Safe Flying?

Safe Flying?
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Safe Flying? - 4/24/2005 7:11:41 PM

Sharpy01

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From: Kenora, ON, CANADA
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I've read, with some amusement, a discussion on RCCanada regarding safe flying practices and the National legislation of safety.

Can773 suggested that he would prefer that only time a plane is allowed over the runway, would be during landing or takeoff and that all other manouvers should be out beyond the far edge of the runway?

What do you think?

Besides the obvious problems with enforcing "distance" and national rules that can't possibly accomodate the wide variety of airfield setups spread across the county...........

...........Personally, I think you may be missing the purpose of modelling for most when you are satisfied with watching "precision" flying at that distance? It's boring.

Everyone I've met with staying power in the hobby has an interest in "real" airplanes and their history. They love aviation. Even though they are flopping around with a 3D model or surgically flying a pattern-like ship, they have their favourite era or specific plane from the "real" world that they would rather be flying or watching fly. It's the same reason that most would rather go to Top-Gun or Hartness' estate than go to a pattern event.

Bottom line, I wouldn't want to see the warbird or cub or Extra limited to the "far" end of the runway because ultimately, most are trying to fly the illusion of reality, they would rather be in the cockpit of the real bird, but can't so we settle for the next best thing...
...........and are willing to take some perceived risk to see that Warbird up reasonbly close, roaring down the runway, instead of performing the "perfect" figure eight out where you'll never accomplish getting that tingly feeling we have when our favourite bird roars by.

IMO

Post #: 1

RE: Safe Flying? - 4/25/2005 1:15:09 PM

Jim_McIntyre

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You're scaring me Marc ... I agree wholeheartedly.

Substitute 'the warbird roaring down the runway' with a classic biplane, blipping the throttle, sideslipping in for successive 1 point touches on alternating wheels and I'm there.

Why do pattern flyers fly so far away anyway? Are they ashamed of the appearance of their aircraft or, worried that they can't fly well enough to fly in close while remaining safe?

(edit for grammar)

< Message edited by Jim_McIntyre -- 4/25/2005 1:19:42 PM >

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/25/2005 3:06:50 PM

can773

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From: Calgary, AB, CANADA
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quote:

Personally, I think you may be missing the purpose of modelling for most when you are satisfied with watching "precision" flying at that distance? It's boring.

I for one count myself lucky to not fly at the same field as you then.....wouldn't want to bore you with my precise, safe flying style....

I am comfortable with my flying, as is anyone who flies at the same field as I do....I am happy to know that it wont be me who causes the next RC plane caused injury.

If my flying is so boring to watch why is it that every time I takeoff people stop what they are doing and watch?

quote:

and are willing to take some perceived risk to see that Warbird up reasonbly close

If you want to take on some personal risk go for it....dont impose it on others at the same time as well.

Anyways, there are no rules around this.....and I dont plan on proposing any.....IMO indoor flying is the area that needs the most safety attention. Those at my club are safety conscious and make smart choices....the majority dont fly over the runway unless they are the only ones on the line.

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Chad Northeast

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/25/2005 3:56:55 PM

Jim_McIntyre

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quote:

ORIGINAL: can773
... why is it that every time I takeoff people stop what they are doing and watch?

I've noticed the same reaction when someone with a questionable safety record takes off.

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 1:12:18 AM

Ed Smith

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From: Brantford, ON, CANADA
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In that whole discussion about Pilot stations and the endless suggestions about how to make a simple barrier, one discipline was completely ignored. Those of us that Pylon race stand in the middle of the course at one end and fly around ourselves. Now before everybody starts to jump up and down shrieking in horror, consider this. Rule book Pylon Racing has a safety record second to none.

quote:

...........and are willing to take some perceived risk to see that Warbird up reasonbly close, roaring down the runway, instead of performing the "perfect" figure eight out where you'll never accomplish getting that tingly feeling we have when our favourite bird roars by.

If you really want a tingly feeling, get into Pylon Racing. Four airplanes coming around the #2 and #3 pylons fifteen feet away and going 170mph with engines screaming at 24,000 will supply all the tingles one can handle.

I know, I know, different tinglers for different folks.

Ed S

(in reply to Sharpy01)

Post #: 5

RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 4:37:28 AM

Sharpy01

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From: Kenora, ON, CANADA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_McIntyre

You're scaring me Marc ... I agree wholeheartedly.

Substitute 'the warbird roaring down the runway' with a classic biplane, blipping the throttle, sideslipping in for successive 1 point touches on alternating wheels and I'm there.

