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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/21/2012 1:05 PM   
earlwb


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ernie Misner
Hey Hobbsy, I thought I was the only one that didn't like cowlings. They do look nice but I like to clean the engine exterior with a toothbrush and acetone when I get home..... guess they have medicine for people like me......
Ernie Misner


Clean the engine? Why? I usually don't bother much with the outside of the engine, until I need to move the engine to a new plane after it wears out the current plane.




Using a cowl is easy. What I do is use some large wide pieces of masking tape. I put the tape on the fuselage amd lay it forward over the engine. Then mark where I want the holes at for the engine, etc. Then I loop the tape back out of the way, remove the engine, then fit the cowl in place. Then unloop the tape and stick it to the cowl. Then I can remove the cowl and the marks on the tape stuck to the cowl are my guides for the holes needed.

Now this old bipe of mine uses old fashioned methods of taking large blocks of balsa and carving and sanding and dremeling until you get it shaped into a cowl., No plastic or fibreglass for the front end on this old bipe. The engine was getting pretty tired, so I did have to clean all the gunk off before I could rebuild it though.




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< Message edited by Hobbsy -- 8/23/2012 7:14 PM >

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/21/2012 1:43 PM   
lopflyers


 

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Status: offline 		Clean the exterior of the engine? I bet the plane itself is pristine then. You will have a heart attack if you fly out of grass

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/21/2012 4:46 PM   
riadh


 

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Status: offline 		Hi blw ,count me in in the Club Saito please. I think I am eligible ,I have a Saito 82 A sitting in a H9 Pawnee and flies it 100% scale like. Last week I got myself a Saito 220 which will go in a World Models Spitfire 160 ;80 inch wing span. This would be to me a new dimension to deal with as to date the 82 is the biggest engine I own. Knowing that the Club Saitos Gurus are around I am sure I wont run astray dealing with this new engine. Cheers

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 3:15 AM   
svenska3


 

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Status: offline 		I have this beautiful 125 I need to find a plane for. I'm a intermediate pilot. I don't fly 3-D. Any suggestions???

Walt

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 3:55 AM   
earlwb


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: svenska3
I have this beautiful 125 I need to find a plane for. I'm a intermediate pilot. I don't fly 3-D. Any suggestions???
Walt


Just about any .60  size plane would work with the engine. Even the .60 to .91 two stroke size planes would work. A Great Planes Escapade might be a good choice as it can handle a wide variety of engines. But you have many choices to fit your desires in that size range.




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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 3:59 AM   
Cougar429


 

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Status: offline 		Earlwb, I found a better method of marking cowls for motor cutouts a while ago.

I had originally used stiff cardboard and working slowly carved the opening to fit over the motor, then folded it away till the motor was removed and the cowl bolted on. Taping the cardboard back onto the cowl then showed the area to be removed. This was a time consuming and laborious process that many times required starting again.

Since then I found clear and stiff binder protector pages provide a much easier method. As with cardboard you provide a fold line in the plastic sheet and once taped to the fuse, hold it over the motor. Using a sharpie I can mark the area to be removed with greater accuracy the first time. Some shifting may be required to account for angles if the head/cylinder protrude a lot, but in the end it works first time and is a lot more accurate, (the edge is a lot sharper than cardboard or heavy paper).

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 8:46 AM   
rowdyjoe


 

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Status: offline 		I use semi-flexible clear plastic to make a template when mounting an engine.  I make it by cutting the plastic to the size of the firewall and finding the direct center of both.  Once the center is located it's a simple process to set the engine mount on it and mark the hole locations.  Then align the plastic pattern on the firewall and transfer the hole locations. 
It works great but, be sure to measure twice and cut once. 

RJ



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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 12:04 PM   
Old Fart


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: svenska3

I have this beautiful 125 I need to find a plane for. I'm a intermediate pilot. I don't fly 3-D. Any suggestions???

Walt

Hi walt yes i do have a suggestion.Stick the 125 in a cmpro midget mustang.They don't like flying anywhere near 3d and go like a bat out of hell keeps you focused and it's a lot of fun mate..trust me on this one

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 1:23 PM   
SrTelemaster150



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cougar429

Earlwb, I found a better method of marking cowls for motor cutouts a while ago.

I had originally used stiff cardboard and working slowly carved the opening to fit over the motor, then folded it away till the motor was removed and the cowl bolted on. Taping the cardboard back onto the cowl then showed the area to be removed. This was a time consuming and laborious process that many times required starting again.

Since then I found clear and stiff binder protector pages provide a much easier method. As with cardboard you provide a fold line in the plastic sheet and once taped to the fuse, hold it over the motor. Using a sharpie I can mark the area to be removed with greater accuracy the first time. Some shifting may be required to account for angles if the head/cylinder protrude a lot, but in the end it works first time and is a lot more accurate, (the edge is a lot sharper than cardboard or heavy paper).


My Wingsmaker (World Models) 1/5 Piper J-3 Cub came W/a clear plastic cowl layover to do the engine cut outs.

It would be nice if all models came W/one of those.

I'm thinking that one could use a 2 liter bottle shrunk over the cowl to make a similar layover for smaller cowls.


