Help me with component choices for Corona (Full Version)

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TMASTER -> Help me with component choices for Corona (8/5/2005 7:33:45 AM)

Hello, I've been out of the heli game for about 4 months now, and I'am done with micros for a while. As for flying I only can hover tail in and sideways. I also can do mild FF, with some sloppy figure 8's. I'm really thinking about going with the corona. The Trex was my other option but i think ill crash it too much and its not as large. I want a larger bird. I'm not ready for inverted so CP doesnt matter.

As for my setup i have some questions.
I have a polks seeker 6, and a GY240 gyro, CC-35 esc so far. I'm really thinking about selling the CC35 and going with a jeti esc. Ive had to many glitch problems with castle creations controlers, even using ferrite rings. But these esc's were on micros so the components were close together. I want to go brushless to start, I guess im spoiled on the power with my micro helis that are brushless.

Recomendations from Corona owners needed

1. which Jeti esc, or other?
2. What brushless motor?
3. What battery packs? 8cell or 3cell lipos?
4. Hitec HS-81 servos, or other?
5. what mods do i need right off to have a nice flying heli? flybar?
6. List of the places I can order parts and upgrades from?

I would really appreciate some help on these things if its not too much to ask :)
feel free to pm me or email me if needed :)



gadget01 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/5/2005 12:51:15 PM)

Hey Tmaster

I'm just getting started in helis myself. My first bird is the Corona 120, from HeliHobby.com. I have it pretty much set up stock until my main rotor belt-drive conversion and titanium main rotor shaft mod arrive. The direct-drive (with gears) is too noisy for my taste and from what I've read, belt-drive is the superior way to go anyways. The spring-steel main rotor shaft bends too easily. I have slapped my Corona into the wall a couple of times and bent my shaft (insert Beavis & Butthead comment here). Now the heli vibrates like hell. My cheapo piezo gyro sucks a big steamy donkey turd because it won't keep the tail from jittering all over the place. I have noodled with the gain settings over and over and I can't make much progress, so I guess I'm gonna have to shell out the chips for a bad-boy gyro from JR or Futaba. Any recommendations on this subject would greatly be appreciated. I'm using Hitec HS81MG servos and they seem to do the job nicely.

The stock aluminum tail shaft bends pretty easily too, so I think a carbon tail shaft and belt-drive will be my next mods.

I set mine up brushless from the start, with a MultiPlex 480/4D with BL-37 ESC combo. I'm running a 3-cell 2100mAh ThunderPower LiPo which gave me 18 minutes of hover time yesterday. I am not using the BEC. I use a separate NiMh pack for the receiver/servos to help extend run-time. The manual for the M480/4D motor recommends a 2-cell LiPo, but it handles the 3-cell just fine. It's definitely warm after a run though. A heatsink will be added soon to try and extend its lifetime. One thing I hate about the controller is that when the voltage dips below the cutoff point, it cuts the motor off completely. To recover, you have to drop to idle to re-arm the motor and then power back up. This has dropped my heli to the ground a few times. Is this typical of brushless controllers or am I crazy to use this particular one?

Some websites that offer Corona upgrades:

http://ballistictechnology.com/products.html

http://www.chopper-1.org./

http://www.helihobby.com/html/corona_helicopter.html

http://roffeetvhobby.com/corona.htm


What micro helis are you flying? I'm seriously thinking about a Piccolo Pro to start doing 3D stuff and then move on to a T-Rex. Fixed pitch might be easier to set up, but it kinda sucks since you constantly have to vary the motor speed to maintain a hover, which contantly varies the tail-rotor speed, which constantly changes everything. It could be that they cancel each other out, but I don't think so.

later




Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/5/2005 3:45:29 PM)

Gadget,

Can you program your ESC for soft cutoff?

FFW.



Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/5/2005 4:17:04 PM)

Tmaster,

I like my Corona so much I have two! I'll prolly sell one if you or Gadget wants it as I fly a lot of gas.

I use the CC35. Works fine. Just keep it away from the motor & rx. I am using the Mega 16/15/4 in one and 16/15/3 brushless motor in the other. What battery packs? 8cell or 3cell lipos? You're choice! What do you have laying around? What's easier to get? What costs less? Are you worried about safety? You might fine a little more time and better flying characteristics with Lipos since they're lighter. In that area I suggest PolyQuest 2200-2600 3s packs. Use cell balancing plugs and charger.
itec HS-81 servos are fine! No mg for tail as metal gears & gyros sometimes hae problems. Stick with GY240 or 401's. They're great!
As for what mods do you need, I think the most important are, carbon flybar, corbon tailboom with belt drive, titanium main shaft, & JR Voyager landing gear adapted to the frame. I like the ECO-8 swashplate for the Corona as it removes slop in cyclic.