Why do pattern flyers fly so far away anyway? Are they ashamed of the appearance of their aircraft or, worried that they can't fly well enough to fly in close while remaining safe?

(edit for grammar)

.....careful, there are penalties associated with agreeing with me.

Chadwick, my good man...............I wasn't taking a shot at your flying ability. Your missing the point............again......

For everyone I know, it is not about executing perfect manouvers, or striving to beat the Chip Hyde's of the world. I would suggest that it is really quite rare that members get involved in the hobby to "be the best they can be"

It's about aviation. It's about looking up each and every time, no matter where you are or what you are doing when any kind of plane goes by. Even though you know it's just another Airbus at 40,000 ft, you have to look up................try and identify it and then imagine what it would be like to be at the controls. It's about your wife reaching for the steering wheel when the car passes near an airport.........any airport.

To you, it's a video game where you try and follow some perfect template and hope to impress a judge so you can win so it doesn't matter that some clown wants to impose his personal safety vision on others who don't want to fly in accordance with strict "box" parameters. Face it man, even Hyde, Solemenzini and the like with a pattern ship flying a sequence out beyond the edge of the runway are Boring. Give them a big extra and let them dangle in close and now they are interesting.................................. but that said, the minute a big warbird......or bipe........ fires up, it's time to move the Extra, turned helicopter out of the way. Yeah, we all want to be better model airplane pilots, but that's not why we are there.

As for safety? I've made it to the big 40 in a world full of daily dangers and would still rank getting to work or pushing out a stubborn dump as waaaaaaaaaaaay more dangerous than a low pass down the runway.

(in reply to Jim_McIntyre)

Post #: 6

RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 6:13:07 AM

can773

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From: Calgary, AB, CANADA
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Marc

Did you start this post about safety or to just take shots at me, you really have no comments in your post about safety? You have fun your way, I will have fun my way.....so now just go away.

< Message edited by can773 -- 4/26/2005 6:19:14 AM >

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 2:17:20 PM

Sharpy01

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From: Kenora, ON, CANADA
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........and with that, you concede the above points.

The main point is that life is not without risk and to try and impose, legislate, micro manage more rules based on your pereception, or any other individual person or group/club's perception of safety isn't practical and isn't needed.

Fly safe and have he kahunas to stand up and confront individuals who are doing something unsafe at the time it happens. You may also want to make an effort to understand why the rest of us would rather watch that spitfire......or tigermoth.....make that low pass down the middle of the runway, than that perfectly executed figure 9 through a set of binoculars.

If you try, you may even expand your narrow opinion.

(in reply to can773)

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 2:43:02 PM

can773

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sharpy01

........and with that, you concede the above points.

The main point is that life is not without risk and to try and impose, legislate, micro manage more rules based on your pereception, or any other individual person or group/club's perception of safety isn't practical and isn't needed.

Fly safe and have he kahunas to stand up and confront individuals who are doing something unsafe at the time it happens. You may also want to make an effort to understand why the rest of us would rather watch that spitfire......or tigermoth.....make that low pass down the middle of the runway, than that perfectly executed figure 9 through a set of binoculars.

If you try, you may even expand your narrow opinion.

I am not legislating or proposing anything.....

As to your attempts to make me see what RC modelling is all about....please give me a break Marc. I have been doing this for 15 years, I was flying sport planes and scale models long before I became involved in pattern.....I dont do it to impress you or anyone else.

My wife and I go to the field together everyday to practise, she knows more about flying than most of the other flyers do.....we get to spend a ton of time together and I never hear complaints from her about how much money I spend.....to me thats what this is about....not about what type of model I fly or what type of flying I do.

Different strokes for different folks....if you cant understand that concept then I think its you with the narrow opinion.

While you are cruising the net surf on over to

www.f3acanada.org

and join the hundreds of others who are supporting us by purchasing a raffle ticket and T-shirt

I know you would be proud to own one.

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 5:43:31 PM

Sharpy01

Posts: 600
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From: Kenora, ON, CANADA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: can773

I am not legislating or proposing anything.....

Chad, you suggested that all flight, except takeoff and landing, should be done off runway. You may not be making a motion at an AGM, but you are floating the idea.......some us disagree.

quote:

ORIGINAL: can773
.....I dont do it to impress you or anyone else.

That's NOT the impression your writing gives us. Perhaps you need to think through your postings a bit more before tapping the keys?

quote:

ORIGINAL: can773
My wife and I go to the field together everyday to practise, she knows more about flying than most of the other flyers do.....we get to spend a ton of time together and I never hear complaints from her about how much money I spend.....

another fundamental difference..........I tell my wife that most of the enjoyment in the hobby is that there are very few wives out there?

