RE: Why the AMA is not growing...........  
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RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/15/2006 7:26:46 PM   
Jim Thomerson



Posts: 2825
Joined: 10/9/2002
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline 		I have seen Model Aviation for sale in hobby shops. Can we suppose the majority of people who enter hobby shops are not AMA members, but some might be interested? Would it be a good idea for the AMA to advertise the magazine as available to hobby shops, maybe for a very low price or even free? Maybe supply unsold back issues to hobby shops. I've seen Model Airplane News and Aviation Modeler International on sale in bookstores a number of times. As said, these magazines do not have MA's subscriber base. Sending you and me MA is basically preaching to the choir.

(in reply to STLPilot)
       Post #: 201

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/15/2006 8:36:54 PM   
STLPilot


 

Posts: 9221
Joined: 3/12/2003
From: Manhattan, NY, USA
Status: online
quote:

I have seen Model Aviation for sale in hobby shops. Can we suppose the majority of people who enter hobby shops are not AMA members, but some might be interested?
Of course the AMA should send magazines to hobby shops, but hobby shops still have to pay for the issues at MA's cost. At the end of the day the hobby shop needs to see what makes them money first before they start doing favors for others, even the AMA. So if Fly RC is going to sell through better and AMA is going to sit on the rack, they are going to focus on what makes them more money. MA should at least change the artwork on the cover to make it more eye catching first as the cover is what sells the magazine starting from the title down. But giving it away to hobby shops would only bury the AMA even more and would cause a complete uprising agmonst the members.

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Here At The Wall

(in reply to Jim Thomerson)
       Post #: 202

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/15/2006 9:12:41 PM   
shag555


 

Posts: 710
Joined: 10/21/2004
From: Berlin Center, OH, USA
Status: offline 		How about this reason... My club is aged and likes it to remain at 30 members. We're lucky if there is anyone flying during the week, and have maybe 10 members flying on saturday or sunday. I admit is is nice. But as soon as somebody mentions a open house or something that might attract new members, forget it. No body's interested (the majority) because they're afraid of something. I can't seem to figure it out, weather it's their age, or what. My fellow clubbies (god bless their hearts) are between 60 and 80. I and a couple of other guys are in their 30's to 40's.

anyone want to comment on this one??? I love my fellow members to death, but it seems that the "reluctance" for change (IE, getting new members) and "training" want to be pilots is beyond them.

MPB

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MPB

(in reply to STLPilot)
       Post #: 203

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/15/2006 9:21:54 PM   
STLPilot


 

Posts: 9221
Joined: 3/12/2003
From: Manhattan, NY, USA
Status: online
quote:

Anyone want to comment on this one???
Simple, most AMA members care about one thing, themselves. This is why RC is just one of several aviation hobbies I've pursue. Get into full scale flying, it's the complete opposite and not as expensive as you think. You can even build you own planes, real cheap, less then a decent 40% plane.

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       Post #: 204

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/15/2006 11:07:44 PM   
NorfolkSouthern


 

Posts: 905
Joined: 7/17/2006
From: Ann Arbor, MI, USA
Status: offline 		You are correct in that full-scale can cost considerably less, STLPilot. It can even be less than the cost of getting into R/C with a trainer. For one, a small plane can be chartered for around $75.00, for a full hour, which includes the certified flight instructor and aviation fuel. A model will set you back a minimum of $300.00, plus you have to have AMA (another $60.00) and club membership in many areas ($135.00). The initial costs total at least $450.00 minimum if you add the cost of glow fuel and the required accessories. The cost of the field is not included in to total. If you go up on a full scale plane once per month, you could get at least 6 months of flying in for the same cost as getting started in R/C.

Oh, by the way. Most clubs will require the R/C pilot to purchase their own plane, because they only use club trainers for introductory flights. You also need all the tools, fuel, and starting accessories. AMA insurance is mandatory at all sanctioned fields, and club dues are mandatory in most (a $150.00 cost up front before any time on the buddy box).

For the record: You don't even need to be a pilot to get into full-scale. You don't need to own a plane. You don't need to pay for insurance. It's all figured in the hourly cost. I guess model aviation isn't as accessible as I thought.

NorfolkSouthern

< Message edited by NorfolkSouthern -- 8/15/2006 11:08:55 PM >

(in reply to STLPilot)
       Post #: 205

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/16/2006 2:57:20 AM   
KidEpoxy



Posts: 3417
Joined: 10/14/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: online 		seems we forgot to mention the sum of the full sized rentals with Flight Instructor to actually get your wings and fly alone. The good news is it is no longer Minimum 40 hours ( @ $75hr right), but then when you look that the FAA says the average pilot takes 70 hours to get licensed ( yup, that $75hr ) there is a substantial outlay...

wow, $75 is less than getting a RC trainer plane & whole setup.
wow, $75 x 30-70 hours to get a license is more.... by several thousand dollars.

I was about $2500 into it just to get to solo as a student pilot (Cable, by ONT), and there is no way I can afford to finish without Lottery Intervention.
Instead, I just bought 4 motors nib from the factory outlet for ~$28 bucks, and a BIG box of LoneStar balsa for $60... and some 25cent glue from Wallyworld.... DOCULAM- got a 500' roll of a knockoff for twenty something w/ free shipping. I am looking at maybe 40 planes for about $100.