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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 5:20 PM   
CH Ignitions


 

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Status: offline 		My first Saito was the FG20 in 2009.
Now I have Fa 30, 45,91,125,120,150,180,220 ,Twins130, 270,300.
FG 20,30 I love the sound of the 4 stroke Saito engines, and I try to improve the performance by convert tem to CDI  glow or to gasoline.
I will like to join the club.

Thanks
Adrian

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 5:46 PM   
triumphman49


 

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Status: offline 		Welcome aboard Adrian, great to hear from you

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/22/2012 6:33 PM   
the pope


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cougar429

Earlwb, I found a better method of marking cowls for motor cutouts a while ago.

I had originally used stiff cardboard and working slowly carved the opening to fit over the motor, then folded it away till the motor was removed and the cowl bolted on. Taping the cardboard back onto the cowl then showed the area to be removed. This was a time consuming and laborious process that many times required starting again.

Since then I found clear and stiff binder protector pages provide a much easier method. As with cardboard you provide a fold line in the plastic sheet and once taped to the fuse, hold it over the motor. Using a sharpie I can mark the area to be removed with greater accuracy the first time. Some shifting may be required to account for angles if the head/cylinder protrude a lot, but in the end it works first time and is a lot more accurate, (the edge is a lot sharper than cardboard or heavy paper).


My Wingsmaker (World Models) 1/5 Piper J-3 Cub came W/a clear plastic cowl layover to do the engine cut outs.

It would be nice if all models came W/one of those.

I'm thinking that one could use a 2 liter bottle shrunk over the cowl to make a similar layover for smaller cowls.


Be nice if my world models airplane came with wings that wernt twisted like a pretzel and had the right amount of glue in the right places and even nicer if their customer service was worth a hoot ! Cheers the pope

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 1:26 AM   
SrTelemaster150



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quote:

ORIGINAL: the pope


quote:

ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cougar429

Earlwb, I found a better method of marking cowls for motor cutouts a while ago.

I had originally used stiff cardboard and working slowly carved the opening to fit over the motor, then folded it away till the motor was removed and the cowl bolted on. Taping the cardboard back onto the cowl then showed the area to be removed. This was a time consuming and laborious process that many times required starting again.

Since then I found clear and stiff binder protector pages provide a much easier method. As with cardboard you provide a fold line in the plastic sheet and once taped to the fuse, hold it over the motor. Using a sharpie I can mark the area to be removed with greater accuracy the first time. Some shifting may be required to account for angles if the head/cylinder protrude a lot, but in the end it works first time and is a lot more accurate, (the edge is a lot sharper than cardboard or heavy paper).


My Wingsmaker (World Models) 1/5 Piper J-3 Cub came W/a clear plastic cowl layover to do the engine cut outs.

It would be nice if all models came W/one of those.

I'm thinking that one could use a 2 liter bottle shrunk over the cowl to make a similar layover for smaller cowls.


Be nice if my world models airplane came with wings that wernt twisted like a pretzel and had the right amount of glue in the right places and even nicer if their customer service was worth a hoot ! Cheers the pope



Maybe you should have bought it from Wingsmaker. They have spare parts in stock, but my Cub looks perfect aside from a small pinhead drop of epoxy on the top cabin window. (not enough to worry about IMO)

$179 shipped too. Can't beat that.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 1:31 AM   
N1EDM



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Status: offline 		Hi everyone,

I dropped my Saito .82 into my H9 Cub and flew it today with a 14x6 prop and 10% nitro. The plane seemed to leave an awfully heavy smoke trail - more than normal. After I brought it down, I started to hear mechanical sounds in the engine.
At first I was wondering if the valves were out of kilter but they seem OK. The engine hasn't got that much time on it and it hasn't been abused.

I haven't pulled the head off to inspect the piston but I might. Being a Cub, I was being pretty easy on the throttle, by the way.

I was also considering that it might be the LSN setting, but am not sure.

Before I go tearing into things, I was just wondering if anyone else has encountered this and where I should be directing my diagnostics

Thanks,

Bob


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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 1:33 AM   
rowdyjoe


 

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Status: offline 		More on the overheating problem ....
I tried the 13x8 prop thinking I could get more RPM and less load on the engine.  Well, that was wrong as the 14x6 turned 9400 vs 8800 for the 13x8.  I left the 14x6 on and started from at the factory needle positions ...I was evidently missing the step where your supposed to adjust the high end again after adjusting the low end.  As it turned out, I was running the low end far too lean and it was definately affecting the high end (duh).  I have a steady idle at 2000 to 2100 rpm and a WOT RPM at 8800 RPM.  I tuned it a bit rich to keep it cooler in the hotter weather.  
I havn't run it yet with the cowl on and that will be the acid test.  I've added one more baffle to direct the air flow over the cylinder.  It's a piece of stiff but, flexible clear plastic protruding perpendicular from the middle fo the cowl to force the air over the cylinder rather than blowing past it.  I'd take a picture but, you wouldn't be able to see it because it's clear.
I didn't close off more of the grill I installed an actual baffle to direct the air.

Hope you can make sense out of what I said. 

