Announcing RCAPA

Announcing RCAPA
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Announcing RCAPA - 6/29/2004 1:23:06 AM

CenTexFlyer

Posts: 116
Joined: 9/21/2003
From: Wimberley, TX, USA
Status: offline

As many of you know, we've been discussing the possibility of government regulation of our activities. To this end we have been working on the forming of this association. By the 2nd week in June, the name of Remote Control Aerial Photography Association ( RCAPA) was decided and work began on a webpage. This association is intended as a not-for-profit organization with a web site to provide the following:

1. Most significantly to serve as a professional "group" to obtain general liability insurance for our flight operations.
2. Act as spokesperson entity to answer to agencies when questions arise.
3. Serve as a clearing house for resources available to us as aerial photographers.
4. Provide a specialized forum for open discussion of our activities, legal issues, and ways to solve these problems.
5. Provide generalized guidlines for aerial photography flight operations.
6. Develop a list of aerial photographers by locale.

We would very much like to encourage input from all the members here - your opinion is valuable to us. We do NOT wish to add another layer of beauracracy, but to act as public forum that will provide a unified voice. We believe that if we establish some common sense guidlines to provide for some self regulation then we hope to be treated much the same way HAM'ers have been by the FCC.

There is another organization just forming as of Friday called Remote Aerial Photography Association (RAPA) and is at HELICAM They are aimed primarily at helicopter aerial photography, which in our opinion, carries significantly more risk than lightweight, fixed wing AP operations. As might be expected, their suggested guidlines are significantly more restrictive due to that inherent risk.

Our intent is to promote the use of remote control aerial photography and welcome all platforms for aircraft to kites to ballons. By producing a record of safe flight operations, we should be able to negotiate reasonable insurance rates for our efforts. The website is under construction, but I encourage all to go visit. We are deciding what forum software to use so that will be coming soon.

We do NOT intend to take away from either this forum or the one on Ezone as our primary goal is ultimately to find/provide a source of general liability insurance for those interested in pursuing AP as more than just a hobby.

It's all up to us.

Gene (CenTexFlyer)

< Message edited by CenTexFlyer -- 6/28/2004 10:33:26 PM >

_____________________________

The Wing is the Thing!

Post #: 1

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 6/29/2004 2:45:35 AM

TPierce

Posts: 209
Joined: 1/25/2004
From: Tuscaloosa, AL, USA
Status: offline

Sounds good to me

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Freestyle with an Alpha .40... Hmm Interesting
AMA#792051

(in reply to CenTexFlyer)

Post #: 2

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 12/21/2004 4:57:25 PM

Joe Bennett

Posts: 50
Joined: 9/27/2002
From: Temecula, CA, USA
Status: offline

Group,

It is interesting to note the date of the original post that started this thread. It does seem to indicate that RCAPA.NET predates rcapa.org by several months. Wonder how Rich can still say he was first to use the name? No disrepect is intended towards Rich at all, just asking a valid question that to date has never been answered.

Joe Bennett

_____________________________

Electrons - not just for breakfast anymore!

(in reply to TPierce)

Post #: 3

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 12/22/2004 2:23:09 PM

Rj-TailSpin

Posts: 172
Joined: 12/3/2002
From: Appleton, WI, USA
Status: offline

I can confirm the original name was conceived long ago. Gene and I have discussed this topic many times. Insurance issues is the main reason why my flight activitives have been limited this year. Unless we can demonstrate considerable and lengthy record(s) of safe AV flights... we will continue to have a difficult time finding insurance. I am all for the organization of the RCAPA. We must earn the right to perform AV in a safe manner.

Gene, Here's a suggestion I wanted to mention. As the flight mass of our birds decreases, the potential for damage and harm will also decrease. I have some small light birds and a few heavy expensive birds. Both need to be considered. Perhaps different "mass" platforms could carry specific guidelines.

Rob

(in reply to Joe Bennett)

Post #: 4

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 12/23/2004 7:07:14 PM

patrickegan

Posts: 116
Joined: 9/12/2003
From: rcapa.net Sacramento, CA, USA
Status: offline

Posted by CenTexFlyer 0n 6/28/04

As many of you know, we've been discussing the possibility of government regulation of our activities. To this end we have been working on the forming of this association. By the 2nd week in June, the name of Remote Control Aerial Photography Association ( RCAPA) was decided and work began on a webpage. This association is intended as a not-for-profit organization with a web site to provide the following:

1. Most significantly to serve as a professional "group" to obtain general liability insurance for our flight operations.
2. Act as spokesperson entity to answer to agencies when questions arise.
3. Serve as a clearing house for resources available to us as aerial photographers.
4. Provide a specialized forum for open discussion of our activities, legal issues, and ways to solve these problems.
5. Provide generalized guidlines for aerial photography flight operations.
6. Develop a list of aerial photographers by locale.

