RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub?  
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Tower Hobbies
Enter up to 4 keywords or Tower stock numbers
Logged in as Guest



Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
       

All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> Questions and Answers >> RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub?
Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>  

Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/3/2004 4:19:43 PM   
crashergs


 

Posts: 179
Joined: 2/12/2004
From: Rialto, CA, USA
Status: offline
dude everyone shut up already, I just wanted to ask a quick question, now look what it turned into, a pot hole of little girls squirming at eachother, JUST FORGET IT, and forget I came into RCU. Someone nice enough could have said, " no man, its not a good idea cause government might trip out, and maybe those guys who do it will some day have a consequence of their own". I come here to learn and prosper from others teachings and history on flying their planes but its not the case anymore.

Why do you guys have to start off big headed? since all you take radio control aircraft a little bit too seriously, your serious about everything. nmills was the only cool guy here, I could tell you that theres alot of d**k heads here with their bloded ego that cant even ask 1 simple question if someone has one, only the more technical questions, but you know what thats how all forums are now.

Name calling and being ignorant from an "older gentleman", your honestly a grumpy old man, I would have thought you would have answered that question more thoughtfully and in a professional manner, not "little boy", that comes to tell you that you have a thick skull already.

Im sick and tired of comming into these forums, just getting into the hobby again after 6-7 years and all I get is negativity, no help from others unless I beg. In this hobby I can already tell it has rotted minds, whenever I go to a airfield everyone is full of themselves, they think they are all that, WHY? ITS ONLY STUPID PLANES, I bet thats all they spend their money on for years and years and not even realize it. honestly theres more to life than that, and why is this hobby the deciding factor of who has a BIGGER HEAD THAN THE OTHER. Im tired of everyone showing their balls, you guys are the ones that make me sick and depressed of flying my plane WHICH I HAVENT FLOWN YET... im out of this hobby 80% of you guys think you guys are soo cool with your pretty planes you show offs.

I bet after this thread there will be another disrespectful rude person who has to speak on this, if it is I hope your 17 yrs or below. I dont want to come to this forum anymore, its no help, I just realized it. Goodbye


Sincerely,
"little boy"

< Message edited by crashergs -- 11/3/2004 4:20:40 PM >

(in reply to FLYBOY)
       Post #: 26

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/3/2004 4:33:40 PM   
exeter_acres



Posts: 6132
Joined: 9/22/2004
From: Johns Creek, GA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

Granted we have all flown in the neighborhood at one point in our careers



Never have... NEVER will

(in reply to crashergs)
       Post #: 27

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/3/2004 5:16:26 PM   
Tall Paul



Posts: 4693
Joined: 6/23/2002
From: Palmdale, CA, USA
Status: offline
Actual images from a UAV intruding into controlled airspace..

Attachments
Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize
Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize
Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize
Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize

(in reply to exeter_acres)
       Post #: 28

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/3/2004 5:47:55 PM   
mnmills2


 

Posts: 160
Joined: 1/31/2003
From: florida
Status: offline
Highflight,

The legitimate use for something like this is what I mentioned before (see post 18). My friend is using a similar set up in his crop fields to see areas that need irrigation, have damage, need drainage etc. The crops are tall and he is unable to see all of his field. So to solve this problem he has a large plane that he can fly over and see any problems and get pictures and a lat/long off of the GPS. Its totally legitimate. Also, to compare a R/C supercub with a cam to a bomb is absurd. If you are that worried about bombs and national security spend your time looking at other more sources of danger such as airports, shippig containers, and automatic weapons, not people's r/c hobbies. I promise Osama doesnt own a futaba radio and a supercub.

FLyboy,
I see your point...but this guy said nothing about flying with a camera in a neighborhood. You friend and yourself might have, but he didnt. I wasnt referring to you as attacking him, if that was your impression Im sorry. I was referring to a few others here.

Paul,
Clearly that picture from a UAV is not from any private individual. That looks like a military UAV or something else.

Crash,
Did you read my first post on here? We havent tried wireless cams yet but we have been able to do video and gps and link the two together. Just have to play it on the computer or laptop on the field.