(.....that is a joke...............................kinda)

quote:

ORIGINAL: can773
Different strokes for different folks....if you cant understand that concept then I think its you with the narrow opinion.

Read what I write. The point is not to establish a pile of rules because each flyer, club, region are different. Allow them to look after themselves........................we don't need big brother.

quote:

ORIGINAL: can773

and join the hundreds of others who are supporting us by purchasing a raffle ticket and T-shirt I know you would be proud to own one.

I don't want to. My budget (or lack of it) is tight and a gallon of fuel is better money spent for me at this stage of the game. Sorry, but good luck.

(in reply to can773)

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 7:38:27 PM

reo

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From: Millet, AB, CANADA
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I've been watching this thread with interest over the last few days and have decided to wallow into this discussion. After 30 years in the hobby and well over 20 in the industry I have found that most fellows in RC for the long haul have their favorite part of the hobby (be it scale, IMAC, jets, pattern, heli and lately electric indoor or outdoor) and think that their choice is the most interesting part of our great hobby. This is fair and we should be happy that not all of us are interested in the same thing because this brings variety to our industry and hobby.

I have heard my choice in the hobby (turbines) referred to as 'the top of the food chain in RC' by one individual a while back in these forums, an arrogant quote that makes me feel quite uncomfortable, because I don't feel that way about the jets at all. We are just another part of this hobby that utilizes technology that just happens to be different, I truly hope that this does not give the perception that we are ahead or above anyone else in the RC world.

I have watched with interest over the last number of years what the guys heavy into electrics are dabbling with and it nothing short of amazing compared to what electric technology was even 10 years ago......the same goes for the helis these days as well. Maybe they could make the same claim, but they don't.

I think it may be time to lighten up here, the fellow flying his simple trainer should not feel that he needs to land because there is a jet, pattern airplane, heli or whatever else starting up to go flying.....he is as much part of our hobby as the rest of us regardless of what we choose to fly.

Just my opinion, of course.

Ron Oscar

(in reply to can773)

Post #: 11

RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 7:41:50 PM

can773

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From: Calgary, AB, CANADA
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quote:

Chad, you suggested that all flight, except takeoff and landing, should be done off runway. You may not be making a motion at an AGM, but you are floating the idea.......some us disagree.

Thats fine, I am not asking you to agree with me. I can voice an opinion same as you....I dont agree with yours and you dont agree with mine....leave it at that.

quote:

That's NOT the impression your writing gives us. Perhaps you need to think through your postings a bit more before tapping the keys?

I write the way I write, feel free to read whatever meaning and context you will from it......

quote:

Read what I write.

Unfortunately I did read it...you wrote something directed at me about pattern being boring and that I should learn and I quote

quote:

I think you may be missing the purpose of modelling

Not really sure how my

quote:

missing the purpose of modelling

relates to safety

Your entire set of postings on this thread has had little to do with safety and more to do with me....I am flattered though that you think about me that much.

Anyways, back to it...

quote:

The point is not to establish a pile of rules because each flyer, club, region are different. Allow them to look after themselves........................we don't need big brother.

Ok, I never said establish more rules....just change definitions.

quote:

I don't want to. My budget (or lack of it) is tight and a gallon of fuel is better money spent for me at this stage of the game. Sorry, but good luck.

$5 for a chance at a prize worth more than $1200...that must be one tight budget....or is it that you despise FAI teams and everything about them...

Anyways, if you wish to discuss safety fine.......but you are wasting my time, your time and everyone elses time who reads this trying to convince me that I dont "get" the hobby.....and really is it that important to you that I follow your ideals? You dont see me trying to convince you to come fly pattern.....

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Chad Northeast

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RE: Safe Flying? - 4/26/2005 8:24:51 PM

Jim_McIntyre

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From: Claremont, ON, CANADA
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Interesting point Ron,

We have similar years experience, although I focused on scale but lately have found myself drawn to helis and electric and do have a couple pusher 'jets' in my stable.

I do attend many events and I don't see too much of the elitist attitude you refer to.

Yes, there are a few 'personalities' (

) but, I don't attribute them to the discipline they enjoy but, to the individual flawed personality.

There's plenty of room for everyone. I think everyone, especially anyone involved in safety committees should get out and experience other disciplines. I've enjoyed and/or participated in Free Flight, radio assist, SAM, Soaring, Control line etc. all of which would not benefit from (read; be hindered by) the latest round of rules.

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Post #: 13