RE: Castor oil - A final word?  
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All Forums >> Glow Engines, Gas Engines, Fuel & Mfg Support Forums >> Glow Engines >> RE: Castor oil - A final word?
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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/2/2008 12:27:41 PM   
Flyboy Dave



Posts: 13468
Joined: 3/20/2002
From: San Bernardino County, CA, USA
Status: online
......great post, fiery....

Every now and then it's a good idea to take a look back, as well as a look forward to
make sure we are on the right path. The start of this new years is a good time to
think about what you have said. I'm going to take a moment to post my thoughts on
the subject because it is becoming more and more important to me personally.

I have an automatic disconnect with posters when responses turn to gunslinging, like
in the ol' West. By that I mean there will always be a young gun, trying to take down
the sheriff....for the purpose of furthering his reputation, and of course getting another
notch on his gun.

I see this when a guy starts quoting everything I say, one sentence at a time, and then
trying his darndest to find fault with it. I get this all the time. You will see this on just about
any and every message board on the Internet....verbal gunslinging.

When someone tries to discredit every word someone says, it sticks put like a sore thumb.
You also see this at a class or technical seminar. There is always that one guy that wants to
pretend that he knows something the instructor doesn't know, and interrupts the class to make
his pretentious point, strictly for his own ego gratification. There's always that one guy. The wise
instructor will usually "pass" on the objection, offering perhaps to discuss it after class. A great
way to avoid (ignore) the distraction.

I do the same thing. For one thing, my posting time is limited due in part to moderating chores,
which are reading posts until my eyeballs ache every day. And secondly, when I see someone
attempting to argue about every word I say....I picture the young gun, or the "class expert" in
the training seminar. I avoid these guys like the plague.

The reason ? Wasting time.

Like in the example given on the last page....when you do try to explain something, you get accused
of "preaching". The fact of the matter is....I will go way out of my way to help someone with a question
about something. I take the time to take pictures and post them to illustrate things. A picture is
worth a thousand words, right ?

What I will not do, is try to defend every word I say to these naysayers. More often than not these
guys dig information from the Internet only moments before, then throw it in your face, like you
missed something, or they know something you don't know....and it must be brought to your immediate
attention.

Over the years we lose a lot of good members, and a lot of good Moderators that tire of this endless
bickering and nitpicking. The gunslingers with their nitpicking wear you down to a frazzle after awhile
with the constant badgering of every word you say. That's why I ignore them. Not because I don't
like a bit of verbal jousting now and then, but because it becomes a useless waste of my time, and
the fact that the opposition doesn't really what to hear what you have to say in the first place. They
want another sentence, or opinion to use as cannon fodder against you in their next barrage of
nitpicking, that's all.

Anyway, fiery.....thanks for your post, and my chance to get this off my chest as well.

Back to the oil, lads.

FBD.





_____________________________

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A mechanic says..."Oh yeah, watch this".
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(in reply to fiery)
       Post #: 626

RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/2/2008 9:29:37 PM   
Jezmo



Posts: 823
Joined: 6/26/2006
From: Spring, TX, USA
Status: offline
I agree with FBD. Great post fiery.

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       Post #: 627

RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/2/2008 10:05:31 PM   
jessiej



Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/6/2003
From: STATESBORO, GA, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jezmo

I agree with FBD. Great post fiery.



I agree as well. We should remember that no amount of knowledge, real or assumed, is any substitute for wisdom. It seems a sad truth that wisdom is an even more uncommon virtue than common sense.

jess

(in reply to Jezmo)
       Post #: 628

RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/3/2008 1:16:56 AM   
Ken6PPC


 

Posts: 653
Joined: 6/20/2006
From: Hamilton, OH, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fiery

Gents ...

Spirited debate should be encouraged in this and all threads about controversial subjects.

However, more than a mere nodding acquaintance with the rules of common decency must be maintained.

Sometimes contributors need to be a little bit more "accepting". When you are an "injured" party, its hard to be gracious. That's when you need to keep in mind a few important principles:

(a) Conflicting viewpoints help you grow.

If you've ever been around modern teen-agers, you can see what I mean. They are the experts at coming up with unconventional, off-the-wall opinions that are "in your face", which challenge you and keep you honest.

(b) Never resort to character assassination

Disagreeing is one thing, belittling and denigrating is another. Vicious attacks are never warranted. A fair open exhange is best. Fight fair. You will be respected for it.

(c) When you lose, take it on the chin

No one knows everything. Too many contributors take up the cudgel over old grievances when shown to be wrong! Pursue the things which make for peace and building up of one another.

(d) Sometimes it's necessary to withdraw and "take 5".

When you need to, just let it go. It's OK! Don't type that "hot" response! It's just a hobby!

Be gracious! Every perspective has some merit. Think of this.

Why not just let somebody else be "right" sometimes, without injecting your opinion?

What's more important? My need to correct; or my need to connect?

I know my answer to that.


Why you *&$%#)@@~!(^^#$(&!!