FFW.



TMASTER -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/5/2005 7:04:46 PM)

Thanks guys, well lim kinda on a budget right now. Have you guys heard of the MTM and Aruora brushless motors? they have 400DH, 400DF, 450TH sizes. 15-20amp motors for like $45-50 new. www.justgofly.com I was thinking about using one of there motors to save some money otherwise the mega motor sounds good.

Lipos don't cost much more then the nimh packs ive seen. Nimh 3300mAh 8c pack was like $85 on helihobby, and the TP-2100 3s are only $75, polyquests 2600 packs were $87 i found for the slim version. I guess lipos are the way to go, unless there are way cheaper nicd or nmih out there, with a good capacity.

Looks like the two big upgrades are the main shaft and the belt drive, those are a lot $$$ !
I've been experimenting with drill bit main shafts from high speed steel and cobalt steel, they are the best and never bend.
But it looks like theres other components in the main shaft kit for $61. Are these needed as well?



gadget01: Don't bother with the smaller micros, go for the T-rex! It's a way better machine then any of the HB, piccolo..etc. I'd stick with your corona for FP flying, and Trex for the CP. 450XL CDE model is the new model. Parts are cheap and even the CNC parts. The Align company really did a good job on this heli.



TMASTER -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/5/2005 9:47:52 PM)

can you adjust the pitch angle on teh Corona's blade grips?



C62dy -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 12:22:35 AM)

You can only change the blade grips. I believe 2, 4, and 6 are all that are offered. The most popular, and the ones that I use are 4's.

I have the hacker c40-12t w/40/3p on one and mega 15/16/3 w/cc35 esc on the other. The mega is just fine for starters and performs very well with no problems. I use 7 cell gp3300 packs.

I fly one stock, only with ve landing gear, and the other has belt tail & main, carbon boom, and 5mm ti mainshaft.

I enjoy flying them both. I will get bigger packs, and go to lipo sometime.

fly em' and have fun

Jer



gadget01 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 12:50:00 AM)

Apparently, the MultiPlex ESC does not have a soft-cutoff setting. I'm thinking I need a different ESC. Why can't it just beep at you annoyingly when cutoff voltage is reached so you can control your landing? Don't they know that you cannot autorotate the Corona? I wish I knew this stuff when I initially went to order my parts. Where is the noob's guide to buying parts for your first electric heli? What do you need for a lipo that has the voltage balancing connector and how is that used? Is it only used for charging? Buying expensive parts that don't work for the application is really annoying. It seems like learning this stuff the hard way is a right of passage or something. Like, "oh, that sucks that you just smashed $500 in parts against the wall... sucks doesn't it? Now, here's what you SHOULD have purchased."

Oh... and why are good gyros so damned expensive??? Is having a digital servo for the tail/swashplate worth the expense? If they are, what are good digital servo choices for the Corona?

Thanks for humoring my questions.



TMASTER -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 1:18:28 AM)

How good is the main shaft upgrade kit? Will the shaft bend on a crash? THey make a 7mm kit too for a little more. The balistic place has lots of upgrades all at a hefty price!! hehe. What should my first mods be to the heli? I mean if im going to be spending $70 on a main shaft kit it better be the last one I have to buy!!!! even if i crash a lot!!!

Heres my projected setup so far:

corona 120
cc35
mega or equivilant motor
gy240
3 -HS81's
Polks seeker 6
carbon flybar
+4 angle grips
Better gear box
belt drive kit


What do you guys think about all these upgrades that are available? What is a must have? I 've so much bad luck with all my Micro heli's that I want this one to be right. I've spend 80-90% of the time working on my micro helis and trouble shooting them with little results in flying... :(



gadget01 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 1:34:36 AM)

The Corona comes with a pair of 4 and 6 degree blade grips. The construction manual actually says to use one 4 degree and one 6 degree.... apparently for an overall effect of 5 degrees. This seemed really odd to me, but it hovered ok that way. I later switched to 4 degrees on both and it improved hover stability since the rotor speed went up.

The main shaft kit is probably the most important upgrade IMO. The slightest tweak in the shaft (sounds like a personal problem) results in sloppy performance and wears out everything, esp swashplate bearings must faster from the added vibration. I suppose the only reason that Lite Machines even provides the spring steel shaft with the kit is because the bigger titanium shafts are quite a bit more expensive and they wanted to keep initial kit costs down. The stock shaft works fine until you crash it... then it wobbles, almost guaranteed. I tried to hammer it straight again with limited success.