What we have accomplished in under 6 months.
1. Done
2. Made contact, currently trying to formulate game plan
3. We put the message and information out.
4. Done
5. Done
6. Done (U.S.) working on other countries.

_____________________________

www.rcapa.net

(in reply to Rj-TailSpin)

Post #: 5

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 12/30/2004 9:52:11 PM

patrickegan

Posts: 116
Joined: 9/12/2003
From: rcapa.net Sacramento, CA, USA
Status: offline

I don’t know how many of you guys may have checked out RCAP.NET follow the link to http://www.rcapa.net We are trying to rally the troops so we can attend the ASTM meeting this May with are act in order. The ASTM has formed the F38 committee on UAV’s and will make recommendation to the FAA about regulating the future of commercial RC aerial photography. Our membership goal for the year is almost met. I would appreciate if you would take a look if you already haven’t. I would also appreciate if you joined as the more members we have the better standing we have. Thanks in advance, Patrick Egan

_____________________________

www.rcapa.net

(in reply to patrickegan)

Post #: 6

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 12/31/2004 7:53:19 AM

lvspark

Posts: 348
Joined: 4/19/2002
From: WALLA WALLA, WA,
Status: offline

I joined! It's FREE!

And fun!

(in reply to patrickegan)

Post #: 7

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 1/3/2005 2:44:39 PM

ImRich

Posts: 86
Joined: 5/11/2003
From: Derry, NH, USA
Status: offline

Hi,

Just to correct a few misrepresentations made here.

The Remote Aerial Photography Association (RAPA) is not only for heli operators. We represent all remote (or remote control if you prefer) aerial platforms, kites, balloons, fixed wing, rotory wing, blimps, masts, etc.

RAPA was originally started under the domain name www.helicam.org later we picked up www.rcapa.org in an attempt to try to clear up the misconception that we are a heli only group. Both domain names point to the same content.

Feel free to check out the Remote Aerial Photography Association pages and our forum at www.helicam.org or if you prefer www.rcapa.org

If you are interested in professional or commercial aerial photography consider this your open invitation to stop by and get involved.

_____________________________

Rich

(in reply to lvspark)

Post #: 8

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 1/4/2005 8:57:02 PM

patrickegan

Posts: 116
Joined: 9/12/2003
From: rcapa.net Sacramento, CA, USA
Status: offline

Hey Rich,

Thanks for clearing things up for everyone. Now with your post and the information contained in this thread it will be plain to everyone that you hijacked the RCAPA.NET name. You have stated in other forums you didn’t know about RCAPA.NET but if one looks at your join date and the threads first post date things don’t add up.

Thanks again, Patrick Egan

http://www.rcapa.net

< Message edited by patrickegan -- 1/4/2005 8:58:02 PM >

_____________________________

www.rcapa.net

(in reply to ImRich)

Post #: 9

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 1/4/2005 9:33:49 PM

ImRich

Posts: 86
Joined: 5/11/2003
From: Derry, NH, USA
Status: offline

Patrick,

I'm sorry but you must be assuming too much.

Yes, I've been a member here at RCU for some time, but unfortunately, as much as I would like to, I don't get to read every post.

I only recently saw this post and replied to it as it contained some misrepresentations about the Remote Aerial Photography Association which originally was using the domain name www.helicam.org and then later also registered the domain name www.rcapa.org to help alleviate the misconception that RAPA is a heli only organization. In fact, I didn't even notice the date of the first post in this thread until you pointed it out. Now that you point it out, this gives more data to the fact that that your group knew of the Remote Aerial Photography Association and simply morphed that name into something very similar sounding.

RAPA members could run around and create a lot of postings saying 'you stole our name', but we haven't done that. We think it's more important to work together as professionals as there are many more important issues going on.

This is not the place to debate such things. I only replied to clear up the misconceptions which were being created about RAPA (The Remote Aerial Photography Association).

I still welcome everyone to try to work together for the benefit of all commercial/professional operators.