I think your mother.........














raised a fine son!





Just joking......

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AMA #853194

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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/3/2008 2:23:12 AM   
fiery


 

Posts: 1010
Joined: 2/2/2002
From: Hervey Bay Queensland, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline
I really wish I was a fine son ... I have let her (and other loved ones) down badly many times. But, I am trying to make things better.

Not a bad thought to keep in mind for 2008.

Little by little, as I know in my case it all can't be done all at once.

Thanks for the kind comments.

All the best to everyone here at RCU; and most especially the sponsors and moderators, who bear the brunt of a lot of frustration at times.

(in reply to Ken6PPC)
       Post #: 630

RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/3/2008 2:37:42 AM   
skiman762



Posts: 1166
Joined: 12/1/2005
From: Nashville, NC, USA
Status: offline
Ok back to the Castor

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(in reply to fiery)
       Post #: 631

RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/3/2008 2:58:35 AM   
blw



Posts: 4569
Joined: 3/15/2004
From: Auburn, AL, USA
Status: offline
It's time to step in and say a few things and I've been dreading it. First, I'm going to try my best to not step on any toes and I know that it isn't going to work out that way in the end. Here goes my best shot at it.

Flyboy Dave mentioned some things about being a moderator and hassles. It's times like this where the job is no fun either as a moderator, or just as a member. The arguments get too heated, and people take this hobby too seriously.

Greg mentioned that he was not going to contribute any longer because someone is a moderator. That attitude should never have to come up if we do our jobs right as moderators. I am all too aware that the moderator tag gives an unspoken impression that the moderator has the last word most of the time. I've noticed that my post count has dropped quite a lot since becoming a moderator about 8 months ago because so many things are discussed, debated, and argued. I’m not comfortable voicing my own opinions if that would make people go silent once I posted something. I never wish to see that happen. It is true that a moderator could have an unfair advantage if he wanted to push things in a dispute, and that's just not playing fair in my view. Moderating is all about fairness to everyone, even those who disagree with you. Sometimes, even to those who insult you too. It's just part of the job as a moderator, and we are all free to quit if we can't hack being fair, courteous, and lenient to all members. Then, there the jobs that are no fun at all when it comes to editing posts, deleting them, etc. But, the moderator concept is what separates RCU from other forums, in my opinion. I've had my posts edited or deleted in the past, and I know how it sometimes feels. But, the alternative is to become like other forums where things are too crazy and sometimes extremely rude. One thing you can always say if the moderators are doing their jobs here- you can let your kids and wives visit RCU any time without worrying. That counts for a lot!

Since names have been mentioned in various posts, I'm going to just use them here too. I've watched things unwind in the thread from the beginning. A lot has been said and argued about. Thankfully, I don't see anyone here in Engines acting like a young gun trying to take down a sheriff. I know that Greg has some issues that he has questioned or flat out disagreed with. And, that's perfectly okay too. He certainly has some good points. Both sides are okay. That's what we are here for. As long as it stays friendly. I'm pretty sure that W8YE, Bubbagates, and myself read every single message in all of the Engines forums at least once a day, and sometimes more often. That's what we do. We have seen a lot of disagreements all over the place. Some were good, and some got very bad. One thing stands out after reading so many issues and outcomes on a daily basis; almost anything can be debated, and argued if everyone respects each others opinions.

Just to go on record here- anyone can disagree with me on just about anything. I've only had one or two cases where someone actually made a big stand and issue out of something I offered. I decided to let it ride since it wasn't that important in the grand scheme of things, and they were entitled to their own ideas just as much as I'm due mine. It simply isn't worth the grief to stand my ground when it comes down to that sort of confrontation. Plus, it gets back to that point where a moderator can have an unfair advantage either by actions or perceived abilities to always win. I won't put myself in that situation if I can help it.

There's many reasons for saying all of the above. It got my attention when a member felt that he had no chance for a valid opinion just because moderators are hanging around. And, there are some misconceptions about what moderators do, or should be doing. Like I said before, fairness is just about number one with me. I've wished that I could turn off the 'moderator' tag when posting at times just so I would know that everyone felt like we all had a level playing field. But, it won't ever work that way. I've got the tag whether I'm here in Engines, or any other area where I don't have moderator duties. Please contact me if you think I’m not playing fair. I promise to listen.

Remember that I said RCU is a good place where kids and wives can visit anywhere? How about considering this: wouldn’t it be great if our wives and kids could visit and read the arguments and debates that we participate in, and still respect all participants regardless of who is ‘wrong’ or ‘right’?

< Message edited by blw -- 1/3/2008 10:59:31 PM >


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RE: Castor oil - A final word? - 1/3/2008 3:36:35 AM   
Harry Lagman


 

Posts: 1155
Joined: 11/19/2003
From: Auckland, NEW ZEALAND
Status: offline
Fantastic post BLW. You set an excellent moderation example - keep up the great work.

< Message edited by w8ye -- 1/4/2008 2:00:30 AM >

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       Post #: 633

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