RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!!

RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!!
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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 10/28/2005 9:15 PM

Cobalt Saber

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Captain Nemo12

Yep, you're correct (what? You've never seen a Chinese Captain Nemo? ), been at the hobby for a number of years now and still fascinated with every single sub I see. I wished that RC-subs existed back then when I was a kid, I would've had a really big advance in hobby by now!

Sweet!
your ten times cooler than you where ten mintues ago!

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/18/2005 12:55 AM

Captain Nemo12

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Well just a little update guys,

I put the torpedo building on hold for a little while now, I'm focusing more on the U-boat. If everything goes well, the hull should be done at the end of the month. I'm think about a new launcher system, and perhaps using electric torpedoes for a better range. I don't have to worry about losing the torpedoes as I will be mostly firing torps in a pool. If I make them positively buoyant it shouldn't be a problem recovering them even in a lake or a pond.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/18/2005 1:50 AM

Cobalt Saber

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for electric motor's you could use ZipZap micro r/c car motor. There only about half an inch long and a quater inch wide.
Thoght you might like that. there fast too by the way

LATER DUDES

cobalt zero

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/18/2005 2:30 AM

Captain Nemo12

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Those cars are cool, but I'd hate to take apart one of those just for a motor... I believe the motors used in them are like the same ones used in small cellphones and pagers for vibrating.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/18/2005 3:04 AM

Cobalt Saber

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Radio shack sells ZipZap motor packs. they are like 10$ USD.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/18/2005 3:40 AM

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http://cgi.ebay.com/ZipZaps-Micro-RC-Speed-and-Performance-Booster-Kit_W0QQitemZ6013672985QQcategoryZ44024QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
there is three motors
http://cgi.ebay.com/ZipZaps-Monster-Truck-Micro-RC-Performance-Booster-Upg_W0QQitemZ6014447874QQcategoryZ44024QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
there you go guys

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/18/2005 9:58 PM

Cobalt Saber

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how can i post a pic that i made in windows paint?

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/18/2005 10:01 PM

u69

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have I mentioned http://www.solarbotics.com/ for pager motors???

between $7 and $10 canadian (I think that is like $0.20 to you yanks

)

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 11/20/2005 10:17 PM

Cobalt Saber

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Here is an idea that i had

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 2/4/2006 11:08 PM

mpyachts

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I like that idea 'Dieflug.....' That could work. Not that I'd know, but it's a very cool subject and you guys are working as a team!!!!
Jason

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/5/2006 3:52 PM

andrewtexas123

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Does any one have any videos of thies at work?

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/5/2006 4:38 PM

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As a help ?
I make 100 boats from 2x4's about 18" long each year and give them away to kids to sail in a pool we set up.

The props are from Octura Models, rubber band is contest grade from Peck Polymers, prop bearings are 4-40 washers.

A 12" long motor wound up is able to push the boats 30 + feet. Rewind is with cordless drills.

Any one need pictures I can scan it to you, if you would post as needed by others.

Octura does NOT have a website. I can scan all the prop pages to you . T hey have prop specs. and price of each. Very good people to deal with.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/5/2006 5:04 PM

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Cyclops,

Very cool! Reminds me of those rubber-band powered airplanes I saw as a kid. The problem I ran into is that in a pen sized torpedo, the rubber-band used is very short, thus not allowing a very long run time. I'm seriously thinking about electric-conversion instead, there's some really good micro-car motors at my local Radio-Shack I'd like to try.

As for props, I got some when I bought a 1/144 Type XXI U-boat this summer, the props are exactly the size of the pen diameter.

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyclops2

Rewind is with cordless drills.

HA!! I do the same thing, rewinding torpedoes is a highly arduous task...

< Message edited by Captain Nemo12 -- 3/5/2006 5:06 PM >

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/5/2006 10:39 PM

cyclops2

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Nemo. I posted a post of small REV ESC. It is a standard servo that allows you to run the motor continuosly at any speed in either direction.

For the torpedo, trash everything but, motor, pc board and the red-white-black wires.
White wire is not needed.
Unsolder motor from board and add 2 wires in between them. For moving motor around and making tube small O.D. .
Plug R & B go to a Lithium button battery and a small REED SWITCH.
That is the key to a sealed and reliable torpedo that can be put anywhere forever and only start running when ordered.

Could work just as well on a surface ship. Destroyer firing at the Yamato. Combat warships could also use them.

This is a great thread.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/5/2006 11:24 PM

cyclops2

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I can still get small REED switches. $.29 ea.

I will get busy on a fixed timer to control the total running time of the torpedo after activation.

How far are you in the summer from Clayton, NY ? It is at the junction of Lake Ontario and the St. Lawrence River.

< Message edited by cyclops2 -- 3/6/2006 1:44 AM >

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 2:50 AM

Captain Nemo12

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Cyclops, glad you like the thread!

Wow, I've never seen a timer-based torpedo, interesting! The reed switch is a very good idea. Coincidentally, I have one of those in an old Typhoon model of mine. But the thing is, a reed switch has to be activated by a magnet of some sort, I imagine an electro-magnet should do the trick.

However, I've considered the idea proposed by HMS Sinkalot on the previous page of this thread (post #71). In his post, he proposed a launching method of making the torpedo tube watertight and extending the electrical connection outside the torpedo's hull. By allowing water into the tube, the connection would be completed thus launching the torpedo. Of course this all depends on the correct water conditions. I imagine pond or lake water would work well.

But now consider this:

Step #1: Instead of making the torpedo tube water tight, how about just making a section of the torpedo water tight instead? The section would have the electrical connections contained inside.

