Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at fly-ins?  
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All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> RC Warbirds and Warplanes >> Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at fly-ins?
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Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at fly... - 1/1/2002 12:39:33 PM   
Fighterpilot



Posts: 445
Joined: 12/20/2001
From: Kenner, LA, USA
Status: offline 		Let's start the new year off right and find out if any of you guys have a problem with so called IMAC pilots hovering over the runway or in the flight path of other aircraft that are flying the proper pattern. I've seen a number of near misses when pilots flying warbirds make their pass upwind at the edge of the runway only to encounter an IMAC type aircraft hovering on it's prop right smack in front of you. This is not only dangerous to ones aircraft, but could be dangerous to your health if your airplane is involved in a mid air collision and goes out of control. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how this can be controlled without hurting anyone's feelings are causing the equivalent of WWIII. at the next fly-in. Why, I've heard one guy offer to pay for the aircraft that flies through one of those hovering beasts and buy the pilot a steak dinner. Come on now, that's not nice.
       Post #: 1

Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at fly... - 1/2/2002 7:39:12 AM   
budcop



Posts: 237
Joined: 12/10/2001
From: Gray, TN, USA
Status: offline 		Hey Fighterpilot, sounds like things are getting hot at your flying site, at our field we also have the aerobatic aircraft that hover and helicopters, jets, control line, power gliders ect. Most pilots I think will agree on one thing, none want to loose an airplane, I would suggest that a discussion at your club meeting or one called at your field to clarify any misunderstandings, a review of safety rules, and to encourage everyone to get along, the hobby will be more enjoyable for all ......
Bud........

_____________________________

Bud Williams
AMA 1651

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 2

Re: Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at... - 1/4/2002 11:19:16 PM   
Hossfly



Posts: 3842
Joined: 12/3/2001
From: New Caney, TX, USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Fighterpilot
Let's start the new year off right and find out if any of you guys have a problem with so called IMAC pilots hovering over the runway or in the flight path of other aircraft that are flying the proper pattern. I've seen a number of near misses when pilots flying warbirds make their pass upwind at the edge of the runway only to encounter an IMAC type aircraft hovering on it's prop right smack in front of you. This is not only dangerous to ones aircraft, but could be dangerous to your health if your airplane is involved in a mid air collision and goes out of control. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how this can be controlled without hurting anyone's feelings are causing the equivalent of WWIII. at the next fly-in. Why, I've heard one guy offer to pay for the aircraft that flies through one of those hovering beasts and buy the pilot a steak dinner. Come on now, that's not nice. [/QUOTE]

IMO, unfortunately any one lacking the self discipline, the courtesy, or simple respect for others, that performs this method of *flying* is not going to stop unless the CLUB takes action and IMO that individual deserves whatever *hurt feelings* he gets.
Our Club has a rule that states: "Pilots will not hover aircraft over the runway when fixed wing aircraft are flying."
Choppers can do as they wish with only choppers flying, but not when fixed wing are in the air, and the rule says *AIRCRAFT* therefore the hovering BS doesn't happen when others are flying.
The loophold is that a FW could hover with a chopper in the pattern and the chopper could not, but then those two can go at it among themselves!!! HAR -- HAR!!


HC

_____________________________

Horrace Cain.
AMA Life L-93, Leader and CD for 45 years
Official Candidate: AMA Ex. Vice Pres. Vote H. Cain. Help move AMA into 21st Century
The only source of knowledge is experience. Albert Einstein

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 3

Hovering - 1/4/2002 11:47:09 PM   
L454S



Posts: 354
Joined: 12/18/2001
From: Gonzales, LA, USA
Status: offline 		Hossfly, were you there at Bomber Field in Sept. with all the grumblings and growlings about this. I was and must have been around and in about 3 different pilots "meetings". Saw a lot of ruffled feathers, but Bob and BB were in a difficult position. We were told not to worry ,that this type of conflict would be avoided in the future.

_____________________________

From the swamp, Lenny ....Bayou Boys R/C
http://www.eatel.net/~l454s

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 4

Hovering Aircraft in the traffic pattern - 1/7/2002 6:18:54 AM   
Jack Devine


 

