RE: Cloud Bound 4  
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RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 8/31/2004 9:30:50 AM   
barto



Posts: 519
Joined: 11/2/2002
From: Belgium, BELGIUM
Status: offline 		Looking very good .

About the open fuselage: it is quite time consuming but it is the strongest way to build an airframe.

Keep up the good work.



Bart

(in reply to McLeodAviation)
       Post #: 51

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 8/31/2004 3:11:46 PM   
Rick K


 

Posts: 260
Joined: 11/16/2003
From: Fontana, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Hello Mike, My Skybench "viking" also came with a 'Hardwood' (maple?) nose-block, I used my DeWalt orbital sander to rough shape it. Close shaping was done with a regular sanding block with the final shaping done with a foam backed sanding pad. As to using a balsa substitute . . . If the plane is likely to be tail heavy I'd rather use a stronger material up front and a battery with a greater capacity as 'usefull' ballast rather than packing dead weight lead. I hope you're going to strengthen the 'wrist' of the fuse (area just forward of tail group) in some fashion. . . Maybe you could place some 1/8" sheet balsa inside the stick fuse, 6" long, half foward of the Horz. stab LE, half behind. This has been the only area on any plane I've ever built that I've had structural failures with, it's happend to me with four different plane types.
Rick K
LSF 6493

(in reply to McLeodAviation)
       Post #: 52

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/2/2004 1:53:11 AM   
McLeodAviation


 

Posts: 209
Joined: 7/7/2003
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Hi,

I will consider reinforcing the wrist area but I think is strong enough.

Cloud Bound 4 update,

I have joined the forward fuselage section, glued front nose blocks, and roughly sanded the nose. The block in front of the canopy was not included in my kit. I made my block from 4 pieces of 1/2" scrap balsa. I also decided to add a couple lead weights to the nose. My Cloud Bound 4 is beginning to take shape!

PICTURE 1, Used a couple lead weights from my tackle box. I drilled and carved the nose blocks to accept them.
PICTURE 2, Lead weights are epoxied in place.
PICTURE 3, Blocks epoxied to fuselage and all roughly sanded to shape. Still needs more sanding but looks pretty cool.

Cloudbound, Mike

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< Message edited by McLeodAviation -- 9/3/2004 6:21:49 PM >

(in reply to Rick K)
       Post #: 53

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/2/2004 8:48:51 AM   
barto



Posts: 519
Joined: 11/2/2002
From: Belgium, BELGIUM
Status: offline 		That looks very nice, keep those pics coming.



Bart

(in reply to McLeodAviation)
       Post #: 54

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/2/2004 9:13:01 PM   
McLeodAviation


 

Posts: 209
Joined: 7/7/2003
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Rick and Bart,

Thanks for the complements and all the great tips. They help keep me motivated to finish my Cloud Bound 4 sailplane.

More pictures soon.

Cloudbound, Mike

< Message edited by McLeodAviation -- 9/3/2004 5:43:56 AM >

(in reply to barto)
       Post #: 55

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/4/2004 7:09:48 AM   
Rick K


 

Posts: 260
Joined: 11/16/2003
From: Fontana, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Hello Mike, Just a quick note to let you know I'm still here and looking at your posts when I have some time. School started three weeks ago for my girls and the PTA has been imposing again on much of my time, that plus my 'room parent' duties for both of my little girls classes (helping out grading home work, cutting out craft stuff . . .etc.) and taking care of our 10mo. old baby seems to take up just about all of my time these days.

