LMH 116 questions

LMH 116 questions (Full Version)

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Gravityisnotmyfriend -> LMH 116 questions (2/13/2005 11:12 PM)
I just came across the opportunity to buy a LMH 116 for what I think is a good price. The heli is completely assembled and includes everything but the radio and any instructions. Assuming that everything is in good condition, what do you guys think is a good price for this? The engine has good compression, and the glow plug is good. All the linkages seem to do what they're supposed to, but I have no previous experience with helis. I can fly them quite well on the G2, but I'm sure the real thing is considerably different. There is a guy in our club that I can talk to about helis, but all of his are .30 and .60 size, and probably different from what I have here. So, what do I need to get this thing in the air? I have a computer radio that is heli capable. I'm assuming that I'll need four small servos, reciever and battery. Any suggestions to the size and power of the servos? What do most people use? If anyone has or knows where I can get a manual, that will probably solve most of my problems. Thanks, Nick

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 manual (2/13/2005 11:19 PM)
OK, I found the manual on litemachines' website, so don't worry about that part. Here's the questions that I can't yet find answers for: What kind of servos do I need? Size? torque? What reciever? Do I need a micro or will a standard work? Battery? Do I need small AAA cells, or do I need a standard reciever battery for balance? What is this setup worth and what can I do to see if it's in good shape? Thanks, Nick

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/14/2005 4:19 AM)
After further research I've answered all the questions myself with the exception of the price. If you came across a lmh 116 without radio gear and with no knowledge of it's history, what would you pay for it? Everthing appears to be in good shape. If I put a drop of fuel in the carb and attach a glow starter, it will fire. Whatta think?

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/14/2005 7:06 AM)
Well, if everything is in good used condition, and your buying an assembled 116 without anything besides heli and motor you probably won't want to spend more than $150.

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/14/2005 6:11 PM)
Thanks for the reply. I took the heat sink and glow plug off and looked in the cylinder. The piston is shiny, like its brand new. On all of my other engines, the piston gets black after awhile. I doubt that is engine has been run much - if at all. The guy is asking much less than $150, so I think I'll take it.

MajorTomski -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/14/2005 6:39 PM)
The only drawback to the 110/116 line of LMH heli's is the Norvell engine. The latter production batches had a ceramic based liner that was prone to fail IF it overheated. The solution is to just keep it rich and run 20% ntiro. If his engine is clean, he may not have run it at all.

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/15/2005 7:14 AM)
You'd probably do well to pretend it was new and run it rich for a few tanks.

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/15/2005 8:11 PM)
I was planning on breaking it in whether it needed it or not. I did find one other problem, though. I pulled the washers out from under the head to find out how many there were and thus decide on what fuel to burn. It appears that one of the washers is damaged. It looks like it was put in there crooked and the head was tightened down. What fuel % would I run with just one washer? If its not recommended to run with just one washer, where can I get replacements? Are these a special Norvell part, or can I find replacements elsewhere? Thanks, Nick -edit I just found the Norvel site. I can buy 5 glow head gaskets for $2.59. Is that what I'm looking for? They just look like metal washers to me, can I get these at a harware store, or is there something special about them? It's not the price I'm worried about, I just don't want to wait for shipping. Also, I really don't want to pay $8 in shipping on a $3 part.

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/16/2005 6:13 AM)
Do you have a place to buy norvel glow plugs? They come with a washer... I hear you about the shipping costs. Ever since I moved to germany I don't fly my LMH nearly as much because I hate paying almost $8 extra when I need a part that costs $5.... Anyhow, if the engine is as new as it seems, it probably won't run well (if at all) with one washer. If it does run, it's still likely it won't even idle. Can you salvage the washer? I've kinked them before and still had them work ok.

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/17/2005 6:01 PM)
I tried to salvage the washer. I straightened it and put it back in, but it was kinked pretty bad. I guess I'll have to wait and see how/if it runs.

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/18/2005 5:55 AM)
The copper is pretty soft, it might work out. Good luck.