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Optional MA is part of AMA history, we can go optional AGAIN if we just say so

(in reply to NorfolkSouthern)
       Post #: 206

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/16/2006 4:00:35 AM   
NorfolkSouthern


 

Posts: 905
Joined: 7/17/2006
From: Ann Arbor, MI, USA
Status: offline 		To actually take flight training as a student pilot, then get the pilot's license, yes it does cost considerably more than flying models, KidEpoxy. With that, I absolutely agree. I was making my statement on the assumption that a full-scale plane is chartered along with the pilot, rather than actually being used for lessons. The most likely application for this would be aerial photography. I did quote the price of the Cessna 150 wrong, though. The actual cost is $69.00 plus $40.00 for the instructor, per hour. Sorry about the error, but I ended up checking at the local FBO after my post.

As for aerial photography, I see a great potential for growth here, as a manned aircraft just can't get into the places that a small line of sight UAV can. There is one company that now makes blimps that are small in size, yet serve the purpose very well. Helicopters can also be used, and fixed wing is probably the most cost effective type of aircraft to consider. Perhaps the AMA could promote aerial photography as a practical use for the models, as it may attract the interest of people looking into vocational interests. I know I would like to think of more uses for my plane, rather than just flying around at the local club.

NorfolkSouthern

(in reply to KidEpoxy)
       Post #: 207

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/16/2006 1:13:49 PM   
fliers1



Posts: 534
Joined: 11/30/2001
From: Lockport, NY, USA
Status: offline 		The info in the article below is more than likely the major cause of why AMA is not growing. Tell the public that if they get into the hobby, they will be taught to how to fly. But the fine print isn't revealed until after they join. For all intents and purposes there is no real solution to this situation.

http://www.rc-float-flying.rchomepage.com/RCWeb/Articles/Instructor/instructor.htm

CCR



< Message edited by fliers1 -- 8/16/2006 1:17:35 PM >

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(in reply to NorfolkSouthern)
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RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/17/2006 8:35:42 PM   
Jim Thomerson



Posts: 2825
Joined: 10/9/2002
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline 		There was a long article an a local paper about a local company who uses RC flying wings to do photo surveillance. Said they had located a couple of dead bodies with fairly small amounts of flying time after ground searches had failed. When you go commercial like that, I think you are in a whole nother world from hobby RC.

(in reply to fliers1)
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RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/18/2006 11:09:20 AM   
Quadrapowerforflight


 

Posts: 41
Joined: 8/10/2006
From: , USA
Status: offline 		The reason the AMA is not growing is because of electrics and also because of the recent drop in price. Big companies like Apex have prices for half what thier competition wants for LIpos. Another large company buys LIpo cells from overseas and makes up thier own packs once in the states, once again thier price is half of what you see at the LHS or Poly sites. Lipos are not expensive anymore unless you buy the ones that put out 80--100 amps. Sport flyers dont need 25--40C batteries. The wait is over check out some 11.1v batteries on ebay really cheap now a 37 amp battery is fine.

Also Ive never had a park flyer or foamie my first electric was 62 inches and 3 and half pounds. Has fiberglass fuse and sheeted wings it beats gas ugly sticks like thier standing still turns a 10X8 prop apc type not a plastic park flyer one.

(in reply to Woody218-RCU)
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RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/18/2006 2:12:46 PM   
J-To-Low



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Joined: 10/25/2003
From: huntersville., NJ, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: J-To-Low

The AMA is not growing simply because of the fact that 50%Plane is a member.



I'm still going with this theory.

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       Post #: 211

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/18/2006 2:23:35 PM   
fliers1



Posts: 534
Joined: 11/30/2001
From: Lockport, NY, USA
Status: offline 		Logically, if no one is serious about giving hands-on promotion to the public and beginners, the hobby and AMA cannot possibly grow. Although no one can really place blame as there is really no significant motivation to do so, except that of the profit making end and they have put all of the eggs in the sole basket of the nonprofit oriented end of the hobby/sport. Like mixing oil and water.

Anyway, whatever anyone thinks, there is more than likely a 99% chance that nothing will be done now or in the future to change this downwards direction. If anyone has a readily available real solution, let him speak now or forever hold his peace.

CCR

< Message edited by fliers1 -- 8/18/2006 2:28:35 PM >

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RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/18/2006 3:27:26 PM   
Roby


 

Posts: 974
Joined: 2/15/2002
From: AMESBURY, MA,
Status: offline
Flyers1

I think your 99% number is a bit low.

The membership will continue to fall and I'll add
that it's only going to get worse in the very near
future. I'll also add that the dwindleing of membership/
interest in many other areas outside our hobby will
happen too. I may be wrong on this but I believe that even
the AMA has made mention of this many years ago.

The reason......the baby boomers are getting old and
when we eventually stop or slow down whatever it is that
we do , there will not be enough people with the same
interest to fill the void.

So, don't be too concerned.

Regards
Roby



(in reply to fliers1)
       Post #: 213

RE: Why the AMA is not growing........... - 8/18/2006 3:45:48 PM   
50%plane



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From: x, , USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: J-To-Low


quote:

ORIGINAL: J-To-L