"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!!  
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All Forums >> Radios, Batteries, Clubhouse and more >> Product Announcements & Manufacturer News >> "NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!!
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"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/18/2002 7:37:13 AM   
Larry Kramer


 

Posts: 7
Joined: 10/18/2002
From: Naples, FL
Status: offline 		I was talking with Ewald (AMT's new engineer) today and he was telling me about his latest project. A new engine (yet to be named) that is sized between the AT-180 (Mercury) and the AT-280. The engine easily produces 29 lbs of thrust at 114,000 RPM!! with cool temps. He said more testing will be done in the next few days, I'm sure he will post proper spec's when available. With this sort of performance the RPM's could be lowered for models such as the Bobcat, Hotspot etc. giving excellent fuel economy with extented engine life. This follows the same concept as the new AT-400, high thrust, low temps, low RPM's, long engine life. He said electric start will be available with air back up. Sounds like it's time to order a new "Super Bandit".
       Post #: 1

Amt - 10/18/2002 7:53:36 AM   
wd40


 

Posts: 632
Joined: 2/10/2002
From: Murfreesboro, TN, USA
Status: offline 		Do you have to send the turbine back to AMT have rpm's lowered? or can we do it?

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 2

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/18/2002 7:59:52 AM   
DavidR



Posts: 2606
Joined: 12/8/2001
From: Oxford, MS, USA
Status: offline 		Hey Larry... good to see you here! Why would you want to turn it down??? LOL

David Reid

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 3

Lower RPM's - 10/18/2002 8:45:01 AM   
MikeC-RCU


 

Posts: 107
Joined: 5/8/2002
From: Rayong, THAILAND
Status: offline 		Hi Larry,

Reducing the normal max. RPM of a turbine by a few thousand RPM will NOT have any significant beneficial effect on bearing life (assuming that correct bearings for the design RPM are being used), engine life, EGT's, OR fuel consumption.

Economic fuel consumption/efficiency is determined by many other factors, but not RPM.

regards,

Mike C

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 4

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/18/2002 9:29:42 AM   
Larry Kramer


 

Posts: 7
Joined: 10/18/2002
From: Naples, FL
Status: offline 		MikeC you are correct, I guess I mentioned lowering the thrust primarily with newer pilots in mind. AMT engine's are already known for their longevity, and with cooler running temps it will only make them better.

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 5

Re: Lower RPM's - 10/18/2002 10:49:33 AM   
sideshow



Posts: 2521
Joined: 11/29/2001
From: Pleasanton, CA, USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by MikeC
Hi Larry,

Reducing the normal max. RPM of a turbine by a few thousand RPM will NOT have any significant beneficial effect on bearing life (assuming that correct bearings for the design RPM are being used), engine life, EGT's, OR fuel consumption.

Mike C [/QUOTE]

Being able to dial down the max RPM (thrust) might, however, make the engine usable for models (that aren't equipped with a speed limiter) that weigh less than 32.22222 pounds at an AMA sanctioned club or event. :

Not to speak for wd40, but I think that's what he meant.

Bob


_____________________________

Bob Convery

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 6

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/18/2002 7:01:00 PM   
Dennis Michael


 

Posts: 47
Joined: 4/25/2002
From: Tulsa, Oklahoma USA
Status: offline 		Larry, Did he give you a time frame when the engine would be available.. Dennis

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 7

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/19/2002 2:01:03 AM   
Larry Kramer


 

Posts: 7
Joined: 10/18/2002
From: Naples, FL
Status: offline 		Ewald said it will be at least 60 days before the engine is ready for shipping. It will be extensivly flight tested along with the electric start to ensure a quality product.

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 8

AT-260 and AT-400 - 10/19/2002 2:30:12 AM   
Mercury


 

Posts: 45
Joined: 1/7/2002
From: Northfield, MN, USA
Status: offline 		I hear that the throttle response on both of these engines is almost instantanious.
David Shulman put the AT-400 thru it's paces in the BVM demonstrator sport Rafale at Superman. He performed some incredible low altitude high alpha manuevers, pushing the throttle thru broad ranges of RPM . The engine never missed a beat the whole week.
I also noticed that all the BVM "flagships" are running the AT-450s and AT-280s, Hmmmm. They put on a spectacular show every time I see them fly, which seems to be continuous. No hanger queens on that team.
Joe Grice

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 9

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/19/2002 3:03:57 AM   
Dennis Michael


 

Posts: 47
Joined: 4/25/2002
From: Tulsa, Oklahoma USA
Status: offline 		I watched BV run up the AT-400 Rafele at Superman . I payed particular attention to the throttle stick when he ran up the engine and it was almost right there. I mean when he stabbed the throttle the engine was maybe 1 second behind the stick. That is phenomenal for a turbine engine... DM

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 10

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/19/2002 3:12:21 AM   
Kevin Greene



Posts: 2675
Joined: 3/28/2002
From: Jackson, TN, USA
Status: offline 		Larry,

That is good news!!! I was looking at the AT 400 but I really didn't need that much power. How much will this new engine be in the air start version?

Kevin

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 11

electric start - 10/19/2002 3:58:30 AM   
jetpilot



Posts: 1223
Joined: 12/28/2001
From: plano, TX, USA
Status: offline 		They've been talking about electric start for a little while, any word if it will be available on the AT400? BV F100 beggin for an engine,but slod all my air tanks long time ago.
Scott

_____________________________

Scott C. Marr

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 12

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/19/2002 4:19:20 AM   
Kevin Greene



Posts: 2675
Joined: 3/28/2002
From: Jackson, TN, USA
Status: offline 		Scott,

AMT had a working electric start AT 400 at Superman....Saw it run with my own two peepers. I bought the new Eliminator from AMT this past spring. No need for scuba tanks and their hassles. I also use it to run all of my 12 volt accessories. (Field charger, AMT Auto Start, etc.) Plus, the Eliminator has a separate Festo adjustable regulator to air up your retracts.

I was extremely impressed with the power of the AT 400, but it looks to be too powerful for my needs. I'm looking forward to the new 27 lb turbine. PRICE---PRICE---What will the price be???

Kevin

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 13

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/19/2002 4:32:58 AM   
David Gladwin



Posts: 2024
Joined: 2/5/2002
From: Sydney, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		The reason AMT engines have such excellent longevity and reliability may be that the max rpm and EGT are conservative in relation to the engine build. However, reducing RPMs and therfore EGT and other internal engine temps. can have very significant benefits on both bearing and turbine disc life on engines which are operated nearer to the limits of the engine construction.

As a case in point it will be interesting to see if the reliability of the JetCat 160 can reach that of the very reliable 120. The 160 must be nearing, or has reached , the limits of what can be extracted from a basic ally KJ66 design and runs quite a bit hotter than the 120. In the interest of reliability (which has been perfect so far) I keep full throttle time on my 160 to a minimum, ie Take off and vertical manoevers. Might not be doing much but it makes me feel I am doing something positive about engine longevity !

All the fullsize commercial engine manufactures highly recommend minimising operations at full power in the interest of reliability and component life. That is why almost all airliner operations use graduated thriust on take off, ie just enough thrust for the weight and conditions on the day

Despite the higher operating RPM of model jets (about 10 times greater than fullsize) I cant see why the benefits of reduced RPM operations shouldnt help the reliability of most model jet engines.

Ot perhaps I have just been brainwashed during my flying career and old habits die very hard !

BRG,
David Gladwin.

(in reply to Larry Kramer)
       Post #: 14

"NEW" AMT USA 27lb+ Turbine!! - 10/19/2002 4:46:27 AM