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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/20/2007 12:13:03 AM   
w8ye



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< Message edited by w8ye -- 12/20/2007 12:14:43 AM >

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/20/2007 1:25:31 AM   
linkadrip



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From: Tehachapi, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Well then there just an organization to insure the parmecutical products are safe and of premium quality for human consumtion. I asked the pharmicist at rite aid if the castor oil was degummed he gave me a funny look like i was an alien. I told him i was going to use it in Aircraft fuel another wacky look like i was crazy. So i specified in RC aircraft fuel, it has to be degummed or it will clog up the engine.

He asked why would you want to run that stuff through a model engine. i told him to help lubricated it so it don't burn it up under lean conditions. it leaves a film on the internal working components, he never heard of such a thing i was shocked. doesn't a pharmistist have to got school for a long time. I figured that somewere in there studies they would understand that castor oil is used for alot of different things other then making you crap all over the place. it not just a laxitive

Anyway it cost to much at the Drug store. Have to hit the motorcycle shops see if they got it hate to order it with the shipping being so high on everything now days.

Castor oil was the preferred lubricant for the early aviation powerplant design known as the rotary engine, such as the Gnome engines used in pre-World War I "pioneer aircraft", after that engine's widespread adoption for aviation in Europe in 1909, and was used almost universally by the rotary engines in World War I Allied aircraft.

Amog other things it's used in cosmetics and several other industrial applications. and was also Use as a means of intimidation in Fascist Italy.

In Fascist Italy under the regime of Benito Mussolini, castor oil was one of the tools of the blackshirts. Political dissidents were force-fed large quantities of castor oil by Fascist paramilitary groups. This technique was said to have been originated by Gabriele D'Annunzio. Victims of this treatment would experience severe diarrhea and dehydration, often resulting in death.

Sometimes when the blackshirts wished to make sure that the victim would die rather than simply be badly disabled, they would mix gasoline with the castor oil.

Imagine what the pharmistist would have thought if i would have told him that then he woulrd have thought i was a real nut lol.





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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/20/2007 1:45:55 AM   
Flyboy Dave



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From: San Bernardino County, CA, USA
Status: offline 		I just happened to buy a 6 oz. bottle of medicinal castor yesterday at Rite-Aid
for 5 bucks, plus tax....pretty steep price.

I'm using it for castor packs on my elbow.

It says that is is odorless and tasteless....there is a faint smell....

....but I'm not gonna drink any !!!

FBD.

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/20/2007 2:08:28 AM   
blw



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Status: offline 		A lot of the pharmacist degree program is chemistry. They probably don't encounter too many human bodies reaching temps approaching those of engines, so they don't relate to us.

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/20/2007 9:49:39 AM   
proptop



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"Amog other things it's used in cosmetics and several other industrial applications. and was also Use as a means of intimidation in Fascist Italy.

In Fascist Italy under the regime of Benito Mussolini, castor oil was one of the tools of the blackshirts. Political dissidents were force-fed large quantities of castor oil by Fascist paramilitary groups. This technique was said to have been originated by Gabriele D'Annunzio. Victims of this treatment would experience severe diarrhea and dehydration, often resulting in death.

Sometimes when the blackshirts wished to make sure that the victim would die rather than simply be badly disabled, they would mix gasoline with the castor oil.

Imagine what the pharmistist would have thought if i would have told him that then he woulrd have thought i was a real nut lol."

--------------------------------------------------------------

Hey...a lot of people already think we're nuts for playing with "toy" airplanes, so don't let that stop ya

Anyway...I picked up a Qt. of Morgan's Castor last week at my LHS for $8.99

< Message edited by proptop -- 12/20/2007 1:26:14 PM >

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 4:03:48 AM   
gkamysz


 

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This thread has some interesting information about a gasoline conversion of a .40 and .51 glow engine running on synthetic oil at 6%. Even with the increased temperatures this seems to be working out. Now that's running half or less the fuel mixture per stroke as compared to methanol, much less than half of the oil per stroke. While that seems extremely light on oil, only time will tell if this arrangement will lead to an unscheduled visit to the autopsy table.

I just received a book which has some interesting comments about castor and synthetic in two stroke motorcycle engines. If anyone out there has a copy of A. Graham Bell's Two Stroke Performance Tuning take a look at the chapter on lubrication.

< Message edited by gkamysz -- 12/24/2007 4:04:31 AM >

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 4:20:37 AM   
skiman762



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Status: offline 		I think Gasoline has some lubricating properties that Methonal doesn't which helps the overall process I would think the bushed conrod would be the weak link

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 2:06:26 PM   
Flyboy Dave



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Status: offline 		I'm not totally sold on the idea of "gummed" or "degummed" castor oil. The sites that
deal with the production of castor make no mention or distinction. I see commercial
users of the oil stating that their oil is de-gummed, but I wonder who de-gummed it....
what exactly is the "gum", how they modified the oil, and what happened to the "gum" ?