Your setup list looks good to me. Apparently, metal gear servos are not good for tail use, so avoid that.

Some good setup info on the Corona I just found:

http://www.helihobby.com/html/corona_tips.html



Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 6:16:00 AM)

The single most important upgrade to do first that I can think of would be main shaft & subrotor.

Here's some build pics to frool over.

[;)]





TMASTER -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 6:22:56 AM)

nice!!!! what servos are those? And which swash is that?



Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 6:41:22 AM)

You don't want to know!

I spend way too much money on my heli stuff!!!!!

The swash is the Eco-8 $80, & the servo's are Multiplex digital Hi-Torque $100 each!

Trust me. Just start out with the titanium main shaft & sub-rotor & belt drive for the tail & you will have a great heli!!!!!!

FFW



TMASTER -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 7:03:11 AM)

hey which polyquest packs are you running? The make 2 different packs that are 2600 and 3s. One is real cheap $58 and the other is $85 and its longer...?
What pinion are you running with the mega 16/15/3 and the stock main gear?

Yep i Think ill start out with the flybar, belt drive, gearbox, and main shaft kit, and landing gear mods.
chopper1's or balistics gear box?

Also can you explain the grips pitches and the blades?(2 4 6) I see 13x0 and 10x5 blades on helihobby. I'd like to run like a 2000-2200 rpm headspeed if its possible. Maybe im getting ahead of myself on all this stuff, but I want to have it all priced out and ready before I jump in!

Thanks for all the help



gadget01 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 11:43:13 AM)

The blade grips are what attach the blades to the rotor head and allow lead-lag motion of the blades. The basic kit comes with both 4 degree and 6 degree grips- once you get to that stage of construction, just use 4 degree grips for both sides, even though the manual says to use one 4 and one 6.

I don't think the Corona is all that- esp since you have to end up replacing all the core components with upgrades anyways. My next bird is going to be a T-Rex and I kinda wish I had ordered one of those to start with rather than the Corona. Lots more mod variation with the T-Rex and it's collective pitch out of the box- no $200 mod kit needed.

FarFromWerkin... that's a nice looking bird there, but it hardly resembles a Corona.



Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 8:01:17 PM)

13x0 are for electric and 10x5 blades are for the gas heli. You can run the 10 x 5 for the electric if you run the Lipos but I don't recommend for beginners.




Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/6/2005 8:07:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: gadget01

that's a nice looking bird there, but it hardly resembles a Corona.



Yeah! The only thing Corona about it is the tupperware/rubbermaid blades. It's nice t obounce the heli off things like cars, walls, trees, & just pick it up & fly again. Matter of fact it's quite comical! A buddy and I were laughing our tooshes off once when I crashed, & the spinning blades made the heli turn itself upright, & I took off again.[:D]



askman -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/8/2005 4:22:48 AM)

wait till new BT's CP upgrade for corona. you will be able to run stock style blade upto 420mm with stretch kit or corona blade if you care to. 2-3month eta. no, it is not choppa style upgrade, but rather totally new CP head. (kinda mix of new and older ideas) :)



Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/8/2005 5:22:19 AM)

Hey Askman,

What's the hot setup now with Lipos & 10" Corona blades?

What Lipo, grips, & gearing would you use with the FP BT Corona all belt drives & Mega 16/15/3?

Thanks.




FrostyTheBeerMan -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/9/2005 4:45:31 PM)

Hi Ron,

Can you explain why you say that ? ... I've read some stuff about those "lipo" batteries and it seems if I understand correctly they can explode ?
is this why you are suggesting to stay away from them ?

thanks in advance for any education [:D]


quote:

ORIGINAL: Farfromwerkin

13x0 are for electric and 10x5 blades are for the gas heli. You can run the 10 x 5 for the electric if you rnu the Lipos but I don't recommend for beginners.






Lifes a Drag -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/9/2005 5:55:24 PM)

Yes I say to stay away from Lipos if you’re a beginner because you should start with something a little less dangerous. With Lipo cells you better know what you are doing. You can be injured or cause a fire if you discharge them improperly, charge them improperly, or set them out in the sun and cause them to heat up too much. And I'm not talking about a little smoke, fizzle, pop! I'm talking liquid fire everywhere in a 10 ft. radius!

One of my friends burned down half his house, and I know of a few people who have burned their cars to nothing! Not funny stuff at all.