Mike

(in reply to Tall Paul)
       Post #: 29

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/3/2004 7:01:54 PM   
Tall Paul



Posts: 4693
Joined: 6/23/2002
From: Palmdale, CA, USA
Status: offline
Mike
es, the UAV flying thru the approach to the runway at Istres France is from a military UAV.
It was destroyed by the tip vortex of the Airbus.
Look at the ground below the UAV, and observe what it crashed into!
However, what is to say that something identical WON'T occur, once anyone's UAV goes beyond visual flight range ?
AMA no longer applies.
FAA most certainly does!
"Proving" a UAV can be made by a hobbiest and fly a preprogrammed path has been done.
It required several years of effort and a 10 to 100 times $300 to do it.
Most of the planes were lost.
This is -typical- of the task.
Where the planes go missing, THAT is the problem!
Over the ocean, no big deal.
Over populated areas, BIG DEAL!
Programming a plane to fly a specific path, AND remain in sight, there's no problem with that.
Other than the cost of failures.

< Message edited by Tall Paul -- 11/3/2004 7:02:53 PM >

(in reply to mnmills2)
       Post #: 30

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/4/2004 2:42:22 PM   
Highflight-RCU


 

Posts: 597
Joined: 2/28/2003
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnmills

Highflight,

The legitimate use for something like this is what I mentioned before (see post 18). My friend is using a similar set up in his crop fields to see areas that need irrigation, have damage, need drainage etc. The crops are tall and he is unable to see all of his field. So to solve this problem he has a large plane that he can fly over and see any problems and get pictures and a lat/long off of the GPS. Its totally legitimate. Also, to compare a R/C supercub with a cam to a bomb is absurd. If you are that worried about bombs and national security spend your time looking at other more sources of danger such as airports, shippig containers, and automatic weapons, not people's r/c hobbies. I promise Osama doesnt own a futaba radio and a supercub.

Mike


Mike,
I'm totally willing to discuss the idea that there "may" be a legitimate use for RPV flight. However, there is NO legitimate use by RC "hobbiests" just for the purpose of "doing it". Even in your example, that's really a stretch, but fine, I'll buy that. But look what your farmer friend is doing; he's flying very low (he has to in order to properly evaluate his crops) AND he's flying ONLY over his very own property. Still, if his UAV is reported as a near miss or hit by a manned aircraft, your farmer buddy is in deep doo doo even though he's over his own property (a licensed pilot can fly as low as he wants over unpopulated areas; if a licensed pilot is doing a practice emergency landing over your buddy's corn down to around 100 feet, and your buddy hits him, you buddy is at fault for violating the "see and avoid" rule no matter if it's over his property or not). It has been established in the courts that property owners do NOT own any airspace OVER their property.

Hobbiest RPV/UAV questions in these forums are USUALLY framed with the intent to fly several MILES from the transmitter, and the intent of those questioners is usually obvious in that the questioner is just "playing around" with RPV/UAV.
Additionally, if someone has a LEGITIMATE use for UAV flight, then he needs to be contacting one of the commercial companies that do such a thing. Since those companies have already done all the groundwork and insurance requirements for UAV flight, that takes any liability off of the back of the person who contracts their services.

Lastly, you're getting away from my primary point, and that is that RPV/UAV flight by we RC hobbiests, for "hobby" purposes, will get us NOTHING, and will have the likelyhood of our hobby getting nailed bigtime by government intervention.
Is there legitimate uses for UAV flight?.. Absolutely! But screwing around by RC hobbiest "just because I want to", is NOT a legitimate use specifically because of the damage that it WILL cause to the RC hobby itself.

Finally, you say that "Also, to compare a R/C supercub with a cam to a bomb is absurd."
I am NOT comparing an aircraft with a cam to a bomb. In fact, aerial photography is a great offshoot of the RC hobby.
You continue to confuse aerial photography with long range (outside line-of-site) RPV flight. Even in your own example, I'll bet that your farmer friend flys within the range of a standard RC transmitter.
I'm trying to stay specific on topic, and I'll continue to try to make it clear that what I'm talking about that is a danger to our hobby and other people is the BEYOND LINE-OF-SITE, LONG-RANGE (further than our current transmitters will allow) RPV/UAV flight for the purpose of just screwing around "because we can".