You seem to be making great progress on your kit, and from looking at your pix, you do some fine work. Oh, did I say in my 'tip' baking soda? I ment to say baking powder. I guess that what's happens when you're trying to type and 'referee' kids at the same time. Tonight isn't much better, I have a good chunck of my in-laws here for the weekend . . . It wouldn't be so bad if only they could speak more english . . . I know enough spanish to understand when their making fun of me tho. Not a happy camper this evening. Very worried that when my wife and I go to the race tomarrow ( the Bush race here in Fontana, Cal. speedway) their kid's will be getting into my stuff. One of my other e-mail pals gave and sent me the tickets from way, way up in the northen part of our state . . . felt his health was not good enough to go both days. I can't begin to say of how kind all of the people I've sort of met here have been to me. From sending copies of long lost inst. manuals or making parts I don't have the equipment to make myself with out any charge. Neat hobby we have huh?
Rick K
LSF 6493

(in reply to McLeodAviation)
       Post #: 56

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/5/2004 5:35:06 PM   
RBeach


 

Posts: 16
Joined: 9/5/2004
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Mike,

Educate me if you will. I have studied all your photos and your construction is neat clean and well thought out. In looking at the aft portion of the fuselage none of the web members line up to adjacent panels. I would have thought to transfer the loads properly one member would lead directly to a connection of a member on the adjacent panel.
What's happening here?

Roland Beach

(in reply to Rick K)
       Post #: 57

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/5/2004 7:10:50 PM   
McLeodAviation


 

Posts: 209
Joined: 7/7/2003
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Roland,

I also noticed some of the upper and lower members are out of place. I started placing them as shown on the plan however as I worked toward the rear they got a little out of place. Guess they are not placed for optimum strength however is very strong. If I build another CB4 in the future I will pay closer attention to the upper and lower placement.

Hi Rick,

Free NASCAR Busch tickets, You Lucky Guy! I am a NASCAR fan and have been watching races on TV for many years. Still makes me sad my favorite driver was killed, God bless Dale Earnhardt!

This hobby has some of the nicest people, many will go out of their way to help someone they have never met.

I plan to work on my Cloud Bound 4 this evening. I will post more pictures soon.

Cloudbound, Mike

< Message edited by McLeodAviation -- 9/10/2004 6:59:13 AM >

(in reply to RBeach)
       Post #: 58

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/6/2004 4:34:02 AM   
forrest adams


 

Posts: 111
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: benbrook, TX,
Status: offline 		regarding cb4, thought i'd add my 2 cents.
a trim ballast box is a nice feature to build in to the plane - i just build a box with a small hole in the top and add/subtract lead shot as necessary - cg is a matter of personal preference and i think that having the ability to make small adjustments is a nice idea.

(in reply to McLeodAviation)
       Post #: 59

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/6/2004 9:43:25 PM   
RBeach


 

Posts: 16
Joined: 9/5/2004
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Mike,

Since you haven't got around to the wings yet, it might be worth checking out the posibility of using Carbon Fiber cap strips in the wings of the CB4. To my way of thinking the wing can't be strong enough when you are working with winches. As a comparison the Houston Hawk uses .060" thick x 1/2" top spar cap and a .030" bottom spar cap. The hawk has a `126" wing span where you have, I believe 144". The cap strip size would be close. The cost of the cap strips in a Hawk is $30.00. The other thing is, I have seen Jack's Womack's and Alan Jones's Hawks take some terribly licks and come up with no damage. It's worth thinking about. Alan Jones had a spoiler pop open and he nosed in at high speed and literally buried the nose. He bent the steel wing joiner but didn't damage the wing. That's strong.
I don't know how this might effect your legality to enter Nostalgia events but it certainly would make it strong. It would probably only add 1 to 2 ozs. to the total weight of the plane.

Cheers,
Roland

(in reply to forrest adams)
       Post #: 60

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/9/2004 2:53:17 AM   
Rick K


 

Posts: 260
Joined: 11/16/2003
From: Fontana, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Mike, Geez . . . ya don't take a look for a few days and everything changes! Took a little while to find the reply icon . . . The race was great, The tickets my sailplane e-mail buddy sent were great. Right above the end of pit row where it rejoins the track in section 78 row 38 seats 1& 2, what a view, lots of action going on to look at all at the same time. We live only about three or four miles from the track, we can easly hear them from here when theyr'e running, so the drive there and back wasn't a problem either.