Posts: 314
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Kirkland, WA, USA
Status: offline 		This is a hot button for many pilots on both sides of the fence and there is room for everyone to enjoy this Hobby. Common courtesy and basic flight rules are there for everyone and in order to avoid bad scenes that never seem to settle anything I agree that the club officers should be bringing this up and developing workable solutions and above all enforcing the decisions that are made. I don't have any problem with a guy hovering his plane as long as it does not interfere with other traffic or planes that are flying. AMA IMAA and other regulating and insuring organizations clearly adopt basic flight rules in all of their documentation. They are there for a reason and the reason is safety. As models continue to get bigger and faster the potential for disaster is multiplied exponentially. I think a lot of good things could be done if pilots just cooperate with eachother and don't do stupid things that endanger the entire hobby. I am a firm believer in not flying my planes with other planes that have a completely different flight envelope and style of flying. When the Hover guys fly I don't and I expect that favor to be returned. We both enjoy our style of flying and neither of us have to give up anything but a little time. I really would have a problem with anyone that just decides they own all of the airspace without clearing the time with other pilots at the field that day and start the hovering stuff because they think they have the right to do it. We don't need a war here just some common sence and some cooperation.
Jack Devine

< Message edited by Jack Devine -- Jan 8 2002 12:07AM >

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 5

Re: Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at... - 1/9/2002 9:51:31 PM   
Randy-RCU



Posts: 290
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: South Western Ontario, Canada
Status: offline 		There are more NONE imac members in this hobbie doing 3D at fields by a long shot then US IMAC members

Randy Brown
Scale Aerobatic Chairman for MAAC
IMAC 1814
IMAA 22750



[QUOTE]Originally posted by Fighterpilot
Let's start the new year off right and find out if any of you guys have a problem with so called IMAC pilots hovering over the runway or in the flight path of other aircraft that are flying the proper pattern. I've seen a number of near misses when pilots flying warbirds make their pass upwind at the edge of the runway only to encounter an IMAC type aircraft hovering on it's prop right smack in front of you. This is not only dangerous to ones aircraft, but could be dangerous to your health if your airplane is involved in a mid air collision and goes out of control. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how this can be controlled without hurting anyone's feelings are causing the equivalent of WWIII. at the next fly-in. Why, I've heard one guy offer to pay for the aircraft that flies through one of those hovering beasts and buy the pilot a steak dinner. Come on now, that's not nice. [/QUOTE]


_____________________________

Randy Brown
http://www.Iflyrcairplanes.com

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 6

Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at fly... - 1/9/2002 10:32:00 PM   
CANDOO



Posts: 11
Joined: 12/2/2001
From: Wasilla , AK, USA
Status: offline 		I fly IMAC and warbirds. It seems the if someone was "hovering right in front of me" I would have the common sense to NOT make a low pass with a warbird.

There are 136 members in my club-about 30 participate in IMAC events-there are 6 (read that-SIX) IMAC members in Alaska. And not all 6 belong to my club. When you point a finger at a particular individual,please make certain of their affiliations and not just blame an entire group of wrongdoing because one individual "offended" you.

Also-there are no "hovering" maneuvers in IMAC-they are used in "freestyle".



http://candoo.rcwing.com

_____________________________

Richard
A&P,IA,FE(B727)

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 7

Hovering - 1/9/2002 10:39:32 PM   
Fighterpilot



Posts: 445
Joined: 12/20/2001
From: Kenner, LA, USA
Status: offline 		Randy,
I didn't mean that it was actual IMAC members doing the hovering over the runways. The problem exist when individuals flying IMAC type aircraft (I haven't seen any P-51s hovering lately)place both their aircraft and the aircraft of others flying a normal pattern in jeopardy by hovering over the center of the field. This is rude and dangerous behavior which will, at some date and time, cause the destruction of one or two aircraft and the possible injury to either the pilots or spectators. It needs to be dealt with at pilot meetings held prior to fly-ins and the AMA and/or IMAA should set up some guidelines; however, common sense should prevail and pilots should realize the consequences of their actions.

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 8

Re: Hovering - 1/9/2002 10:58:39 PM   
Randy-RCU



Posts: 290
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: South Western Ontario, Canada
Status: offline 		Ok..I will let you get away with this once

I have been pushing for guidelines do to safety myself and it sure gets heated up when I bring it up

I want no more flying below 20' deck except for take off and landings and crashes, and must be no closer then 100' in from the flight line

I have never seen anyone hovering myself while others are flying in the air unless they ask if its all right also..its a comman sense thing there

Randy



[QUOTE]Originally posted by Fighterpilot
Randy,
I didn't mean that it was actual IMAC members doing the hovering over the runways. The problem exist when individuals flying IMAC type aircraft (I haven't seen any P-51s hovering lately)place both their aircraft and the aircraft of others flying a normal pattern in jeopardy by hovering over the center of the field. This is rude and dangerous behavior which will, at some date and time, cause the destruction of one or two aircraft and the possible injury to either the pilots or spectators. It needs to be dealt with at pilot meetings held prior to fly-ins and the AMA and/or IMAA should set up some guidelines; however, common sense should prevail and pilots should realize the consequences of their actions. [/QUOTE]