Step #2: Next, drill a hole right above this section that's big enought to fit a rubber cork of some kind.

Step #3: To launch the torpedo, simply glue a hook to the cork and use a servo to pull it out of the hole, this would allow water to flow into the compartment, thus completing the circuit.

Here's a drawing to clarify the whole idea:

P.S: Cyclops, I'm planning a trip to Ottawa this summer (about a 3 hour drive away), so Clayton should be double the distance. The SubCom Ontario Chapter is the closest RC-sub club to where I live, since there are no clubs of that sort here.

Attachments

Click to see fullsize image.

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< Message edited by Captain Nemo12 -- 3/6/2006 2:55 AM >

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 3:54 AM

cyclops2

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Captain . If you want a rock solid start-stop of the torpedo in the tube with NO timer and NO connections to the torpedo let me know. I can scan the parts and places for parts to have you running in 1 week.

Button battery-- reed switch-- motor-- magnet. DONE.
Magnet is NOT in the torpedo, servo controlled on boat.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 6:44 AM

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Yeah when i read this i googled on reed switches... basically like a Hall Effect sensor eh?

But i immediately had an idea how to make a torpedo start on command, completely sealed. In fact i had two different styles.

One:
The switch is on the bottom of the torpedo, but inside it. Using a NC switch thats open because of the magnet. When the torpedo is in the tube, the magnet inside the sub (on a servo arm) keeps it off, by opening the circuit. When you move the servo far enough so the magnet no longer holds the switch open, the motor starts to turn and your torpedo should launch.

Two:
Same torpedo as above. The entire bottom (inside the sub) of the torpedo tube is lined with magnets. As long as the torpedo is in the tube it will be off. Now to launch all you need to do is push the torpedo out of the tube. Anything you like can do it... even a shot of air if you fancy. Once the torpedo exits the tube the motor turns.

The second method could be used for surface craft as well... roll the torpedo off the side and it turns on, etc... Since they can't flood the tube very well.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 3:52 PM

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That should work well, use a magnet to keep the reed switch in the off position while in the hull.
My experiments with CO2 cartridges and a paintball marker regulator had excellent results. Your torpedo will travel better than 2m underwater before the electric motor is even needed.

http://www.pneuaire.com/lowwasu34wav.html - has excellent solenoid valves for this purpose, cheap and small 12v power supply needed though.

https://palmer-pursuit.com/ecom/product_info.php/cPath/22_42/products_id/268?osCsid=c79e69a4114f316aac199879730e5af4
- is the regulator I used, 1500psi in, up to 0 - 300 out (the valve can handle only up to 140+ so you should also use a guage)

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 4:55 PM

Captain Nemo12

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Cyclops, sent you a PM.

Gorgok, that's some cool brainstorming!

You guys should start putting some of these ideas to work if you want a running torpedo by summer! I think I'm gonna make two types of torps, one with the setup mentionned in my last post and one with a reed switch installed... just to see the difference.

u69, thanks for your suggestion! But I really want to experiment with electric torps to see how well they run, a safer alternative I think.

< Message edited by Captain Nemo12 -- 3/6/2006 5:01 PM >

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 5:57 PM

cyclops2

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The props will run right out of a submerged tube, PROBABLY.

If there is no timer, they will run right out of site. 1/4 mile or more. Pool firing, no problem.

Timer is needed for my expenses in ponds and bigger waters.

We will need small props. May have to cut them from tin or sheet copper to get adjustable pitches for motor watts to be OK.

Servo motors are in small sizes and have a pressed on gear that will allow a small Sugrical tube to connect to a prop shaft with ease.

How small can we go in torpedo diameter for the popular scales ?

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 6:14 PM

u69

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Pager motors, less than $1 each 6mm in diameter.... lets you go as small as you like. Batteries and timer will be a problem... the only batteries that I could find to fit inside a 1/72 scale torpedo are hearing aid batteries. no idea how to put a 555 timer in there.. maybe a mechanical timer?

compressed air... yes nemo 35/40 psi is a little excessive but it looks cool and safe enough (trust me it did not hurt that much) 5 -10 psi is just enough to push a fish out of the tube. My thought was to start them out on compressed gas and let the electric motor take over.

anyway - it works, I have the lauch system, but no operational torpedos, just dummies.

Also you may find problems getting a torpedo to launch under it's own power from a tube, if your tolerances are too close you may not be able to get enough water past the torpedo body and tube wall. (perforated tube perhaps?) I think it would probably work, just launch real sloooow.....

-sean

< Message edited by u69 -- 3/6/2006 6:16 PM >

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/6/2006 8:32 PM

cyclops2

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I have run down my electronic parts but I was able to get repeatable 2 second runs.

I will buy some surplus parts that are tiny and get the run time up to 60 seconds.

Then we can select any time ( distance ) for any speed of a torpedo.

I will put updates on as I do it.

Final circuit and values will be shown. A reed switch is the heart of a torpedo.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/11/2006 10:45 PM

Captain Nemo12

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Well, just came back from my Radio Shack with some new motors for my sub but no reed switch...

. Will check out my hobby shop to see if they have some.

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RE: Pen tube torpedoes? Possible!! - 3/12/2006 4:07 AM

u69

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here you go... you can get any size type you need here http://www.newark.com/ (these will show up in my 1/72 scale fish ... need those < 1mm switches ... also found bulk hearing aid batteries )

http://www.newark.com/product-details/text/CD121/72141.html
http://www.cotorelay.com/RI-23_Series.pdf

cyclops... I'd be interested in seeing your timing circuit, any idea if it is possible to create a "fixed period" circuit without the use of a timer IC?? - simply won't fit in the torpedo body.

-thanks
-sean

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