Also, I have read on our boards about the "first press" castor. It has been said over and
over that this first press castor oil is used in our model fuels. The castor oil manufactures
state the fisrt press castor is used for medicinal purposes.

The succeeding presses of the castor use steam and solvents to extract the remaining oils.
These later "presses" are used for machinery and lubricating agents, as well as a host of
other commercial endevours.

Here is some interesting info about castor oil. Can your synthetic oils do this ?

http://www.y2khealthanddetox.com/newsletter1-4.html

FBD.



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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 2:19:24 PM   
asmund


 

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From: Floroe, NORWAY
Status: offline 		I think it is not only synthetics that are better here in Europe, but also Castor oil. We have used alot of castor fuel around here until the last years and I have never ever seen an engine full of carbon deposits like I have seen posted here on RCU. No need to open an engine to clean it out. The "flaking" of castoroil in fuel during winter I have never experienced either despite temps in the -7 Celsius range. I guess there are atleast different grades of purity of Castor oil out there.

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 2:40:05 PM   
Flyboy Dave



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Status: offline 		I think there is but one grade of medicinal castor from the manufacturer, and three
grades of second and later presses of industrial castor.

I ran a ringed OS 60 FSR for 15 years until it had no compression what so ever. When I
took off the ring, although worn out, was free....not stuck. I removed it with my
fingernail from the piston. I figured it was stuck from all that castor, and all that use.
I was wrong....it was as free as could be.

In all the years I ran straight castor in my racing motorcycle engines I never stuck a ring
or had any carbon build up worth mentioning. I think if the engine is run at the proper
temperature, even though it is running in extreme, hard use....the carbon residue is
minimized.

I have often read about the evils of the castor/carbon in the engines, but I have never
seen it. I've certainly used my share of castor in my lifetime.

FBD.

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An engineer says.... "That won''t work".
A mechanic says..."Oh yeah, watch this".
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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 4:04:32 PM   
jaka


 

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Status: offline 		Hello!
Asmund ! I can assure you that the quality of Castor oil we have over here in Europe is the same the "Yanks" are using. Castrol M is used over here in Sweden for instance.
Also the carbon build up is excessive if you (ie. pylon racing) take out max power (lots of heat) from an engine,both standard .40 engines and racing engines.
For instance...The engines we use in our standard Q-500 pylon racing class over here are all run on 80/20 FAI fuel, using 10x6 plastic props and these engines are full of black carbon deposits on both the piston top, sides and on the inner surface of the combustion chamber after just one year of usage.

Running one of these .40 engines on 15% all syntetic oil ...and you can not see a trace of any wear and certainly not any carbon deposits.

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 4:47:32 PM   
gkamysz


 

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Status: online 		Degumming is a real process that is done to many vegetable oils.

http://www.pennwalt.com/vegetable.html#

http://72.14.205.104/u/washingtonstateuniversity?q=cache:i1_dlFDaOXMJ:www.wsu.edu/~gmhyde/433_web_pages/433Oil-web-pages/Processing/Process-Edible%26Essence_Oil.html+degumming&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&ie=UTF-8

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/24/2007 10:06:28 PM   
downunder



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From: Adelaide, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		Virtually all the world's castor comes from India and all castor is degummed as part of the refining process so anything else is pure advertising hype. First pressing is when the fresh bean is passed through a machine to squeeze out as much oil as possible (around 80% or thereabouts from memory). The ground up husks are collected and passed through a second machine to squeeze out most of the remaining oil (around another 10-15%). That's second pressing. The remaining 5-10% can't be squeezed out so chemicals are used to seperate it from the husks. This chemically collected oil is sometimes added to the second pressing oil but a fraction of the chemicals used (xylene is one of them) remains in the oil and causes white flakes when it gets very cold. I've never seen white flakes in Castol M even after I've cooled it way down in my freezer.

I don't know for certain but I'd doubt that chemically extracted oil would be used in medicinal grade castor so it'd be second pressing but with added refining and testing to be certain it doesn't contain any trace of ricin which is one of the world's deadliest poisons and comes from the bean husk. A sweetener may be added to it though to make it more palatable which is fine for a stomach but I'm not so sure how an engine might react to it . Merco instructions specifically warn against using medicinal castor though.


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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/25/2007 12:47:06 AM   
Sport_Pilot



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From: Acworth, GA, USA
Status: offline 		The Bakers A grade castor has some gum in it. It gives it a slightly green color. Bakers AA isn't exactly degummed, its just that the first pressing, doesn't have any gum to begin with. The term degummed is a marketing gimmic, because the gum isn't what makes our engines freeze up from the congealed castor.

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 12/25/2007 6:14:21 AM   
Flyboy Dave



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From: San Bernardino County, CA, USA
Status: offline 		....well, I've looked at some Internet info on "de-gummed castor oil", and I don't see
anything that has to do with anything that has to do with actual "degumming" of
castor seeds, that has anything to do with the oil used in aero-model fuel.

Maybe I missed something.