Highflight

< Message edited by Highflight-RCU -- 11/4/2004 2:50:08 PM >

(in reply to mnmills2)
       Post #: 31

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/4/2004 4:33:06 PM   
FLYBOY



Posts: 8692
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Missoula, MT, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnmills

FLyboy,
I see your point...but this guy said nothing about flying with a camera in a neighborhood. You friend and yourself might have, but he didnt. I wasnt referring to you as attacking him, if that was your impression Im sorry. I was referring to a few others here.

Mike


Mike, his ref was in a PM. He said he dreamed of seeing helicopters and airplanes flying in his neighborhood without anyone flying them. Just seems like he was trolling, and it appears to have worked. As you know, we see a lot of this, newbies come in and want to do strange and unusual things, and when they don't get their way, they pitch a fit like has happend above and rip on everyone else.

Best outcome possible? Maybe he will think a little bit about the consequences and not try it. You never know though. If one wants to play with toys like that, there are careers that make it possible and you don't have to re-invent the wheel. Just takes dedication and training.

Heck, who knows, he could come up with some hit tech cool gadget that will fly up and down stairs in buildings and carry a camera for spying. Oh yea, they already did that. Unfortunately, those birds are mostly untouchable in price.

_____________________________

Fly it till the wings come off.

(in reply to mnmills2)
       Post #: 32

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super ... - 11/4/2004 7:05:20 PM   
mnmills2


 

Posts: 160
Joined: 1/31/2003
From: florida
Status: offline
Hey guys,

In my post you can see I personally am against the 3 mile thing. We are all in agreement in that. But my point was lets not bash someone that may or may not be new to the hobby for dreaming or coming up with new things (ie the wireless cam).

Originally, my concern was that all the posts here were criticizing the man without doing what this site is all about and that is to answer questions. When I say criticizing, the responses werent written recommending he not try it...the posts went as far as equating it with being a terrorist! I think Crash now understands that 3 mile ranges are a little long or far fetched...but how about his question regarding the cam?

Mike

(in reply to FLYBOY)
       Post #: 33

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super ... - 11/4/2004 9:39:32 PM   
Highflight-RCU


 

Posts: 597
Joined: 2/28/2003
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnmills

When I say criticizing, the responses werent written recommending he not try it...the posts went as far as equating it with being a terrorist! I think Crash now understands that 3 mile ranges are a little long or far fetched...but how about his question regarding the cam?

Mike


Please forgive my personal vigor in trying to save the RC hobby from foolish people, but I can imagine the future, and it doesn't look good for the hobby unless people with ideas of flight outside line-of-sight are stopped in their tracks.

So, about aerial cam... I have a true story about that.
Quite a while ago, way before anyone even thought about possible nefarious uses for RC aircraft, a guy in our club (a "real" pioneer since this was about 10 years ago) set up an RPV aircraft that transmitted a video picture back to a TV we had in the impound. As you might imagine, the equipment he uses wasn't exactly lightweight, but it did fly.

It was really, and I mean REALLY cool because he took off by looking at the monitor and it was as if he were actually in the airplane. Some of the guys watched the airplane take off, but then they (everyone there!) went over and looked over the shoulder of the pilot as he flew around. After a few minutes, the pilot said that he didn't think he had control and asked someone to see if they could see the airplane out there.
The short story is that the pilot flew the aircraft beyond the range of the transmitter but still within range of the more powerful video system's transmitter. Everyone got to watch the airplane as it went out of control, went into a steep spiral dive, watched as the ground loomed closer really fast, and then watched as the video "faded to black" on impact.

So there's your true story about real RPV. Everyone laughed their ***es off at the time, but it's that incident that made me wonder if RPV in the RC hobby was really a good thing.

So back to aerial photography: A really exciting part of the hobby is using an RC aircraft for aerial photography, both video and photo. I've seen some really good stuff, and the best one was when a video camera was mounted at the top of the vertical fin looking forward (they're small enough to do that now). It was really cool to see the entire aircraft at the lower 1/3 of the frame while the countryside was photographed in about a 5 minute flight. That's the kind of thing that is well described on the rc-cam website.