[:o]



gadget01 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (8/10/2005 4:04:48 PM)

There's nothing wrong with a beginner using LiPo battery packs as long as they are properly educated and understands the risks associated with them. LiPo's are a huge advance in battery technology that should not be recommended against anyone, given the mental capacity to properly handle flammable materials. Many of the care techniques for proper LiPo handling apply to NiCd/NiMH packs anyways.




gadget01 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (10/29/2005 11:38:05 PM)

I have since installed the 7mm main shaft mod, the hyperdrive belt-drive mod, the crazy case and belt-drive tail rotor mods and switched over to using a Futaba GY240 gyro. This heli still does not fly all that well. The new heading hold gyro helps, but with power changes causing such abrupt torque inputs, the tail still wags. Does anyone have any really good detailed info on how to set up the tail on this bird- what servo works well, which mounting hole on the servo arm to use, what kind of expo rate to use on my JR8103 radio for the yaw control, etc. I think I'm still doing something wrong otherwise the tail would stay pointed the way I want.

I am really disappointed after spending all this cash. The pitch-up tendency after getting it into forward flight sucks. The hyperdrive belt drive has proven difficult to set up well as belt-tension is very critical. I was bringing my Corona down and needed some power to slow down the descent rate when the belt started slipping. It went down only hard enough to tweak out the stock aluminum tail boom, but I since ordered the carbon fiber tail boom for it. Where are the tail boom supports that you see on other "real" helis? Does anyone have any info on installing a tail boom support mod?

I have been considering the collective pitch head for this damned thing, but for the price they're asking I can get into a whole new heli. I wish I had never bought a Corona now and had just gone for a CP Hummingbird instead. I am starting to wonder if just selling my Corona is a better plan than doing any more mods to it.

This is my first heli and maybe I'm just suffering noob issues.



Pilotx1 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (4/9/2006 9:47:48 PM)

Ive got a corona with a Hacker c40-12t that flys admirably on my 7c 3300mah nimh pack, I get about 9 mins of flight if im careful. My friend just bought a corona and put a Multiplex 480 4d into it and he gets maybe 1.5 mins out of my pack for flight time. He is getting 2cell Lipos with 6000mah capacity(i know ...huge). Im wondering if there might be something wrong with his motor/ESC running on my batteries causing his short flights or if its the reduced power of the 480 vs the hacker thats causing it. His ESC is the Multiplex BL-37 with a 65% voltage cutoff. Any help with this is greatly appreciated Especially about the flight ability with his LiPos as they are lighter and my packs with somewhat higher voltage.
Thanks Jason



gadget01 -> RE: Help me with component choices for Corona (4/9/2006 11:13:19 PM)

Well... fast forward a long ways since my earlier post here. After a lot more time and money spent, my Corona is really flying well... tail is rock solid and the heli does exactly what I tell it do.

The MultiPlex esc I used with my Corona back in the early day didn't work very well. It did not have a soft voltage cutoff so it would drop the bird onto the ground like a rock. I tried all the programming parameters I could, but no dice. I ditched it and got a CC Phoenix 35, which worked 10x better... all while using a MultiPlex 480-4d motor with stock pinion and 3s Lipos. I would get about 13 to 14 minutes of hover out of each TP 3s1p 2100mah pack.

I have since installed many more mods from Ballistic Tech: Collective Pitch head, 7mm titanium main shaft, billet swash, Hyperdrive v2, aluminum belt idler tail clamps, belt-driven tail, crazy case, Ballistic tail rotor, carbon tail boom, aluminum motor mount.... which all adds up to a crapload of cash spent, but it's a pretty well-performing machine that can take a serious beating and keep going.- and it's flying really well. The setup is: Kontronik Jazz 55-6-18 esc, Mega 16-15-4, 3x HS-81mg servos for ccpm swashplate, gy-401 gyro/9254 digital servo for the tail. Still using the purple aluminum crutch, but I cut a fat notch in the nose section so I could mount my lipo packs on top and still have the canopy fit, and I'm using Ikarus Eco8 landing gear. The stock LMH gear is great though since it absorbs hard landings so well. You don't need all that to have a Corona that flies well, but "flying well" is a subjective matter.

I agree with Reno... the titanium main shaft upgrade is an absolute must. I never did the subrotor upgrade- just went to the CP head, but since the subrotor upgrade has flat paddles, the Corona loses that pitch-up effect in forward flight that can possibly ruin your day.

2 degree blade grips really help too, since you will need more head-speed to hover with less blade pitch. This equates to better stability and tail control. The most likely comes at a small price of flight duration, but well worth it IMHO.



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