - California Jets - April 3-6, 2008
    www.ca-jets.com

    (in reply to YellowAircraft)
           Post #: 7

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 4:14:22 AM   
    mr_matt



    Posts: 6631
    Joined: 12/7/2001
    From: Oak Park, CA,
    Status: offline     		P-80 is less fuel efficient. P-120 is a better choice.

    Question is how much fuel you can carry?

    The only twin I have personally seen close up is Tommy Woods, and I heard it is so close to hitting the weight limit he cannot ad any more details and may not be able to completely fill the tanks.

    If you carry 100 ounces for each turbine, that is 200 ounces total,. That fuel will weight about 10 pounds, maybe a little more.

    The weight police are in full force now so you have to be careful.

    _____________________________

    Matt
    JetCat rep

    (in reply to KFalcon)
           Post #: 8

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 5:12:54 AM   
    yeahbaby



    Posts: 2506
    Joined: 12/7/2001
    From: FT Worth, TX, USA
    Status: offline     		Most guys fly the Olly at 112k which is probably closer to 45lb if not more. just a guess.

    removing the windsock is probably going to help as well as the straight pipes but how did Wood's mount his engines?

    Kenny/Shaun definitely give a shout when that Hog takes to the sky. The flight performance is going to be breathtaking!!! I can still remember Wood's wringing out his Hornet @ Superman years ago. double Schwing!!

    good luck with the projects fellas, flyin's easy.

    c'ya

    buck

    (in reply to mr_matt)
           Post #: 9

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 7:50:18 AM   
    Rider-60



    Posts: 649
    Joined: 10/27/2002
    From: Chevrieres, FRANCE
    Status: offline     		I believe that the way to go is with a twin Wren supersport when they will be released. They produce 18 lbs of thrust each, they are fuel efficient and the installed weight is barely more than the original dynamax set up. You don't need to engineer the internals too and the projected weight is in the 28 lbs area. In the jet hobby we often forget that "the lighter the better".....we rather think "the higher thrust the better" with all induced troubles ...A 28lbs pound Hornet with 36lbs thrust should replicate the full scale flight I believe!!! and you also have the safety of twin engine op...well this the way I'll build mine!

    (in reply to yeahbaby)
           Post #: 10

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 8:18:08 AM   
    YellowAircraft



    Posts: 3125
    Joined: 1/5/2002
    From: San Diego, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		Matt,

    Good point about the weight. From what I understand, Tommy's twin is probably a little heavier than I anticipate mine will be. I understand about the 120s being a better setup, also. We'll see what happens.

    Rider,

    Sounds good, but my jury is gonna be out for a loooooong time on those engines. Not that I have any negative info on them, but I'm still a little gun-shy on the small engines. With an investment like this, I'm gonna go for the reliability thing more than anything else.

    Keep the ideas coming......
    Thanks!

    _____________________________

    Yellow Aircraft, JetCat Engines, Skymaster ARF+ and Turn Key Jets
    www.cyctheatre.com

    (in reply to Rider-60)
           Post #: 11

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 8:38:15 AM   
    KFalcon



    Posts: 3267
    Joined: 11/9/2002
    From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
    Status: offline
    quote:

    ORIGINAL: YellowAircraft

    With an investment like this, I'm gonna go for the reliability thing more than anything else.

    Keep the ideas coming......
    Thanks!



    I second that.

    Is it Thursday yet??!!

    _____________________________

    Kenny Falconer - California Jets - April 3-6, 2008
    www.ca-jets.com

    (in reply to YellowAircraft)
           Post #: 12

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 8:40:34 AM   
    KFalcon



    Posts: 3267
    Joined: 11/9/2002
    From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		Shaun,

    How much do you think the Hornet will weigh with out motors and fuel?

    Do you think it is possible to build one that comes in under 35lbs dry with the twin set up?

    Rider60,

    The Wren website doesn't have the weight for the Supersport, but the regular wren 54-3 comes in at 2.2 lbs. They say the increase in thrust is due to higher temperatures and higher casing pressure. They strengthened the casing walls to allow this so I would imagine that had to increase the weight slightly. At 2.2-2.5 lbs each you will save 1.2-1.8 lbs by not getting the P-120s. I have a P-120 in my Rookie, the plane holds 98 oz and my timer is set for 9 min with plenty of reserve. Granted my average RPM during flight is 83,000, but will it be much higher with 2 in a Hornet? I would be totally happy with 5-6 minute flight times. Will 2 Wrens burn more fuel wide open than 2 P-120 at 66%?

    < Message edited by KFalcon -- 5/16/2004 1:08:07 AM >

    _____________________________

    Kenny Falconer - California Jets - April 3-6, 2008
    www.ca-jets.com

    (in reply to KFalcon)
           Post #: 13

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 11:42:02 AM   
    YellowAircraft



    Posts: 3125
    Joined: 1/5/2002
    From: San Diego, CA, USA
    Status: offline     		Kenny,


    Forgive me, but I'm still trippin' on the fact that you're a fellow Private Pilot.......

    < Message edited by YellowAircraft -- 5/16/2004 3:42:48 AM >

    _____________________________

    Yellow Aircraft, JetCat Engines, Skymaster ARF+ and Turn Key Jets
    www.cyctheatre.com

    (in reply to KFalcon)
           Post #: 14

    RE: Yellow Aircraft F/A-18 Twin! - 5/16/2004 3:24:02 PM