Happy New Year and I hope w can find a way to all work together to further aerial photography.

_____________________________

Rich

(in reply to patrickegan)

Post #: 10

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 1/4/2005 11:13:15 PM

patrickegan

Posts: 116
Joined: 9/12/2003
From: rcapa.net Sacramento, CA, USA
Status: offline

Rich I'm not assuming anything (extremone)

quote:

RAPA members could run around and create a lot of postings saying 'you stole our name', but we haven't done that. We think it's more important to work together as professionals as there are many more important issues going on.

They could if they wanted to look stupid,

I did a rather quick search of the "Whois" website http://www.networksolutions.com/en_US/whois/index.jhtml and found that RCAPA.NET was registered on 21 June 2004 at 23:02:45 and that RCAPA. ORG was registered on 10 Sept. 2004 at 06:45:15. So it appears that Rick had the RCAPA (Remote Control Aerial Photography Association) MONTHS before the other group did. They can cry and scream all they like now, but the proof is there for all to see, they blatantly ripped off the RCAPA name without regards as to who originally registered it. The extension (Net verses Org) has nothing to do with the usage and appropriation of the EXACT name, RCAPA.

I read the email you sent to Darkoverlord I must admit the content didn't suggest let's work together! If you are truly interested in a workable solution I would suggest you stop using our name and then we can get on with the business at hand (ASTM).

Olive branch extended, Patrick Egan

< Message edited by patrickegan -- 1/4/2005 11:22:27 PM >

_____________________________

www.rcapa.net

(in reply to ImRich)

Post #: 11

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 1/5/2005 2:46:40 PM

Myron

Posts: 73
Joined: 12/8/2003
From: Kyle, TX, USA
Status: offline

Man I am really confused now!! Just because Helicam.org and RAPA were reistered by IMRICH that gives him the right to use the exact same name as RCAPA because he was "first" with Helicam.org?... Those names are nothing alike... almost like COKE buying a PEPSI.org URL and claiming that they had the first soft drink and should get any name they wanted by default.

To IMRICH, You have stated here and in other forums that the name ripoff/hijack/bootleg/copy WHATEVER you wanna call it was "Purley Coincidental"
and unintentional..... Are you saying that when you purchased the RCAPA.org URL that you in fact DID NOT look at the other names(.net,.com,.biz,.us) that were registered????

Myron

_____________________________

"Honey, Its NOT NEW...I just Re-Covered it"

(in reply to patrickegan)

Post #: 12

RE: Announcing RCAPA - 1/5/2005 4:39:00 PM

ImRich

Posts: 86
Joined: 5/11/2003
From: Derry, NH, USA
Status: offline

Myron, Patrick,

Yes, that is correct. When we registered rcapa.org we only looked at what .ORG domains were available. We were not interested in .com, .net, .us, .biz or any other tld, but we wanted to restrict our search to .org. Why is that so hard to understand? This happened while I was talking with another member when we were discussing how people tend to think that we are a heli only oriented group because of our domain name. While we were talking we were trying different domain names in the .ORG tld and found that RCAPA.org was available, so I registered it as it was available at the time. The thought process was that the terms 'remote', 'remote control' and 'RC' are often used interchangeably so that rcapa.org would be a good alternative to helicam.org for the Remote Aerial Photography Association and would better represent the fact that we were not oriented toward any particular aerial platform.

The Remote Aerial Photography Association is the name of the organization, not helicam.org or rcapa.org, those are simply domain names which point to the RAPA web site. This is no different than the Academy of Model Aeronautics using the domain name modelaviation.org, sometimes you simply can't get a domain name that matches the acronym for your organization.

You keep mentioning that you checked the domain name registration dates as an example as to the creation date of RAPA. Please be sure to check helicam.org as this was the domain name the Remote Aerial Photography Association was using from the beginning. We later picked up rcapa.org as explained above. As we are a growing young organization we did not start with a domain name that exactly matches our organization name, but did the best we could considering the circumstances. A lot of groups have domain names that do not match exactly their full entity name and have alternate domain names which also lead to the main web site.

Everything the RAPA group has done has been to try to promote commercial/professional remote (or if you prefer remote control) aerial photography without regard to aerial platform.

I honestly believe that the best thing would be for us to find a way to work together.

As I explained to Rick, when we created the Remote Aerial Photography Association, we had no knowledge of any other group. You have all seen the naming threads on the RR forum so you know how o