Oh, we're supposed to be talking sailplane . . . Still haven't decided how I'm going to do the spoilers (deploy them) I really don't want to do the 'strings and springs' method but I'm a little hesitant to put servos and direct linkage in the wings, mainly because Iv'e never done it before . . . so I just waste time doing nothing but stare at the wing and think about what to do. I can't do anything more untill I decide (and save up some dough to buy the servos if I go that route) Nothing like being indecisive huh? How about some opinions out there? What do you guys think? Any advice as to the servo behind each spoiler method? What size and strength servo should I use?
Rick K
LSF 6493

(in reply to McLeodAviation)
       Post #: 61

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/9/2004 7:45:00 PM   
McLeodAviation


 

Posts: 209
Joined: 7/7/2003
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Hi everyone,

Thanks for more great tips. A ballast box is a great idea and I am seriously thinking about adding carbon fiber to my wings.

The CB4 has a very unusual spar design for the wings. I will have to study the wings and decide how to add carbon fiber cap strips. I also need to check if modifications with carbon are accepted at Nostalgia Sailplane Events. I may never fly my CB4 at a woody contest but I want to keep her eligible.

I have not completed much on my CB4 the past few days. I glued some triangle stock under the top block. I cut the fuselage bottom for the hardwood tow hook anchor. This kit comes with a tow hook that is screwed into a hardwood block. Has no lock nut or blind nut. I don't think this is strong enough? I need to buy or make a better tow hook. Rick, are you using the tow hook supplied with your Skybench Viking kit?

I thought about changing to larger aluminum wing rods but think I will use the 5/16" steel rods supplied with my kit. Rick, did your Viking kit come with 5/16" steel wing rods? Are you using them?

I can't help you with your spoiler dilemma, I have never built a sailplane with spoilers before. I was thinking about not installing spoilers on my CB4 because I've heard they are not neccassary when using large flaps. What do you think?

Cloudbound, Mike

< Message edited by McLeodAviation -- 9/9/2004 7:54:05 PM >

(in reply to Rick K)
       Post #: 62

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/9/2004 10:21:22 PM   
RBeach


 

Posts: 16
Joined: 9/5/2004
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Hi Mike,

Glad to see you are thinking about the carbon fiber spars, it's the only way to go. If you are considering using the CF Spar caps, the combined thickness should be about .090" total thickness and no wood spar is used. If you take that from the wing depth (at the joiner rod) you should find you can use a 7/16" joiner rod, with room to spare. I asssume you recieved the drawing I sent by e-mail.
Heavy Duty tow hooks with nylon nut, washer and wood insert is $5.00 (+$0.50 Postage) from Don Richmond at www.highlaunch.com . Don also has an assortment of aluminum wing joiner rods. Check the site out, Don has all kind of Hardcore sailplane stuff.
I see Rick is having problems with spoilers. To my way of thinking one servo per spoiler is the way to go. It will normally require servo extentions with a "Y" connector. Almost any of the small servos will work. I normally use HiTec HS-55's. Although last year I bought a half dozen "NoName" Micro servos for spoilers. Bought 'em at e-Bay for $5.00 each. They have worked well no problems. The best feature is with a hard link from servo to spoiler the action is positive. When they close, It's positive and the adjustment of the servo is micro. This way it's easy to flush everything up. I for one would go with the servos.
As far as spoiler and flap, consider this; the spoiler will kill the lift but that does not mean it will slow the plane down. The flap at 90 degrees will also kill lift but it slows the plane down as well. The flaps can also increase lift at modest deflection and increase speed at modest positive deflection (normally 3 to 4 degrees up). If you have to make a choice the flap is the better way to go.
Let us know how the project is coming.

Cheers,
Roland Beach

(in reply to McLeodAviation)
       Post #: 63

RE: Cloud Bound 4 - 9/10/2004 12:38:54 AM