RJ



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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 2:22 AM   
Cougar429


 

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Status: offline 		I did and it sounds like you are working in the right direction.

N1EDM, do you know your top end RPM? It may keep the RPM down with the larger diameter prop, but I find the Saito chart a bit on the aggressive side and also when working the larger diameters in their chart the torque effects when doing 3D are more pronounced.

The heavier smoke trail usually indicates a richer mixture. I don't have any problem running mine that way and except for a bit more mess actually prefer it that way to ensure good lubrication.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 2:41 AM   
N1EDM



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Status: offline 		Hi Cougar,

I didn't tach it but she seemed to be up there with normal RPM. She was just breaking into a 2-stroke scream before I backed her off. She survived the pinch test OK but I could not lean her out much after that.

I know enough to suspect that compression might be an issue but she feels pretty good and, as I said before, she hasn't been abused. So far, the only thing I've done is to pop off the rocker arm covers and check the play. I also realize that in a 4S, the LSN has a greater influence on the midrange (correct me if I'm wrong, guys) but I didn't touch that because the engine was running OK. Plug was an OS Type F, by the way.

Any other ideas from anyone???

Thanks for the reply,

Bob


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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 3:10 AM   
blw



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Status: offline 		Bob,

A large smoke trail on a Saito usually indicates a lsn set too rich. The lsn controls something like 75% of the throttle. You may find some nice things on your 82 if leaned out. 


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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 3:18 AM   
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Status: online 		Ok Garry, since the HS needle has a fixed seat its best to set the HS at full peak and leave it there while adjusting the LS needle, this eliminates one variable You always want the LS needle a little on the rich side when the setting the HS needle the first time, Once the ZLS needle is set, it will be a long time before it needs attention again if ever. A too lean LS needle renders the HS needle ineffective.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 4:14 AM   
frets24


 

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Status: offline 		Who here has experience with the FA-200Ti?

I haven't ever needed a glow driver with any of my Saito twins or any singles when inverted; Just wondering if maybe I should plan on using the McDaniels on this one since it will be inverted when mounted and the single carby twins seem to run rich on one cyl or the other. All of my -R3's need a driver at low rpm on at least the lower left cyl(front view). Have been told that's common....have yet to hear different.

Also how smooth is it? It's an offset crank twin which typically provides the smoothest operation on an opposed set-up but how does that translate to inline/vee type configuration. Always loved the Saito's though the 91s was so vibratory I had to shelf it 'til I find a more suitable air frame for it. Shook the gunsight off its mounts and the pilot bust loose on too numerous occasions. Hoping the 200Ti isn't inherently similar.

And lastly; any tips on proping this thing for the best performance on a 14lbs Zero (72")

TIA




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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 4:28 AM   
Cougar429


 

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Status: offline 		I'm a bit surprised your 91 was so bad. Mine is extremely smooth with either 2 or 3-blade props.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 5:52 AM   
frets24


 

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Status: offline 		I had replaced the bearings and the ring (Frank bowman ring) immediatly upon receiving it (used) even though it felt great and looked perfect inside and out...just my normal MO. Came from an estate and appeared to have very little, if any time on it at all. Definitely no damage.

The thing runs great...lots of power; just a lot of vibration at 3/4 thru full throttle. Same with several props; 2 blade various mfgs and 3 blade Graupners.

Probably going on a .60 Super Sportster on floats...The vibes won't be an issue there.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 6:08 AM   
rowdyjoe


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hobbsy

Ok Garry, since the HS needle has a fixed seat its best to set the HS at full peak and leave it there while adjusting the LS needle, this eliminates one variable You always want the LS needle a little on the rich side when the setting the HS needle the first time, Once the ZLS needle is set, it will be a long time before it needs attention again if ever. A too lean LS needle renders the HS needle ineffective.


OK Dave,  I understand what you're saying and I have learned more about the relationship between the two today.  The LS is still rich as is evident by the pinch test at idle (rpm rises when pinched).  There's a lot of smoke when transitioning to higher rpm and there's a light smoke trail at high rpm.  I don't know if that's an indicator of anything other than the amount of lube that's in the fuel.  I'm using 30% nitro/23% lube heli fuel at the moment.  The engine seems to like it but, it sure smokes a lot.  One or two neighbors may have thought my garage was on fire but, nobody called the FD ...thank God. 
I'll put the plane on the run-up bench again tomorrow and see if I can reach a better setting between the two.  At the moment, transition is smooth, idle is OK, and high speed is good with no excessive heat.  However, I don't think I left the HS needle at max. rpm while adjusting the LS.  I'm pretty sure I adjusted it about 500 or 600 rpm down from peak and then adjusted the LS.  I'll try to correct that tomorrow.

Thanks again,
Garry




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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 6:16 AM   
Ernie Misner



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Status: offline 		Ohhh I won't sleep well after seeing that dirty engine. Don't they run better when they're clean and shiny?

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 7/23/2012 8:35 AM   
jamesroutledge


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Fretts

I had a similar problem losing cylinders on an inverted 200ti. I then mounted it upright on a 120 Ultrastick and ran a couple of gallons of fuel through it.
It now behaves inverted with no onboard glow.

James

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