_____________________________

Randy Brown
http://www.Iflyrcairplanes.com

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 9

Do IMAC aircraft hovering over runway bother you at fly... - 1/9/2002 11:26:49 PM   
magnum



Posts: 314
Joined: 11/29/2001
From: Huntsville, AL, USA
Status: offline 		You guys should be commended on keeping this topic nice and friendly open debate is good

I for one almost lost a plane a couple of weeks ago. Our club has a rule of no high speed low passes over the runway. So I was just passed the runway and rather high, there were 5 planes in the air. There was a lot of noise, you couldn't tell where the next plane was coming from. Then I noticed a "fun-fly" type plane hovering at my altitude in my path (Not singling out the "fun fly" guys, just to point out it a fast small plane just sitting there).

The abrupt maneuver needed to avoid a crash sent me in the only direction that was clear, the deck. Any other direction would have put the other pilots in harms way. We did not crash, but now I never go up if I know the pilots who are flying will be hovering close by and there are more than 2 planes in the air.

I have no problem with people hovering off the runway, as long as I can hear there plane. I know where they are and I can fly around them.


I believe if there are more than 2 planes in the air, hovering at low altitudes off the runway should not be allowed.

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 10

Hovering obstacles - 1/10/2002 3:04:44 AM   
Fighterpilot



Posts: 445
Joined: 12/20/2001
From: Kenner, LA, USA
Status: offline 		I had a similar situation at the September fly-in at Bomber Field. I was flying my 38 lb. Hawker Sea Fury along with a buddy flying his Yellow 80" Thunderbolt. We were flying formation (same way-same day) when a 1/4 Scale Hanger 9 Piper Cub turned out across the center line of the runway instead of going past the end of the runway to the normal location where most of the pilots were flying their right hand pattern. I didn't see him make the left turn into our flightpath until it was too late. I saw the planes apparently cross and heard a faint "whack". Next thing I saw was the tip of the left wing floating to the ground and the rest of the Piper trying to maintain level flight on its way to the ground. My Fury continued through the midair, I declared an emergency and came around, dropped gear, flaps, and landed. Fortunately, my propeller had not hit any part of the Cub and I was able to stay under power and go around for a safe landing. My only damage was a slight indentation on the left wing and yellow paint stains on the wing and top of my vertical fin. Talk about dodge a bullet. This could just as easily have been an aircraft pulling up into a hover, and as a pilot comes across the center of the flight line, the hovering aircraft suddenly appears out of the corner of his eye. There is no time to react when you're going 132 mph. You can only hope for the best and I was fortunate. This kind of inconsiderate piloting by some doesn't offend me, it scares me to death. Our planes don't go together by themselves. They take many many hours of planning and work. To lose one in the blink of an eye because of the inconsiderate actions of another pilot who shows no consideration for his fellow modelers and that flies with an attitude that he owns the sky, really sets me off. It's like when you are fishing and another boat speeds by almost running over your fishing line like you didn't exist. Talk about the urge to kill!! Let's just have a little consideration for one another and the investment we have in this hobby. It's either that, or adopt the saying that I saw somewhere else in this forum..."If it's not a warbird, than it's a target." Now that wouldn't be nice.

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 11

Hovering - 1/10/2002 4:16:47 AM   
Jack Devine


 

Posts: 314
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Kirkland, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Randy I totally agree with Fighterpilot. No one is pointing any fingers at IMAC. I have a great deal of respect for the concentration and practice it takes to master the required maneauvers in IMAC and when most of the pilots affiliated with it fly they fly by the rules. IMAC doesn't deserve the black eye here and they shouldn't get it. Most of the people who cause these types of problems do it during general flying time because they know they would never get away with it at any organized meet. I go back to what I said in my first post on this subject and that is the clubs need to find a way to enforce the rules and stop this type of behavior. It's unsafe period. And it should not be tolerated. What a tragedy it will be when something bad happens and it will happen. We are all in this hobby together and if we don't police it someone else will and another flying site will dissappear as a consequence. We sure don't have any extra one's in this area that we can spare.

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 12

Note to Candoo - 1/10/2002 5:19:03 AM   
Fighterpilot



Posts: 445
Joined: 12/20/2001
From: Kenner, LA, USA
Status: offline 		Mr. Candoo,
Do I detect a bit of ranker in your comments? Perhaps the shoe fits. Just cut the attitude and as our former president used to say, "I feel your pain."

(in reply to Fighterpilot)
       Post #: 13

Hovering over the Runway - 1/10/2002 5:59:24 AM   
Kitmaker


 

Posts: 5
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Conyers, GA
Status: offline 		I agree; it is very distractful and disturbing; to have an aircraft or a