Highflight

(in reply to mnmills2)
       Post #: 34

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super ... - 11/4/2004 11:09:07 PM   
FLYBOY



Posts: 8692
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Missoula, MT, USA
Status: offline
You want to see real aerial photos with RC. Gravityshots.com

Way cool, and very professional. They do a good job. If someone wants to do justice to RC photography, mimic this company.

_____________________________

Fly it till the wings come off.

(in reply to Highflight-RCU)
       Post #: 35

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/12/2004 11:17:30 PM   
dicknadine


 

Posts: 2051
Joined: 7/17/2003
From: Greensburg, LA, USA
Status: offline
Congratulations that you have decided to be on your own. its people like you who have a fair idea and throw it out for discussion. the response varies- mostly DON'T do it. the method may not be what your looking for-- but the answer is DON'T DO IT. the FEDS are already on your trail. they read these columns. dick

(in reply to crashergs)
       Post #: 36

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super Cub? - 11/18/2004 6:31:26 PM   
kd7ost


 

Posts: 402
Joined: 10/12/2003
From: Nampa, ID,
Status: offline
Sounds like fun. I have such a plane of my own. In fact have had it fly via gps on a 35 mile round trip. I'm not doing it under the AMA umbrella though so naysayers please don't panic. Dave Brown, President of the AMA landed the spirit of Butts Farm for Maynard Hill after a successful world record Atlantic crossing using GPS last year, so you guys need to ease up on your fear. Terrorists have an easier time getting Rider trucks and that causes more damage. No one is breaking the law here. It's a spirit of innovation that some modelers are still capable of. We realize some folks have found their resting place in the hobby and there's nothing we would like more than to stay out of your way. Believe me. AMA does not sanction the activity to protect itself from potential FAA regulation. We simply hide out in the deserts for our research and testing. We don't fly these planes at our AMA sanctioned fields. AMA and Model planes pilots are protected as a separate activity. Period.

I use the Garmin geko GPS set with way points to do the job but you need to lock altitude with Barometric sensing or similar. You also need a wing levelizer like the FMA C0-pilot to make things easy and secure. A pitch control device won't do the job for altitude.

One mile is the best you'll get out a standard 72 MHz RC system. 750mw is max power through a 1/4 wave antenna. You can get farther range with a Video system, but I don't think you can get one that goes up to a mile without having a Ham License. It's easy to pass that test. There's no code requirements anymore for the Technician class license. Then you can use a small 2 meter Radio with a Tiny Track 3 and APRS to track it on a Lap Top. The process has to be undone on the ground with Radio, TNC etc. You can use a High gain Yagi for 900 MHz video or a high Gain patch for 2.4 GHz video . But, You'll not get the job done for your listed dollar amount unless you have a source of freebee's.

Incidentally, I can now set my GPS to "goto" where I fly from. I can fly by video with range up to 1 mile while I have the Altitude locked. I can fly my plane away from me in any direction till it runs out of RC range. That will enable the gps steering device to simply return the plane to me. If you want details fire off an e-mail to me direct. I hate to cause a panic here.

Best of Luck

Dan
AMA 276090
KD7OST

(Remember, when little UAV's are outlawed, Only Outlaws will have little UAV's.)

< Message edited by kd7ost -- 11/18/2004 11:50:41 PM >

(in reply to crashergs)
       Post #: 37

RE: Any Ideas for 3+ mile distance flights for Super ... - 11/18/2004 7:16:00 PM   
DamonTX


 

Posts: 351
Joined: 6/2/2002
From: Helotes, TX, USA
Status: offline
[/quote]

Please forgive my personal vigor in trying to save the RC hobby from foolish people, but I can imagine the future, and it doesn't look good for the hobby unless people with ideas of flight outside line-of-sight are stopped in their tracks.

[/quote]

Why lighten the situation then fire it up again by claiming to save us from foolish people? The original post was just a guy with a dream that I'm sure most of have thought of at one time or another. All he wanted was a simple answer that seemed to be done by kd70st in the last post and not the philosophical discussion you so longwindedly brought about. Reading your blather reminds me of the self proclaimed know-it-all at the field who likes to pick apart everthing anyone says or does.

(in reply to Highflight-RCU)