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (2/28/2005 6:39 PM)
Apparently the washer works. I just got the little engine running. I only ran it about a minute, but it runs really well. I just gotta put in an order for servos and a receiver and I'll get this thing in the air!

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/1/2005 7:10 AM)
Good deal, keep the spinning side up! [;)]

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/7/2005 5:29 AM)
I got all the parts for my LMH and its almost ready to go. I was just wondering what to do about the receiver antennae. I know that it's recommended that I get a stiff whip antennae, but I really don't want to cut up my new receiver. I've seen helis with the antennae wrapped around a small stick that's attached to the skid. I know that doing this will affect the range, but how much? I know I don't need near the range for this that I do with my fast planes. I figure that I will probably always have it within a few hundred feet of me. So, does everyone use the whip antennas, or is there another way?

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/7/2005 9:36 AM)
I use my whip antenna... If you go the stick on the skid route you should range check it (something you need to do no matter what antenna you use), I'm pretty sure that you could still get outta-sight range from that setup. You really can't fly the LMH too far anyways because it becomes pretty easy to loose orientation. I'd guess the longest range practical would be 200 yards or less. I personally never really have the need to fly that far anyways, I find the best flying is the agressive flying within a couple hundred feet or so... Cheers, Rico

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/9/2005 1:56 AM)
I took care of the antannae problem- for now. I decided that it would be wise to fit this heli with a training landing gear before the first flight. I used the standard sticks with plastic balls. I just routed the antannae out to one of the balls and back to another. That took up enough slack so there is no danger of getting it in the rotors. I went out to the field today to test out my new wireless video setup for my Dazzler. It was pretty windy, but I thought I'd throw the LMH in the car just in case. After getting some good videos, the wind had calmed down. I figured that it was as good a time as any. The little engine fired right up, but after setting it on the ground, the rotor wouldn't come up to speed. The set screws on the rotor gear weren't tight - easy fix. I fired her up again and this time everything seemed to be working. I gave a little throttle so I could see if the controls were set up right, and it jumped off the ground! I thought I would need alot of throttle to get airborne. This time, I gave a little less throttle, and everything seemed to be moving in the right direction. I brought it up a few feet, brought it back down and trimmed. After doing this a few times, it became apparent that the tail rotor wasn't doing what it was supposed to. A quick reverse on the transmitter and she was good to go. After a few test hops, I finally got the courage to get up more than a few feet. I took it up as high as about twenty feet, the sim training kicked in and I flew a couple laps around the field. I did have one hard landing that broke the rear of the crutch where the rear of the skids attaches, but a little five minute epoxy took care of that. I gotta say I'm impressed with this little heli. I was giggling like a little girl all afternoon. I'm gonna need alot more practice to get good, but I'm looking forward to it.

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/9/2005 6:56 AM)
Sure is fun, isn't it?! You'll get used to the lag between throttle inputs and lift pretty soon. I let a friend who only had sim experience fly my LMH, he was doing OK, but chopped the throttle too quickly and didn't have time/altitude to have the RPM build up again and ended up crashing it. Luckly the only thing that broke was the subrotor. Cheers. Rico

Dot-RCU -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/9/2005 10:28 PM)
Since it's your friend who is going to pay for the damage he caused... right [;)] replace it with matts subrotor made out of CF, I think you really have to work it the next time to wreck that part you can find it at ballistictechnology..

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/11/2005 8:55 AM)
That happened quite a while ago. It was the first time the OEM ever broke in over 5 years of owning the LMH. Yeah, he paid for it, and felt really bad about it too. I replaced it with the OEM subrotor. I didn't know there was a CF version at the time, might have had to milk him for it, If I did know. [;)]

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/14/2005 2:10 AM)
I got some issues. I broke the fuel tank nipple. The heli seems to be pretty old, because the tank seems brittle. I have a 2 oz dubro tank that fits right where the stock tank fits. I fueled it up and got it running, but the rotors wouldn't get up any speed. I started it again, held on to the rotor, and gave it a little throttle. It doesn't seem like the clutch is engaging at all. I took the clutch apart to see if anything was broken on the inside, but there was nothing on the inside. I thought that there'd be some springs or something. Is the clutch just made up of the two parts? Does the inside part just flex and expand with centifical force to engage the outer part? If that's the case I probably know the problem. I did spill some fuel onto the clutch when I switched the tanks. The oil in glow fuel seems to lubricate clutches well. So - my questions are: 1 is there anything else to the clutch, or did I just lubricate it too well for it to work? 2. Is there anything wrong with using a dubro fuel tank? Thanks.

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/14/2005 9:56 AM)
In regards to the dubro tank, go for it. I'm pretty sure there have been threads on it in the past you could search for to get some details. I still have the stock tank, and never tried the dubro, so I can't be much help there. About the clutch slipping.... That's all there is to it. You've got a clutch bell which is the outer shell that rides on the engine shaft and has the pinion teeth, and there's the clutch shoes which are one piece. It should look like a disk that has an S shape cut into it so the shoes can expand and grip the inside of the bell. I can't really imagine that the fuel could cause the clutch to slip so much that there was no grip at all, but stranger things have happened.... You're on the right track to fixing it though. Also, this is way out there, but check to make sure the clutch is secure with the crankshaft of the engine.

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/14/2005 9:46 PM)
Thanks for the suggestions. The problem turned out to be that the engine mount bolts were loose. The engine shifted just enough to not engage the main rotor gear very well. I got her back in the air today and the dubro tank seems to be working well.

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/15/2005 1:51 AM)
I learned two valuable lessons today. #1. A stopped tail rotor makes for a very exciting flight. #2. Leaking fuel tanks make for a very frustrating attempt to fly. After I got the engine situation under control, I came in the house posted the previous post and headed to the flying field ( I tested it briefly in the yard, but there were too many shiny cars for me to be comfortable). I got to the field, she fired right up and I was flying. I was thinking too myself how cool helicopters are when mine starts spinning around the rotor. At first I thought, huh, pirouettes look pretty cool. Then, I thought, wait I'm not doing that! I gradually got off the throttle and it came down. It hit pretty hard, but didn't break anything. I got to looking at it and it appeared that the set screws for the tail rotor gear had loosened. I really should take this thing completely apart and reassemble it with plenty of locktite. Since I bought it pre-built, I wasn't the one to make sure that everything was tight. So, after a quick tightening, I was back in the air...briefly. The engine started to sound lean and lost power. I brought it down and turned the needle valve out. The engine had power again and I was back in the air....briefly. The engine got lean again, and I repeated the first step. Finally the engine wouldn't run at all. When I went to try to start it, I noticed fuel dripping from somewhere. Turns out that I mounted the dubro tank a little low and it was rubbing against the clutch bell-housing. It cut a nice little hole in the tank. Luckily I have another tank, unluckily, I had to pack up after only two perilous flights. I got the new tank mounted and mounted higher. It has plenty of clearance from any spinning parts, and the higher tank should mean better fuel flow. Hopefully this will be the end of the bugs.

KLRico -> RE: LMH 116 questions (3/15/2005 7:57 AM)
Sounds like you just had "one of those days". I think everyone gets em. Don't let it get you down.

Gravityisnotmyfriend -> RE: LMH 116 questions (4/6/2005 2:06 AM)
I finally got all the bugs out of my LMH and was actually getting pretty comfortable flying it. The problem is that on the last few flights the tail rotor would suddenly stop spinning and would usually result in a pretty hard landing. I figured out the tail rotor issue, but all those hard landings have left my stock crutch looking like splinters held together with epoxy. I wanted to buy an aluminum upgrade, but they're alot of money for what you get. Since I'm a pretty handy guy, I just bought a piece of 1/8" aircraft aluminum and am in the process of making my own. The only problem I for see is mounting the landing gear. I don't have the equipment to weld aluminum so that's out. I'm thinking I could bolt a couple pieces of L channel on each side at the bottom to mount the gear. If anyone can think of a lighter way to go I'm open for suggestions.

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